Shocked At Nurses Actions Tonight - page 6

I work part time at a local SNF / rehab faciliety. On PM and NOC shift it is staffed with 3 or 4 LPNs and one RN charge nurse (tonight it was me). One of our LPNs is a sweet young girl from a very... Read More

  1. by   HappyNurse82
    Quote from ZASHAGALKA
    The key difference between us and 'them' is that we are not intolerant of others simply because 'they' are different than us. And the we and us I refer to include a hardy number of muslims.

    My opinion wouldn't change because I'm saavy enough not to blame a whole group of people based on the actions of a few. It's a good thing Christianity isn't judged that way in this nation, or I'd be in trouble.

    If all you learned from your service to our nation was hate, then you learned nothing about the principles you fought to uphold. The oath you swore on induction to the service was about a different principle altogether.

    And that principle? It's the difference between us and 'them'.

    ~faith,
    Timothy.
    Tim..no offense, but I won't have this debate with you now..or ever. I will respect you as a person, but you aren't me, you won't get it until it is you. It's not hate..it's not anger. You can preach all you want, and sing in feilds of daisies all day long, that's fine, I'm happy you can do that. I've been on the border of Turkey and Iraq...interesting...the freedom fighters that come in defense of the Iraqi's. (And having to triage a man, you know would shoot you if his arm wasn't blown off, now that's a wonderful memory)
    All I can say to you, I guess...May God's peace and blessings be upon you

    But I won't debate personal matters.
    Last edit by HappyNurse82 on Nov 24, '06
  2. by   BrnEyedGirl
    [FONT=Franklin Gothic Medium]PMFB et HappyNurse I thank you both for your service to our country.
    [FONT=Franklin Gothic Medium]PMFB you did the right thing. I can't believe this will even be an issue on Monday (other than the obvious nursing shortage). What this nurse did was wrong on so many levels. One must wonder why she is even a nurse, no matter where she is from! I can understand a nurse not participating in activities that are directly in conflict w/his or her own religious beliefs. The large catholic hospital in our town won't allow tubal ligations to be preformed in the facility, our JW nurses refuse to hang blood, but will still care for the pt! If they chose to only care for JW pts, they would rarely have anyone to care for! What this nurse did is not the same thing at all.
    [FONT=Franklin Gothic Medium]I often care for pts that are drug addicts, alcoholics, etc. that are rude, obnoxious, and usually very difficult and time consuming to care for. Most of them are "repeat customers" and are being treated for self induced illnesses. Almost none of them have health insurance and many of them do not appreciate or even want the care I give. But you know what, I do it anyway. I am a nurse. I chose to be a nurse. I take care of sick people. White people, black people, purple people, smart people, stupid people, nice people, rude people, people who have committed crimes......people, human beings who need my care. It is what I chose to do. It was what I was educated to do. It is what my license mandates I do. If you don't want to care for people, don't become a nurse.
  3. by   caroladybelle
    Quote from PMFB-RN
    I just know, if there was a case on my floor involving an islamic individual, and I could safely refuse the pt. or switch out, I would...if I couldn't, I'd have a hard time with it personally. That's just me. I'm sure a jewish nurse might have a problem treating a self-proclaimed nazi as well...are we going to turn her into the BON as well ?? (This actually has happened at work on my shift before..Jewish gal..sweet as pie, pt. big ole' swastika tattoo).

    *** I think your analogy is all wrong. In my view a better one would be a nurse with a big ole' swastika tattoo refusing to care for a jewish patient.
    Well, I am a Jewish nurse and I have cared for muslim patients, and white supremacists, also. And I lost family in the holocaust.

    A patient is a patient.
  4. by   schroeders_piano
    I agree that her actions were not correct, but I don't believe it is considered abandonment if the supervisor sends a nurse home. The moment a supervisor sends a nurse home without arranging coverage, then the supervisor is resposible for those patients.
  5. by   ZASHAGALKA
    Quote from schroeders_piano
    I agree that her actions were not correct, but I don't believe it is considered abandonment if the supervisor sends a nurse home. The moment a supervisor sends a nurse home without arranging coverage, then the supervisor is resposible for those patients.
    I absolutely disagree. The moment abandonment occurred was when the nurse absolutely refused to complete an assignment she had already accepted.

    Sending her home was simply a consequence for the already de facto decision of the nurse.

    Did abandonment occur because the nurse was sent home? Or, was the nurse sent home because abandonment occurred?

    Because keeping her there would not have led to her fulfilling her previously accepted assignment, I think the later is the case.

    As an aside, a piece of advise to the OP: contact your DON THIS morning. Don't let that fester till Monday. I think you will find that your bosses will MORE upset about not knowing about this sooner than they will be about the action you took.

    ~faith,
    Timothy.
    Last edit by ZASHAGALKA on Nov 24, '06
  6. by   Tweety
    Quote from HappyNurse82
    Firing her isn't going to solve jack. All that's going to come of that is fueling her rage furthermore.

    Obviously, we're not going to cure her prejudice by firing her. But allowing her to stay sends the message that it's o.k. to discriminate against patients based soley on religion. I would not want her working with me.

    If she were a soldier seeing people killed by Muslims and was having flashbacks, or any number of possible reasonable explanations other than merely looking at a person's religion and refusing to care for them based on the ignorant presumption that this (more than likely) American in her assignment is Muslim, then I would perhaps give her the benefit of the doubt.

