What is up with the level of entitlement?

[sofla98]

I’m a seasoned nurse with a lot of years of experience. I work hard to take care of my patients and their basic needs, and then some. But what is up with these newer grads, like in their younger 20’s? The ones who started 2019-2020, bc something is way different. 

We’re all wondering what it is. 

They expect the charge nurses and other nurses to do their tasks/work for them and I’ve seen some actually whine, roll their eyes, etc. when they don’t get their way or they’re a little bit busy. 

It’s really starting to aggravate those of us over the age of 30, especially because if they don’t get their way they go to the manager and say “so and so didn’t help me enough” or “so and so wasn’t available and I couldn’t find them for an hour.”

I think it’s time I leave the hospital, to be honest. They are also incredibly hard to train. They don’t listen, get offended if you try to explain to them why something didn’t go well, or go complain to the manager. 

Our management is tired of it too. Is it the same personalities? Are they really that easily offended? Someone ELI5. Thanx. 

Don’t believe this is an issue? Just wait for the responses! LOL! 

[hppygr8ful, ASN, RN, EMT-I]

4 hours ago, Daisy4RN said:

Sounds like you kinda had a mad scientist thing goin on there DaveyDo!

Speaking of animal surgeries I drained and packed an awful lot of wounds back in the farm days.

Hppy

 

[C_M_L_R18]

35 minutes ago, hppygr8ful said:

Speaking of animal surgeries I drained and packed an awful lot of wounds back in the farm days.

Hppy

 

I swear in a post apocalyptic situation if no nurses or doctors were available the first person I’d call is my horse friends ? 

 

 

[ActiveRN305, BSN]

I’ll ride my horse, right with you...my bow and arrow, and fight the apocalypse that we all know it’s coming.

oh we know it’s coming..

 

so let’s ride ?????⚡️??!!

[speedynurse, ADN, BSN, RN, EMT-P]

3 hours ago, Hollyhocks720 said:

Wow you guys - I don’t know where you get your information - all you have to do is Google “the entitled generation” and millennial is all over it - 99% of all the hits will be millennials.  It’s also the generation who got the trophies for losing.

I think any age can be entitled or even narcissistic.....I found this out very quickly in the ED. Every generation has people that work very hard and are kind and caring just like every generation has people that are entitled or even narcissistic.....I think it’s very easy to peg one generation as having everything easy instead of looking at people as individuals. I have taken care of people (and/or worked with people) in their 20s or 30s and people in their 60s, etc that are mean, rude, narcissistic, or entitled.....then I have worked with all these ages that incredibly hard working, generally very positive people, compassionate, etc. I think there is a lot more to people and how they act or react by what they have been through, life circumstances, what they were taught growing up, the culture they were raised in, etc.

[hppygr8ful, ASN, RN, EMT-I]

2 hours ago, ActiveRN305 said:

I’ll ride my horse, right with you...my bow and arrow, and fight the apocalypse that we all know it’s coming.

oh we know it’s coming..

 

so let’s ride ?????⚡️??!!

I do want to learn to shoot my bow from the back of a running horse !

[9kidsmomRN]

On 1/1/2021 at 8:07 PM, speedynurse said:

Sometimes in a critical care environment, you HAVE to speak up - it’s part of advocating for yourself and your moral conscience and advocating for your patients.

Just be careful about writing it up. When I filled an unsafe staffing report I had to meet with mgmt after weeks of running short, though never as bad as this particular night. They asked why I didn’t call them at home in the middle of the night... like they were going to find me staff at 3:30am? Most staff were already tripled in the ICU. Other units already under staffed...

oh well, it’s on file now..:.

[Bailey Jones]

