Shooting at nurse's college in Tuscon, AZ?? - page 7

I am watching FOXNews and they just reported they have received a "bulletin" about a shooting at a nursing college in Tuscon. They will break in more more news as they get it. Two women have been... Read More

  1. by   tattooednursie
    JMP! Suzy K! Stop fighting please. This is about the people who died in arizona, not whether to keep guns ot of the hands of people or not. It is that moron that shot those people!!! Its not the guns fault, its his fault. The gun didnt decide 'hey, I'm gonna kill these people' Its not worth fighting over. No offense, but were here in allnurses.com to support eachother if I am correct.
  2. by   l.rae
    originally posted by nurs4kids
    if these four had been killed in an auto accident, i guarantee you there would be not one person here arguing that cars should be banned. drunk driving kills more than guns..are we arguing that alcohol should be outlawed?

    , i will never give up my right to own a gun. sane people do not kill other people unless in self defense. do you honestly think this guy would not have killed had he not had a legal gun?? puhlease. it's easier to get an illegal weapon than it is to get a legal one...and you can do very little to control illegal weapons...
    other than use your legal weapon to defend yourself.

    my heart goes out to the friends and families of the victims..
    a sad...very sad.

    eloquent..............
  3. by   rncountry
    abrenrn, the thoughts that you expressed are the ones I keep coming back to also. I too, had an instuctor from hell, and 11 years later I wouldn't piss on her if she was on fire.
    Did anyone else get that the shooter was an LPN already? He apparently got through school once, what happened this time around?
    And Suzy you have a point, what is it is our culture now that has so many mass shootings? It is too easy to point to video games, TV etc... It is my belief that it has more to do with the idea that one can do whatever one wants whenever one wants. I see too many kids my children's ages that have no manners whatsoever. I can't even express how much that annoys me. It is not just kids either, there are plenty of adults who wouldn't know what decent manners were if they slapped them in the face.
    I also would like to say to Shay that the point I was trying to make was that I didn't feel a debate on gun control belonged in this thread. I sincerely had wanted to go to this thread express how upsetting this is. Not to debate gun control. Perhaps I am feeling very sensitive right now. There seems to be so much tragedy right now. Of course the terrorist acts of 9/11, the bombing in Bali, at least one person every day dead in Israel or the Palastinine areas, the sniper in DC, the hostages in Moscow, the 16 month child that was killed in Grand Rapids MI two days ago because someone punched him hard enough in the stomach to cause internal bleeding. The deaths of three nursing instructors and the suicide of the killer, the people they leave behind. I didn't watch the news tonight, I even turned off NPR on the way home from work, I rarely do that. I sincerely wished that this thread did not have to go into the gun control debate. Maybe an exam of nursing and it's stressors, God knows we have them. Maybe the sadness that this type of episode causes, but not gun control.
    I still remember being absolutely stunned the day Columbine happened. I had the day off and had not turned on the TV, my parents came over and my dad started talking about it, I had no idea what he was referring to so he turned the TV on to CNN and I watched a kid crawl out of window and fall a couple stories trying to get out. Swat teams all over. It was as if I were glued to the living room floor. And now I hear similar things and it has become "oh, another one." But this one---this one hit a little closer to home. I would wager there are many allnurses members out there that can think of at least one episode in which they have been physically threatened while providing nursing. I have, not once, not twice, but several times. I would wager many of us also have been in nursing school with students we wondered how they were allowed to continue in the program. Not to mention like I started out with, instructors who made a students life a total misery.
    Perhaps this is all part of the new "normal". Maybe it is a normal reaction to first think of our own safety in terms of "if someone tries something like that with me or mine, I'll kill kill them first and therefore I must have my gun". Instead of how sad and how awful that we feel this way to begin with.
  4. by   mario_ragucci
    Lol, when are privately owned guns ever successfully used defensively? When was the last time you heard of a "woman murdering a potential rapist", or a family "that killed an intruder?" Guns are OFFENSIVE weapons. The only time I can think of a gun as a defensive weapon is laying down grazing fire from a machine gun. Other than that, guns are instraments of death. Right?
    people may own guns and proclaim to be familiar with them, however, they are no match for people who REALLY know what a gun is for, and are not afraid to use one. Average people aren't trained to kill. Just because you have a gun don't mean you can kill. And if you branish a firearm "defensively", I can assure you a smart opponent will kill you as fast as they can, which is pretty quick when all you gotta do is aim and shoot.