    I still say fire her. Zero tolerance. Sure, she's going to be prejudiced. Perhaps she'll keep it to herself and bite the bullet and care for a person of another faith in the future and realize they are a human being worthy of her care, or perhaps not. But there should be consequences.
  7. by   clemmm78
    I've been following this thread since it started. While I agree with all the OP has done, what I strongly disagree with is waiting until Monday to inform him/her of what has happened. If I was in the upper echelons of admin, I'd be furious that I'd been kept in the dark over a nurse being sent home for a racist event. Who knows what the nurse and her family may be doing/saying over the weekend? The admin deserves the opportunity to decide if they will act before or after the weekend.
  8. by   wmarat
    Quote from TazziRN
    Is every Hartheim a Jew? Is every Kim or Chung or Yamamoto a Buddhist? Is every Smith a Christian?

    Every Muslim is certainly not a terrorist.The terrorists are the extreme faction, much like KKK or NeoNazis. They do not represent the majority in this country, and terrorists do not represent the majority of Muslims.

    OP, I agree with your actions, including reporting her to the BON. Refusing a pt under certain few circumstances is acceptable, but not in the manner in which she did it, and certainly religious intolerance is not on that list. It's the same as caring for HIV/AIDS pts........25 years ago nurses were allowed to do that, but not anymore. The "sweet young thing" is entitled to her opinions about people but she is not entitled to refuse care like that.

    As for caring for the enemy in war, Americans have always, in this century, cared for the injured regardless of the uniform they wear. Maybe that should be pointed out to Young Thing.
    You have no idea what you're talking about. How many muslims have you happened to know?
  9. by   wmarat
    Quote from Tweety
    Obviously, we're not going to cure her prejudice by firing her. But allowing her to stay sends the message that it's o.k. to discriminate against patients based soley on religion. I would not want her working with me.

    If she were a soldier seeing people killed by Muslims and was having flashbacks, or any number of possible reasonable explanations other than merely looking at a person's religion and refusing to care for them based on the ignorant presumption that this (more than likely) American in her assignment is Muslim, then I would perhaps give her the benefit of the doubt.

    I still say fire her. Zero tolerance. Sure, she's going to be prejudiced. Perhaps she'll keep it to herself and bite the bullet and care for a person of another faith in the future and realize they are a human being worthy of her care, or perhaps not. But there should be consequences.
    I'd suggest you to reread Dalai Lama's saying, because what you're sayng is square opposite what Dalai Lame said. Are not you prejudiced, because that YOUNG and probably UNEXPERIENCED nurse thinks differently from you?
    That's true, even more, that's unwritten law that the nurse has to provide professional care to her/his patients and that does not matter who and what those patients are, but supprise, a nurse is human being too, with thoughts, believes, feelings, moods, periods, etc. I honestly believe that she ( or any other nurse) has the right to refuse to take care of a patient for ANY reason, but this must be done properly without screaming and crying. So, do not fire her, educate her, explain her what she did wrong etc.
  10. by   gr8rnpjt
    Or, it's kind of like ME saying that I will no longer take care of patients that have diarrhea because I don't like cleaning poop.



  11. by   CHATSDALE
    the lpn was wrong, it is not up to a supervisor to know the prejudices to the staff, esp one who comes in late, perhaps if she had come in on time she could have requested in a calm reasonable way that an exchange of pts be made,
    a pt can not be left unattended because a nurse chooses not to care them, whatever the reason
    i have know afro-american and catholics care for kkk pts
    however we should not judge our fellow nurses for their opinion if it does not effect their work, ie happy nurse, her experiences have shaped her opinion don't judge her until we have walked in her shoes [God willing it will not happen]

    i know a family whose grandfather was a POW under the japanese, to his dying day he had an intense hatred of all japanese and all products, including cars and tvs etc this didn't make any sense to his family but then they couldn't understand the horror of those days
  12. by   SharonH, RN
    Quote from HappyNurse82
    Well darlin'...when somebody shows up at your door telling your husband/wife won't ever walk again because of a war...a war being fought against a group of Muslims..your opinion on my thoughts might change..until then, don't stand in judgement of me.

    That's just an excuse you're making to justify your hatred/prejudices. And it doesn't wash.
  13. by   Tweety
    Quote from wmarat
    I'd suggest you to reread Dalai Lama's saying, because what you're sayng is square opposite what Dalai Lame said. Are not you prejudiced, because that YOUNG and probably UNEXPERIENCED nurse thinks differently from you?
    That's true, even more, that's unwritten law that the nurse has to provide professional care to her/his patients and that does not matter who and what those patients are, but supprise, a nurse is human being too, with thoughts, believes, feelings, moods, periods, etc. I honestly believe that she ( or any other nurse) has the right to refuse to take care of a patient for ANY reason, but this must be done properly without screaming and crying. So, do not fire her, educate her, explain her what she did wrong etc.
    I see that you're in Israel, so I'll take that into consideration.

    First of all the Dali Lama I'm sure has a lot to say about tolerance of others, but let's leave him out of it.

    Secondly, while there is no law written that nurses have to care for each and every patient they come across, there are policies written into most employers personnel books about prejudice and discrimination, and most places it's zero tolerance.

    If I were the employer of this person, I would most definately attempt to educate her on her wrongdoings as I am firing her.
    This person certainly is entitled to her prejudices and her right to refuse to care for someone. But there are consequences for those types of decisions. This is for the protection of all of us.
    Last edit by Tweety on Nov 24, '06

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