I will accept the fact that a large part of this is their nursing education. My first semester teaching in a clinical setting students were using an automated blood pressure cuff.  I cut that out immediately. When they complained I said what if you don’t have one or it’s during a code and the automated BP is not picking up an accurate reading and you have to take it manually. If you do not practice manuals outside the lab you won’t be able to do it in a crisis situation. So my students always took manual blood pressure’s. I also caught them using patient care assistant to do glucose checks, change the sheets, bathing, denture care, etc and I stopped that nonsense immediately. When they complained that nurses don’t do that stuff I laughed. Many times PCA’s are short staffed or the unit may not have any that shift. This semester the students only have two patients at this point, and students need to learn total patient care. If a PCA is not there for a shift does that mean the patient does not get a bath, oral hygiene, or their sheets changed? No it means the nurse needs to pick up the slack. All of my students always thank me at graduation  and the floor nurses or more willing to help the students when they saw the work they were doing. The PCAs are more helpful to nurses who help them. They have 10 patients and if a nurse offers to do total patient care on one or two it makes their life easier and they do not get paid near enough. Unfortunately, nursing schools have a faculty shortage and use a lot of adjunct faculty. This means the person has a full-time nursing job and works one day a week for the college to do a 12 hour clinical group. There is a combination of not having the training to be an educator, and just collecting a big paycheck but very few of them demand the same expectations from student nurses. Some students go all the way through nursing school only having adjunct faculty as a clinical instructors. When they get to the real world, they are whining because they are being asked to do some thing they should have done in nursing school but did not. There are some students that just feel that it is beneath them, and I tell these students the first day during orientation a nurse is expected to give total patient care and if they are not ready to be vomited on, clean up diarrhea, and do oral care or the non-glamorous jobs of a nurse they do not need to be in nursing. In summary, I wanted to be a nurse...my mom was a nurse...I felt the calling to be empathetic, compassionate, and provide excellent care. The very first day I always ask the incoming students in orientation how many are in this program because a family member is a nurse and probably 40% of the class raises their hand. Then I ask how many of you are in the nursing school because a loved one battled a chronic illness and you saw the difference a nurse made and want to give back? Again another 40%. That 80% the students are going into nursing for the right reasons. My final question is how many of you are here going through nursing school because it’s a recession proof job and make good money and that is 20% of the class. They do not have the compassion and they lack complete empathy and they are the ones that are complaining constantly. You also have very smart textbook students that are able to get into nursing but have terrible bedside skills and communication skills and that probably makes 10% of new grads. So basically  30% of new grads are not capable of showing compassion and are not capable of putting themselves in the patient’s shoes and treating them with the respect, and have poor to non existent communication skills. When one of my students would call a patient by their first name I would flip out. After we got out of the room I said you will address them by Mr. or Mrs. or their appropriate title unless they specifically ask you to call them by their first name. And do not ever call them sweetie, honey or any pet names. These 30% of new graduates are dangerous because they think they know everything and will not ask for clarification. These are the ones that make huge mistakes and are the ones that have the entitlement attitude. 

[C_M_L_R18]

3 minutes ago, Bailey Jones said:

I will accept the fact that a large part of this is their nursing education. My first semester teaching in a clinical setting students were using an automated blood pressure cuff.  I cut that out immediately. When they complained I said what if you don’t have one or it’s during a code and the automated BP is not picking up an accurate reading and you have to take it manually. If you do not practice manuals outside the lab you won’t be able to do it in a crisis situation. So my students always took manual blood pressure’s. I also caught them using patient care assistant to do glucose checks, change the sheets, bathing, denture care, etc and I stopped that nonsense immediately. When they complained that nurses don’t do that stuff I laughed. Many times PCA’s are short staffed or the unit may not have any that shift. This semester the students only have two patients at this point, and students need to learn total patient care. If a PCA is not there for a shift does that mean the patient does not get a bath, oral hygiene, or their sheets changed? No it means the nurse needs to pick up the slack. All of my students always thank me at graduation  and the floor nurses or more willing to help the students when they saw the work they were doing. The PCAs are more helpful to nurses who help them. They have 10 patients and if a nurse offers to do total patient care on one or two it makes their life easier and they do not get paid near enough. Unfortunately, nursing schools have a faculty shortage and use a lot of adjunct faculty. This means the person has a full-time nursing job and works one day a week for the college to do a 12 hour clinical group. There is a combination of not having the training to be an educator, and just collecting a big paycheck but very few of them demand the same expectations from student nurses. Some students go all the way through nursing school only having adjunct faculty as a clinical instructors. When they get to the real world, they are whining because they are being asked to do some thing they should have done in nursing school but did not. There are some students that just feel that it is beneath them, and I tell these students the first day during orientation a nurse is expected to give total patient care and if they are not ready to be vomited on, clean up diarrhea, and do oral care or the non-glamorous jobs of a nurse they do not need to be in nursing. In summary, I wanted to be a nurse...my mom was a nurse...I felt the calling to be empathetic, compassionate, and provide excellent care. The very first day I always ask the incoming students in orientation how many are in this program because a family member is a nurse and probably 40% of the class raises their hand. Then I ask how many of you are in the nursing school because a loved one battled a chronic illness and you saw the difference a nurse made and want to give back? Again another 40%. That 80% the students are going into nursing for the right reasons. My final question is how many of you are here going through nursing school because it’s a recession proof job and make good money and that is 20% of the class. They do not have the compassion and they lack complete empathy and they are the ones that are complaining constantly. You also have very smart textbook students that are able to get into nursing but have terrible bedside skills and communication skills and that probably makes 10% of new grads. So basically  30% of new grads are not capable of showing compassion and are not capable of putting themselves in the patient’s shoes and treating them with the respect, and have poor to non existent communication skills. When one of my students would call a patient by their first name I would flip out. After we got out of the room I said you will address them by Mr. or Mrs. or their appropriate title unless they specifically ask you to call them by their first name. And do not ever call them sweetie, honey or any pet names. These 30% of new graduates are dangerous because they think they know everything and will not ask for clarification. These are the ones that make huge mistakes and are the ones that have the entitlement attitude. 