    :chuckle
  5. by   lisainaz
    The killer sent a letter to the local newspaper explaining in his view why he killed. The newspaper received it Tuesday. "A Letter From the Dead". It is published in today's edition of the newspaper. I read the letter, and my impression is that he sounded like a totally self-centered megalomaniac who had a distorted idea of his importance and how others should respond to him. Totally selfish and unwilling to admit he failed or was wrong. According to him, he was always right, and others were always wrong. Sickening.

    I just deleted the link to the letter because I think the killer does not deserve to be heard after his killing spree, and I think printing it in the newspaper in its entirity is an insult to the victims' families. The killer says terrible things about the professors. The professors cannot respond. They are dead. Also, printing this in the newspaper gives other potential killers the message that they will gain attention and become famous after their actions. That is not a good message.
    Last edit by lisainaz on Oct 30, '02
  6. by   Q.
    Originally posted by mario_ragucci
    Lol, when are privately owned guns ever successfully used defensively? When was the last time you heard of a "woman murdering a potential rapist", or a family "that killed an intruder?"
    Well, in answer to your question, Mario, it seems Oct 15, 2002 was the last time "woman murdered a potential rapist."


    Man shot Thursday morning identified by 6 female victims

    Tuesday, October 15, 2002

    By Jonathan D. Silver, Post-Gazette Staff Writer




    Police Chief Robert W. McNeilly Jr. announced yesterday that all six female assault victims had identified Daniel Wesley, 25, of Homewood, as the man who attacked them during a two-week rampage.

    Wesley was wounded early Thursday morning when an off-duty University of Pittsburgh security guard shot him twice in the abdomen. He remained in UPMC Presbyterian yesterday, where he was arraigned. Bond was set at $300,000 per case, meaning he would be required to post $1.8 million to secure his release.

    Police said Charmaine Dunbar, 42, fired her licensed .357-caliber revolver in self-defense on a Homewood street when Wesley came at her with a rifle, possibly intending, they said, for her to become a seventh victim.

    Although results have not yet come back from DNA testing that would conclusively link Wesley with the assaults -- police have retrieved DNA samples from the attacker in at least one case -- investigators felt confident enough to charge Wesley with 23 offenses, including two counts of rape and three counts of involuntary deviate sexual intercourse.

    The victims, who ranged in age from 14 to 33, picked Wesley out of a photo array.

    "We believe that he's responsible for all of these," McNeilly said. "We were all deeply concerned ... We took this just as seriously as the shootings down in Washington, D.C."

    McNeilly's presence during an afternoon news conference at the Police Bureau's investigations branch in East Liberty underscored the gravity police accorded a case that left women in the East End on edge.





    City police Chief Robert McNeilly Jr. talks about East Liberty assault suspect Daniel Wesley, 27. Wesley is a suspect in six assaults. (Darrell Sapp, Post-Gazette)

    For several nights last week, undercover officers fanned out through the eight- to 10-block area in which the serial stalker had been active, hoping to catch him. He had already struck six times, police revealed yesterday; until then, only five assaults had been mentioned.

    The newest to come to light occurred around 8 a.m. Oct. 4 in the 800 block of Mathews Way in East Liberty.

    Two of the assaults ended in rape, a third in forcing the victim to perform oral sex. The attacks had steadily grown more violent since they began Sept. 25. During the last one Oct. 8 at Rippey Street and Selma Way in East Liberty, the attacker put a gun to the victim's head, choked her until she passed out and then raped her.

