Nurses children and vaccinations, how do you feel?

HM2VikingRN, RN · Feb 17, 2007

I personally would rather be a little bit sick (from a vaccination) than a whole lot dead from a preventable disease.

A year or so ago there was a case of polio reported for a US college student who went to Costa Rica on a mission trip. She ended up acquiring Polio from the children of a family who had been vaccinated using the Oral vaccine. Her parents did not have her vaccinated as a child for religious reasons. (It was reported by MMWR). I happen to think the case was a tragedy because she will have a lifetime disability from a preventable disease.

I know in MN it is a requirement to have current vaccinations or a religious exemption to attend University. For entering Nursing school I was required to provide copies of my military shot record including hep b.

I am pro vaccination! (Both of my kids were vaccinated for everything under the sun)

nptobee · Feb 17, 2007

I have an 11 y/o daughter. I am against this new vaccine for some strains of Human Papilloma Virus. I think I heard that Texas is requiring it now for girls aged 9-13(?). That's makes me angry. My daughter will not be getting that vaccine.

If cervical cancer comes from HPV, then it is quite preventable. I don't like the idea of assuming that everyone will be having unprotected, early sex.

StrwbryblndRN · Feb 17, 2007

To all you nurses you do not vaccinate and call yourselves weird. GOOD FOR YOU. I am glad to hear that people make choices for themselves and it works. I vaccinate my kids but I do not get the flu shot and wait till the last minute to take my kids to the doctor.

I hate antibiotics (my husband is immune to some because he was prescribed too many over the years). So I can understand others view points where health is concerned. Even though I vaccinate, I do not do other "normal" things that parents would do.

I say to each their own.

StrwbryblndRN · Feb 17, 2007

I have an 11 y/o daughter. I am against this new vaccine for some strains of Human Papilloma Virus. I think I heard that Texas is requiring it now for girls aged 9-13(?). That's makes me angry. My daughter will not be getting that vaccine.
If cervical cancer comes from HPV, then it is quite preventable. I don't like the idea of assuming that everyone will be having unprotected, early sex.

I agree, I would think education of HPV and the vaccine would be a better fit than required immunizations. My daughter is only 4 so I have time to make a decision and wait till the vaccine has been out for some time. But I want it to be MY decision not law makers.

Jo Dirt · Feb 17, 2007

Neither did I :) It's nice to find other heretics out there.
Seriously though, sometimes I DO feel like a hypocrite when I vaccinate babies at work, or give the flu shot (which I have serious doubts about the effectiveness of, but that's another story) or give Tylenol for a temp of 101...and then go home and tell my friends not to worry unless their fever is over 104 and not to take anything to bring it down because it's the body's way of fighting off infection.

I was called out to give two flu vaccines when I was doing home health. I told those patients "I wouldn't have one of them shots for nuthin' "(I'm from the South, after all). They still wanted the shots. One of the patients ended up in the hospital a week later. The other one apparently suffered no ill effects.

Rabid Badger, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2007

I always ask my pts if they are uncomfortable, regarding their temps. I sincerely believe the healthcare is about choice. I agree, I never medicated my kids' temps. Instead I wrapped them up in warm blankets or gave them a hot bath. The body feels chilled because it NEEDS a temp to do it's job!

This is untrue. The fever is a symptom of the immune reaction to infection, not the cause of the immune reaction. You can treat the fever with meds without affecting the immune response. By giving tylenol, you reduce pt discomfort, reduce dangerously high temps, and therefore can reduce tachycardia, resps and a whole host of other cascading factors. Reducing temp in no way decreases our ability to respond to the infection.

If you truly beleive in informed consent, then it is imperative that you know what you are talking about when providing the options. We are not doing any service to the patient by injecting our own biases into situations that are not appropriate. For example, offering cold cloths to a patient versus tylenol stating it will work as well is illfounded. I'm sorry, but if I have a multisystem ill patient who suddenly spikes a temp i'm not going to first lay them out in cold cloths, bed bathe them etc only to discover, OMG its not getting better!!! A more educated response would be to assess the fever along with other signs and symptoms of infection, have the urine and blood cultures drawn, then give tylenol, administer antibiotic treatment and monitor them like a hawk because they are now rolling down the slipperly slope of sepsis/septic shock/death. The tylenol does nothing to change this other than to make the patient more comfortable.

rita359 · Feb 17, 2007

My sons are now nearing 30 but I had their recommended vaccines when they were children. That did not include many of the things children are now vaccinated for. I think, however, that one needs to be cautious about some of the things children are now being vaccinated for. For instance, this new one for girls to prevent cervical? cancer. We have no real experience with this vaccine. I would not have one of my children be in the first groups to be vaccinated for it. Its just like being the first to have a new form of surgery(let a surgeon get experience under his belt first before experimenting on me). Caution is good. Do vaccines cause autism? I don't know but the rise in autism does seem to coincide with the increasing number of vaccines given to children at very young ages. Maybe their immune systems cannot handle so much. For all the doctors think they know about the immune system, there is still so much we don't know about how our bodies work it will probably still fill volumes. We didn't have antibiotics until about 60 years ago. In the millions of years of human history thats yesterday. Look how many antibiotics we give now. And we do know how little we know about how the brain works. I think CAUTION should be used. A poster stated that chicken pox vaccine was given to also ward off shingles as a reason for the vaccine. I remember the first year of the flu vaccines and more people coming down with Gilliam-Barre syndrome. I've seen that in my own experience and you can bet Gilliam-Barre is a lot more terrible than the flu. Caution!!