Heh. I don’t fit into any of your categories as far as the reason being.  I honestly just randomly decided one day to start the pre recs and somewhere in the process I realized I really loved not just nursing but .... I may be one of the few humans alive that actually enjoyed nursing school. 
 

That said I learned pretty much the first week from our teacher “do not irritate your CNA. They can make or break your shift” 

 

I honestly as a student didn’t mind doing full patient care, in fact I was immensely grateful that I learned how- as I had a family member on hospice while I was in school and my exact thought was “thank you god something I know how to do. Know how to do WELL, and can help them”. 

[Guest856929]

6 minutes ago, Bailey Jones said:

I will accept the fact that a large part of this is their nursing education. My first semester teaching in a clinical setting students were using an automated blood pressure cuff.  I cut that out immediately. When they complained I said what if you don’t have one or it’s during a code and the automated BP is not picking up an accurate reading and you have to take it manually. If you do not practice manuals outside the lab you won’t be able to do it in a crisis situation. So my students always took manual blood pressure’s. I also caught them using patient care assistant to do glucose checks, change the sheets, bathing, denture care, etc and I stopped that nonsense immediately. When they complained that nurses don’t do that stuff I laughed. Many times PCA’s are short staffed or the unit may not have any that shift. This semester the students only have two patients at this point, and students need to learn total patient care. If a PCA is not there for a shift does that mean the patient does not get a bath, oral hygiene, or their sheets changed? No it means the nurse needs to pick up the slack. All of my students always thank me at graduation  and the floor nurses or more willing to help the students when they saw the work they were doing. The PCAs are more helpful to nurses who help them. They have 10 patients and if a nurse offers to do total patient care on one or two it makes their life easier and they do not get paid near enough. Unfortunately, nursing schools have a faculty shortage and use a lot of adjunct faculty. This means the person has a full-time nursing job and works one day a week for the college to do a 12 hour clinical group. There is a combination of not having the training to be an educator, and just collecting a big paycheck but very few of them demand the same expectations from student nurses. Some students go all the way through nursing school only having adjunct faculty as a clinical instructors. When they get to the real world, they are whining because they are being asked to do some thing they should have done in nursing school but did not. There are some students that just feel that it is beneath them, and I tell these students the first day during orientation a nurse is expected to give total patient care and if they are not ready to be vomited on, clean up diarrhea, and do oral care or the non-glamorous jobs of a nurse they do not need to be in nursing. In summary, I wanted to be a nurse...my mom was a nurse...I felt the calling to be empathetic, compassionate, and provide excellent care. The very first day I always ask the incoming students in orientation how many are in this program because a family member is a nurse and probably 40% of the class raises their hand. Then I ask how many of you are in the nursing school because a loved one battled a chronic illness and you saw the difference a nurse made and want to give back? Again another 40%. That 80% the students are going into nursing for the right reasons. My final question is how many of you are here going through nursing school because it’s a recession proof job and make good money and that is 20% of the class. They do not have the compassion and they lack complete empathy and they are the ones that are complaining constantly. You also have very smart textbook students that are able to get into nursing but have terrible bedside skills and communication skills and that probably makes 10% of new grads. So basically  30% of new grads are not capable of showing compassion and are not capable of putting themselves in the patient’s shoes and treating them with the respect, and have poor to non existent communication skills. When one of my students would call a patient by their first name I would flip out. After we got out of the room I said you will address them by Mr. or Mrs. or their appropriate title unless they specifically ask you to call them by their first name. And do not ever call them sweetie, honey or any pet names. These 30% of new graduates are dangerous because they think they know everything and will not ask for clarification. These are the ones that make huge mistakes and are the ones that have the entitlement attitude. 

