I am a B.S.N. Student in Texas. After talking to several other students from my school, it seems that very few nurses we have encountered even acknowledge that the students are there in the hospital. I feel as if they do not "wish" to have time for us. These are nurses with four or five patients who seem to have plenty of time for everything else but no time for students. Granted, I understand that students can get in the way and slow nurses down but most of us truly want to help. Maybe my persepctive is a lot different because I am in school and I see things idealisticly. I know everyone was a student once. I am just wondering how nurses feel when students are in the hospital? Do you personally feel differently about nursing than you did when you were still in nursing school?
Some of us have realized that sometimes, students are being head counted!! As support workers or health care assistants, and this is just so unfair!! well, fair enuf tell us wer short staffed, but it cant be happening most of the tym..these students are there to learn... not to do agency work..
I see it just like the cycle of abuse. When you've been abused you have two options: 1) pass on the abuse to the next generation or 2) stop the cycle and make a conscious effort to not treat others the way you've been treated.
Many people are miserable in their private lives and carry that attitude over to work. Unfortunately, students are often on the receiving end of their misery. :angryfire
:chuckle :chuckle That is for sure. Do most hospitals make Nurses take students without a choice? If so, here is part of the problem. Not everyone is cut out for teaching. A facility can't make a person enjoy and be good at something they don't like and don't want to do. I just feel expecting all Nurses to teach is unrealistic. Yes, I know I was a student, too, but when I look back at many of the totally wasted hours I spent in clinicals because I was with a Nurse that did not want a student (which at the time left me feeling , now makes me feel :angryfire
I wish some of you nurses were at the hospital I had clinicals at! I am a student and I have since changed school. But, the nurses there on the floor didn't even look at you! They assumed that b/c you were there that you were to do all beds, bath, meds, feeding, diapers, charting etc. Which I know comes with the terriory and I am not expecting to not do it when I graduate, but I never got any guidance. I just had to to hope no one got hurt. For instance, after my instuctor observed me give meds the very first time, she never came back to observe anything else. I even heard some nurses saying we were in the way. I guess they weren't thinking about the fact that we were doing their job while they sat at the nurses station or if we messed up they were in trouble too. I felt like we were just there to be free labor, not learn. Some of the nurses assigned to my patient, I never even saw go in the room during my 8 hour clinical. Luckily the school I am at now is very supportive.
I have seen both types of nurses but in their defense. Alot of them are perceived to not like you but in both cases I have had nurses that just needed to warm up to us. Their license is on the line when you take over their patient. They feel like someone is taking away their control. So just remeber when you deal with these nurses try to find the good. Let them get to know you and they will let you in their world.
I always try to treat others as I would want to be treated...there are good and bad attitudes with nurses as well as students..we all need to try to see things from the other persons side..some nurses are better with students than others and they should be the ones they are paired with..I can see both sides and can't put blame one group or the other..You have a nurse with 7 pts who is running ragged trying to get the basics done..3 of her pts are assigned a student each..the students are eager and wanting to learn/the nurse has her job plus answering questions, helping with meds/procedures/ect, it's a lot of extra work...everybody is STRESSED...lol....most nurses I work with enjoy students,when they have the time to spend with them..some days are just soooo hectic that the students get short-changed...nobody's fault..just the way it is.
Correct me if I'm wrong but when I was a student, I was under my instructor's license not the nurse that had that particular patient.
Technically that is correct.
However, when it comes to a lawsuit, anyone that is working that day will probably dragged into it. Especially if it was Nurse So and So's patient.
There is a reason lawyers are hated so much. If you have ever been in a court room (and I have been in hundreds of them) you will see that truth and fairness is way down the list of objectives.
$$$$$ is the # 1 motivator.
The truth and what is right get trampled on.
Most smart nurses carry their own malpractice insurance on top of what the hospital has.
the point is that someone who doesn't even know me, didn't go to my nursing school, doesn't know my grades, etc is telling me i'd have a hard time in a particular program. how can one person say another person is going to have a hard time at a particular school? its something that is hard for her (or anyone) to say how well a person would do in school. does that make sense? it just wasn't a friendly comment. i will gladly say my nursing school is hard, but inever tell people that they'd have a hard time getting through my program.
the comment was not an LPN dig-it was a simple comment that someone i didnt know was assuming something about me she couldnt possibly have known (my school abilities) and this made for not the best, friendly environment to work in.
dont take it for more than what i said.
love, rose
ah... maybe you took the original comment from the LPN as more than what was said? I don't know, a lot is said nonverbally and in intonation. I guess what we're all hearing is "an LPN said that I would have a hard time in my RN program..." well... an LPN would have a pretty good idea about the difficulty of nursing programs in general because in general they are all pretty demanding... That's not to say that she's slighting your ability, just commenting on the difficulty of nursing programs. Of course, we weren't there. For all we know she was really catty about it and WAS indicating she thinks you're an idiot... :chuckle We'll give you the benefit of the doubt. It sounded like you were saying how could she know my program was hard, she's just an LPN... we lose a lot of our meaning when we communicate electronically unfortunately...
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Technically that is correct.