GardenDove · Feb 17, 2007

I think you're wrong about that. In micro we learned that bacteria are more effectively destroyed my the antibodies with a temp greater than 100 degrees. We learned in nursing school that bringing down a temp wasn't neccessary, as long as it wasn't too high, because it had benificial effects.

It's part of the natural immune response for a specific reason. The body wouldn't evolve this mechanism, which can also be draining, uncomfortable, and contribute to dehydration, without a good reason.

hollyvk, BSN · Feb 17, 2007

I have an 11 y/o daughter. I am against this new vaccine for some strains of Human Papilloma Virus. I think I heard that Texas is requiring it now for girls aged 9-13(?). That's makes me angry. My daughter will not be getting that vaccine.
If cervical cancer comes from HPV, then it is quite preventable. I don't like the idea of assuming that everyone will be having unprotected, early sex.

These are the attitudes that makes implementing public health policies so difficult:

1) My individual rights supercede those of my community.

2) I always know what's best for my loved one.

3) My child won't get infected.

To nptobee: You certainly have the right to decline any vaccination for your child, but I hope you do it on an educated basis and not a knee-jerk reaction.

The failed logic of your statement, "If cervical cancer comes from HPV, then it is quite preventable" just floors me after you have just ranted about no way will your child be getting this vaccination. There are only THREE ways to prevent viral infections: 1) have no contact with the virus, 2) develop immunity to the virus without acquiring an active infection (that's what vaccinations do), or 3) make all possible host persons immune to the virus so that it dies out (this is what happened with smallpox, due to world-wide vaccination).

From a realistic perspective, we know that HPV can cause cervical cancer (not all forms of it, but many). We know that many women clear the virus on their own after being infected, but some do go on to develop cervical CA. We know that HPV is transmitted through sex.

Ideally your daughter will have only one sexual partner in her life and he will not be infected with HPV, but in this day and age can you guarantee that? And if on the off chance she did get infected along the way, developed cervical CA and had to have an early hysterectomy, could you deal with that?

HollyVK, RN, BSN, JD

[MOUSE] Fighting emotion & ignorance, always an uphill battle [/MOUSE]

Logan · Feb 17, 2007

Hi,

I have an inherent problem with forcing free folks to do something....

... even if that something is obviously for their benefit.

I agree with member 'TazziRN'.

Dogma works both ways - as member 'llg' has kindly and rightly pointed out.

Thanks,

Matthew

hollyvk, BSN · Feb 17, 2007

I believe in vaccination, both for children (who have no say in the matter) and adults. Because of herd immunity, most kids who didn't get vaccinated (and are presumably home schooled) are pretty safe; however, if too many take this attitude, there will be no more herd immunity. Why should everyone else have to take the low, but real, risk of serious vaccine side effects?
As for adults, I always avoided the flu shot. Then I started thinking - yes, I never get the flu and very rarely a cold. But what about my patients - and now, as well, my 2-year-old twins? Do I have the right to put them at risk? No, and therefore I got the shot.
DeLana :)

My opinion is that if you choose for yourself not to be vaccinated for XYZ, that's fine, but if you then get infected and spread the infection to others, you've acted irresponsibly. So kudos to you, DeLana, on getting your flu shot to keep your patients and your little ones safe. :yeah:

I have personal knowledge of both life-altering damage from getting a mumps infection as an adult (a male friend who is now both completely deaf and sterile as a result) and the disabling down side of immunization side effects (a former pt who got a swine flu vaccine, developed Guillain Barre' that then became chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy--leaving him as a functional quad).

I think that if you're going to choose to opt out of vaccinations for yourself or your children, you should spend some time keeping current on what's happening with your local infection rates (go to your state's public health dept's website) and with changes in national vaccination recommendations (go to the mmwr site http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/). You can also track reported national and international outbreaks of preventable diseases at that site (use the search term "outbreak" on the mmwr site) to see what's occurring with mumps, pertussis, hepatitis, varicella, polio, etc.

HollyVK, RN, BSN, JD

Knowledge IS power!

hollyvk, BSN · Feb 17, 2007

Hi,
I have an inherent problem with forcing free folks to do something....
... even if that something is obviously for their benefit.
Thanks,
Matthew

Few of you here are old enough to remember the HEATED debates about putting fluoride in the public water supplies in the late 1950's. Oh my goodness, it was a communist plot to poison us!

As a child in the 1950's living in rural areas with well water, I wasn't exposed to fluorinated water supplies until I was a teenage and my dental health (numerous caries) reflects that lack of early fluoride exposure. (Can you say, multiple expensive dental crowns?)

So Matthew, to you I say make all the ill-considered personal choices you want, just don't make me pay for them. If you want to ride a motorcycle with out a helmet or drive a car without wearing your seatbelt, fine, but you darn well better be carrying enough insurance coverage for your acute care, rehab, and disability needs.

HollyVK RN, BSN, JD

Your personal freedom should not come at your community's expense