So the right reasons to join nursing is based on whether you have a family member who is/was a nurse or had a family member as a patient? I just need clarification on that because it seems quite archaic and myopic. What is the relevance of asking students such questions? I don’t think they determine whether someone is compassionate or not. Teach them to ask the patient the name the patient prefers to be called. Titles can create interesting scenarios. For instance as a patient I prefer to be called Lord Cynical LOL. Nonetheless kudos for teaching them total care. That’s important. 

[Bailey Jones]

3 minutes ago, cynical-RN said:

So the right reasons to join nursing is based on whether you have a family member who is/was a nurse or had a family member as a patient? I just need clarification on that because it seems quite archaic and myopic. What is the relevance of asking students such questions? I don’t think they determine whether someone is compassionate or not. Teach them to ask the patient the name the patient prefers to be called. Titles can create interesting scenarios. For instance as a patient I prefer to be called Lord Cynical LOL. Nonetheless kudos for teaching them total care. That’s important. 

Since I have been in academic administration for 10 years I have just been doing informal research. Those questions are not the reason they are in nursing school. I am sure there are plenty of people who has a nurse in their family or loved one that suffered through an illness that do not choose to go through nursing school. New graduate retention is a huge problem with 33% quitting the nursing profession within one year of graduation. My research is just trying to figure out the rationale for students going into nursing school and if that makes a difference in staying in the profession. What I found is people that have had a loved one battling an illness or on hospice they have seen the nurse do all different types of care including non-glamorous care. They are well aware of what they are seeking to be a nurse. The same goes for people that have a nurse in the family. My mom tried to talk me out of going into nursing, but people with the nurse in the family tells them the good the bad and the ugly about the profession so they go in as wide open. The student that tells me they are here because they are tired of getting laid off as a computer programmer does it tell me they are prepared to be a compassionate, empathetic, good communicator professional nurse. This is not always the case, but in my research it is true and verified by their PSB entrance exam that has a components to measure compassion and if they will be a good fit for nursing on the vocational aptitude test. In nursing school the faculty have to be in charge or have a significant say in the policies. In our nursing school the student affairs committee pics the students that our admit it based on the spreadsheet with the highest points given to the highest GPA, the Math and reading part of the PSB, and if they repeated any classes. I wish they would luck at potential students more holistically because there are probably a lot of B students that would make an excellent bedside nurse. Hospital send us a survey of new graduates they hire so I know the students who have a job and are doing well versus the students that have a hard time finding a job, was terminated, or a struggling not wanting to do certain parts of nursing. You can’t become a nurse only wanting to do certain parts of the job. I’m saying we need to do a better job in nursing school too cover real life nursing job duties. A nursing school can lose their accreditation if the first time NCLEX-RN pass rate is below 80%. Most schools like to be above 95%. So all there is an emphasis on being successful on the NCLEX-RN, more real world expectations of professional nurse would probably be helpful. 

[speedynurse, ADN, BSN, RN, EMT-P]

6 minutes ago, Bailey Jones said:

Since I have been in academic administration for 10 years I have just been doing informal research. Those questions are not the reason they are in nursing school. I am sure there are plenty of people who has a nurse in their family or loved one that suffered through an illness that do not choose to go through nursing school. New graduate retention is a huge problem with 33% quitting the nursing profession within one year of graduation. My research is just trying to figure out the rationale for students going into nursing school and if that makes a difference in staying in the profession. What I found is people that have had a loved one battling an illness or on hospice they have seen the nurse do all different types of care including non-glamorous care. They are well aware of what they are seeking to be a nurse. The same goes for people that have a nurse in the family. My mom tried to talk me out of going into nursing, but people with the nurse in the family tells them the good the bad and the ugly about the profession so they go in as wide open. The student that tells me they are here because they are tired of getting laid off as a computer programmer does it tell me they are prepared to be a compassionate, empathetic, good communicator professional nurse. This is not always the case, but in my research it is true and verified by their PSB entrance exam that has a components to measure compassion and if they will be a good fit for nursing on the vocational aptitude test. In nursing school the faculty have to be in charge or have a significant say in the policies. In our nursing school the student affairs committee pics the students that our admit it based on the spreadsheet with the highest points given to the highest GPA, the Math and reading part of the PSB, and if they repeated any classes. I wish they would luck at potential students more holistically because there are probably a lot of B students that would make an excellent bedside nurse. Hospital send us a survey of new graduates they hire so I know the students who have a job and are doing well versus the students that have a hard time finding a job, was terminated, or a struggling not wanting to do certain parts of nursing. You can’t become a nurse only wanting to do certain parts of the job. 