However, when it comes to a lawsuit, anyone that is working that day will probably dragged into it. Especially if it was Nurse So and So's patient.
There is a reason lawyers are hated so much. If you have ever been in a court room (and I have been in hundreds of them) you will see that truth and fairness is way down the list of objectives.
$$$$$ is the # 1 motivator.
The truth and what is right get trampled on.
Most smart nurses carry their own malpractice insurance on top of what the hospital has.
Right-o! ANYONE involved in the care of said patient can and probably WILL be dragged in, in the case of a lawsuit. NOT just the Instructor, but the primary nurse, as well as the charge nurse.
I remember the first few years out of nursng school I was still in 'student mode' and enjoyed the students...and the students enjoyed me. I remembered my school lessons and could relate this memory to the student's questions.
As I got older, 10 yrs or so into the field...and got more into 'real world' nursing and away from school mode, I learned to re prioritize, learned more shortcuts and things became instinctive/less easily explanatory in my practice, it became harder to precept students. I know many older nurses who feel similarly and our 'instinctive' practice is hard to translate. Some of my best and brightest, most experienced ICU coworkers cannot work well with students...they cannot come down to student level and both end up frustrated.
Students have many many questions and this can be seen by tired nurses as an extra burden. No nurse IMO should be made to precept students (but often are expected to) . Not all nurses enjoy teaching. And yes, too many students are shocked at the discrepancies they see from classroom nursing vs real life...and will they share this...creating tensions with the experienced nurse.
I always tell students "Do things and think of things the way your teachers tell you to.... for NOW. Shortcuts will come later." I personally don't want to confuse my students and always include this statement if they are observing ME perform a procedure...if they watch me they may become confused. Some students with tunnel vision may get into critiqueing the nurses...this likely goes back to an instructor who has been derogatory to staff nurses in lecture. This 'nurse eating' behavior can be seen propogating in some nursing schools unfortunately.
Just wanted to give a litle food for thought and some background to students...my advice; don't take it personal if a nurse isn't super friendly, just gravitate to those who ARE. :)
from a season nurse's point of view, i think the most frustrating thing is having students (& occasionally their instructors) who are not prepare & expect us to...not only teach...but *tell* the students everything! no...we're not here to have our brains *picked* people...as someone earlier said they like to do with staff nurses. we're not text books or references in that respect. and i absolutely hate it whenever the instructors come on the floor with their student(s) & just leave them with us...then conveniently pop in once or twice a shift only to pick them up at the end!!! they tell students that they're in the building & just to beep them if there's an emergency. like...hellooooooooo :angryfire ....wth are you being paid for? what are they going to do that would help in an emergency...coming from another part of the building ? it's stuff like that that just fire-up a lot staff nurses. i can understand why many nurses are leery of those non prepared students & some instructors . i'm naturally going to be more receptive to those who at least make the effort to learn :kiss ....even if they are a little unsure of themselves.
before i send a student in to assess a patient, i would like to know if they have the nursing process down first. i want to see if they know & understand the dx & disease process (or at least be able to distinguish between what's normal & what's not). no...i don't expect them to know every single thing there is to know about an illness...but what i do expect them to *know* is where to get that information from! they should have some sort of rn pocket reference guide at the ready or know a good inter/intranet site (providing they have inter/intranet access) if they don't know the normals (i.e. common lab values). i'd ask them what they would do for a patient first...how they would conduct their assessments...& formulate a plan of care based on their assessment & md orders so that they can see how to prioritize their shift.
on the other hand though...having recently returning & finishing my bsn program...i can see how some students are treated by staff & vise-versa. for the most part, my experience as a student has been positive...with a few exceptions. i can remember some nurses wanting to use us as tech/nas & not allow us the opportunity to learn hands on what was taught didactically. this was especially true of the critical care units. it took those nurses a good three whole weeks (& probably the fact that we complained to the nursing department at school) before we saw any changes with respect to attitude. one the one hand...i was totally peeved that i was shelling out all this money only to not get the adequate clinical experience possible. but on the other hand, i was paying the university & *not* the nurses (well...not directly anyway)...so when we did complain to the nursing department, it was with the knowledge that we held the them responsible for us not receiving the adequate clinical experience. i remember having the worst clinical instructor ever in my second semester ~ good lord !!! she was the crown jewel of someone in the nursing department...they loved her & couldn't do no wrong...but she didn't know jack daniel about teaching & how to talk to people !!! this woman must have been a new msn cuz she was sooooo full of herself! she didn't allow students to give meds with the staff nurses (which was understandable considering she was taking full responsibility for every student). o.k....we all have 8:00 pm meds to give & there was ten students. you would think she'd start our med pass at 7:00 pm so that we all could be done by 9:00 pm (giving her that one hr window before & after). well she didn't get done until nearly 11:30 pm cuz she made each & every student not only go through the what, when, how's , & whys for every med...but she made us do this one pill at a time...lol :chuckle !!! in other words, we'd checked each & every pill/med...went through their actions, adverse reactions, half-life, & nsg considerations. then we'd take that one pill into the room, check the name badge of the patient, then gave that one pill...only to go back out to the med cart for the next pill!!! some patients have over 11 pills :uhoh21: !!! well if that wasn't bad enough....the staff nurses were livid cuz we had the flow sheets all that time. our instructor also wanted us to document everything as student nsgs so that she could co-sign our notes. problem was...the staff nurses came & took the sheets so that they could document their findings as it happened (this was a tele floor, mind). we often didn't get done with clinicals until nearly 12 midnight (& our clinical hrs were from 5:15 to 11:00 pm). after several students & staff nurses complained...this instructor had the brilliant idea to have the students pass meds with each other !!! she still didn't want us to pass meds with our nurses (under no circumstances were we to *bother* the staff nurses). however...once they (the staff nurses) learned of this...this practice was brought to a halt !!! just imagine what could've happened should a mistake occur!!! this coming from an instructor who actually disconnected a patient from their o2 in order to give them a breathing tx with a neb machine that wasn't hooked-up to o2. needless to say...that patient's o2 sat went from low 90's down to low 70's in a matter of minutes & she didn't have a clue what she'd done :imbar !!! we only had this person one semester (thankfully)...she was dismissed from our facility.