    Some detectives were so zealous to catch the attacker that they pulled voluntary overtime shifts. Even Assistant Police Chief William Mullen joined Sgt. Edward Eckle of the sex assault squad on the street one night.

    Detectives had precious few leads to go on other than four composite images of a suspect that were based on interviews with the victims.

    The first public hint that police might be onto a suspect came Friday night, when the special detail of officers was abruptly canceled without explanation.

    A day earlier, hours after Wesley was shot, detectives had begun to stitch together similarities between the attack on Dunbar and the other six attacks in East Liberty, Garfield and Highland Park.

    In all the cases, the suspect came up on a female victim from behind. He would try to make conversation, albeit in unsettling ways. His height, weight, build and age were consistently described in the same terms. And he either made threats with a gun or showed a firearm.

    Police believe the attacker might have gotten wise to the undercover officers and shifted to a different part of the city, which led to Dunbar's encounter.

    Police said Dunbar ran into Wesley at 4:04 a.m. Thursday when she took her dog for a walk on North Murtland Avenue. A man approached from behind, pointed a rifle at her and told her to stand there while he shot her.

    Dunbar pleaded for her life and ran away, screaming for help. A police officer escorted her home and took a report. Dunbar went out about 90 minutes later for a walk. This time, she carried her gun. The same man came up behind her as she walked up a hill. At the top, he pulled a .22-caliber rifle from his pants, pointed it at her and asked, "How would you like me to shoot you?"

    Dunbar fired in response.


    By Thursday night, as Wesley was lying in the hospital under the fake name of Jerome or Jevone Prunty that he had given police, detectives had managed to link the rifle he was carrying with the weapon used in the Oct. 8 assault.

    That victim told police that the gun was definitely the same, pointing out a jagged part of the rifle where she said her attacker had struck her. Investigators found dried blood in that spot on the gun, though it was not known whether it was the victim's.

    Also, the victim told police her attacker said his name was Alfred. Detectives traced the stolen rifle back to its owner in East Liberty, whose home had been broken into. His name was Alfred.

    As of yesterday, detectives were still trying to determine Wesley's motive. He has been in trouble with the law before -- specifics were unavailable because courts were closed for Columbus Day -- but apparently not for sex-related offenses.
    Unless you would have preferred a 7th victim, rather than having this woman armed?
    Last edit by Susy K on Oct 30, '02
  7. by   sjoe
    Presumably she'll aim a bit lower next time.
  8. by   LasVegasRN
    Originally posted by lisainaz
    The killer sent a letter to the local newspaper explaining in his view why he killed. The newspaper received it Tuesday. "A Letter From the Dead". It is published in today's edition of the newspaper. I read the letter, and my impression is that he sounded like a totally self-centered megalomaniac who had a distorted idea of his importance and how others should respond to him. Totally selfish and unwilling to admit he failed or was wrong. According to him, he was always right, and others were always wrong. Sickening.
    I read it and totally agree with your comments. I wish he had survived and really suffered the consequences for his actions.
  9. by   Q.
    Originally posted by sjoe
    Presumably she'll aim a bit lower next time.
    Assuming she's still allowed to own a gun.
  10. by   Q.
    Originally posted by lisainaz

    I just deleted the link to the letter because I think the killer does not deserve to be heard after his killing spree, and I think printing it in the newspaper in its entirity is an insult to the victims' families.
    I would appreciate it if you would post the link again. Reading it yourself, commenting on it, and then taking it away so I can't form my own opinion is annoying, to say the least.
  11. by   LasVegasRN
    Originally posted by Susy K
    I would appreciate it if you would post the link again. Reading it yourself, commenting on it, and then taking it away so I can't form my own opinion is annoying, to say the least.
    I'll be the bad guy and post it:

    Link to Letter
  12. by   Q.
    Originally posted by LasVegasRN
    I'll be the bad guy and post it:

    Link to Letter

    :kiss

    Tanks!
  13. by   lisainaz
    Hi Suzy,

    Yes that was annoying of me. I should have deleted my entire post instead of just the link.

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