anyhoo...getting back to the topic at hand (sort of digressed... :roll lol) sorry. someone had hit the nail on the head when they said that students have to basically prove themselves before nurses will allow you to come with ten feet of their patients. i totally feel that it's not fair to *dump* students on staff (that's what the instructors are being paid for)...but if some staff have opted to precept students with extra benies....then they should make a positive effort (at least until the student have given them a reason to be negative). some of my former classmates used to *pick* the staff nurses' brains to see if 'they knew what they were talking about.' those people got off on comparing themselves (& our clinical instructors) to their nurse preceptor :angryfire . they had no clue that they were playing a dangerous game! bad enough many staff nurses are working short handed...but they don't need the added stress of playing hospital jeopardy at the amusement of students . there was no learning doing that i can assure you...despite my objections...they did whatever they wanted & the instructors encouraged it...sad !
i seem to be rambling...so i'll stop now before i piss someone off to badly... lol!!!
It's jsut the way things are, i beleive that their are more amazing ones than not. But unfortunatly the not so welcoming ones stand out more. just the way things are
I make a point of thanking the good ones at the end of the day and letting them know they are appriciated.
, now makes me feel :angryfire
we're not text books or references in that respect. and i absolutely hate it whenever the instructors come on the floor with their student(s) & just leave them with us...then conveniently pop in once or twice a shift only to pick them up at the end!!! they tell students that they're in the building & just to beep them if there's an emergency. like...hellooooooooo :angryfire ....wth are you being paid for? what are they going to do that would help in an emergency...coming from another part of the building 
? it's stuff like that that just fire-up a lot staff nurses. i can understand why many nurses are leery of those non prepared students & some instructors 
!!! she was the crown jewel of someone in the nursing department...they loved her & couldn't do no wrong...but she didn't know jack daniel about teaching & how to talk to people 
!!! this woman must have been a new msn cuz she was sooooo full of herself! she didn't allow students to give meds with the staff nurses (which was understandable considering she was taking full responsibility for every student). o.k....we all have 8:00 pm meds to give & there was ten students. you would think she'd start our med pass at 7:00 pm so that we all could be done by 9:00 pm (giving her that one hr window before & after). well she didn't get done until nearly 11:30 pm cuz she made each & every student not only go through the what, when, how's , & whys for every med...but she made us do this one pill at a time...lol :chuckle !!! in other words, we'd checked each & every pill/med...went through their actions, adverse reactions, half-life, & nsg considerations. then we'd take that one pill into the room, check the name badge of the patient, then gave that one pill...only to go back out to the med cart for the next pill!!! some patients have over 11 pills :uhoh21: !!! well if that wasn't bad enough....the staff nurses were livid cuz we had the flow sheets all that time. our instructor also wanted us to document everything as student nsgs so that she could co-sign our notes. problem was...the staff nurses came & took the sheets so that they could document their findings as it happened (this was a tele floor, mind). we often didn't get done with clinicals until nearly 12 midnight (& our clinical hrs were from 5:15 to 11:00 pm). after several students & staff nurses complained...this instructor had the brilliant idea to have the students pass meds with each other 
!!! she still didn't want us to pass meds with our nurses (under no circumstances were we to *bother* the staff nurses). however...once they (the staff nurses) learned of this...this practice was brought to a halt !!! just imagine what could've happened should a mistake occur!!! this coming from an instructor who actually disconnected a patient from their o2 in order to give them a breathing tx with a neb machine that wasn't hooked-up to o2. needless to say...that patient's o2 sat went from low 90's down to low 70's in a matter of minutes & she didn't have a clue what she'd done :imbar !!! we only had this person one semester (thankfully)...she was dismissed from our facility.
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lol!!!
elnski
125 Posts
Some of us have realized that sometimes, students are being head counted!! As support workers or health care assistants, and this is just so unfair!! well, fair enuf tell us wer short staffed, but it cant be happening most of the tym..these students are there to learn... not to do agency work..