Yes - as a nurse you have to be willing to do all parts of the job, but I don’t thin

 

45 minutes ago, Bailey Jones said:

I will accept the fact that a large part of this is their nursing education. My first semester teaching in a clinical setting students were using an automated blood pressure cuff.  I cut that out immediately. When they complained I said what if you don’t have one or it’s during a code and the automated BP is not picking up an accurate reading and you have to take it manually. If you do not practice manuals outside the lab you won’t be able to do it in a crisis situation. So my students always took manual blood pressure’s. I also caught them using patient care assistant to do glucose checks, change the sheets, bathing, denture care, etc and I stopped that nonsense immediately. When they complained that nurses don’t do that stuff I laughed. Many times PCA’s are short staffed or the unit may not have any that shift. This semester the students only have two patients at this point, and students need to learn total patient care. If a PCA is not there for a shift does that mean the patient does not get a bath, oral hygiene, or their sheets changed? No it means the nurse needs to pick up the slack. All of my students always thank me at graduation  and the floor nurses or more willing to help the students when they saw the work they were doing. The PCAs are more helpful to nurses who help them. They have 10 patients and if a nurse offers to do total patient care on one or two it makes their life easier and they do not get paid near enough. Unfortunately, nursing schools have a faculty shortage and use a lot of adjunct faculty. This means the person has a full-time nursing job and works one day a week for the college to do a 12 hour clinical group. There is a combination of not having the training to be an educator, and just collecting a big paycheck but very few of them demand the same expectations from student nurses. Some students go all the way through nursing school only having adjunct faculty as a clinical instructors. When they get to the real world, they are whining because they are being asked to do some thing they should have done in nursing school but did not. There are some students that just feel that it is beneath them, and I tell these students the first day during orientation a nurse is expected to give total patient care and if they are not ready to be vomited on, clean up diarrhea, and do oral care or the non-glamorous jobs of a nurse they do not need to be in nursing. In summary, I wanted to be a nurse...my mom was a nurse...I felt the calling to be empathetic, compassionate, and provide excellent care. The very first day I always ask the incoming students in orientation how many are in this program because a family member is a nurse and probably 40% of the class raises their hand. Then I ask how many of you are in the nursing school because a loved one battled a chronic illness and you saw the difference a nurse made and want to give back? Again another 40%. That 80% the students are going into nursing for the right reasons. My final question is how many of you are here going through nursing school because it’s a recession proof job and make good money and that is 20% of the class. They do not have the compassion and they lack complete empathy and they are the ones that are complaining constantly. You also have very smart textbook students that are able to get into nursing but have terrible bedside skills and communication skills and that probably makes 10% of new grads. So basically  30% of new grads are not capable of showing compassion and are not capable of putting themselves in the patient’s shoes and treating them with the respect, and have poor to non existent communication skills. When one of my students would call a patient by their first name I would flip out. After we got out of the room I said you will address them by Mr. or Mrs. or their appropriate title unless they specifically ask you to call them by their first name. And do not ever call them sweetie, honey or any pet names. These 30% of new graduates are dangerous because they think they know everything and will not ask for clarification. These are the ones that make huge mistakes and are the ones that have the entitlement attitude. 

You have some good points but there are a few things that really do seem somewhat old fashioned or not quite right.....yes, sometimes new grads don’t know what they don’t know.....but it’s not their fault. They are new grads. Some people do have a personal story of why they became a nurse and sometimes they don’t. I have actually found that it doesn’t always make a person a “better” or more “compassionate” nurse based on life stories because sometimes those life stories also lead to a lot of anger and bitterness.
 

It’s a bit perplexing with how you mention how you “flip out” when a student calls a patient by a first name - please be aware that some patients ASK for nurses to call them by their first name. I am one that I would be baffled if someone called me anything other than my first name.

Teaching is leading by example.....and this is coming from someone who has been faculty and preceptor. It doesn’t mean categorizing students or responding in what may be an inappropriate way when in fact the students may truly have their patients in the best interest. I know the nurses, teachers, etc are the ones that led by example.....not the ones that are very up and down or overwhelmed me by going on and on about something that’s not even exactly a mistake.

Just my two cents.....

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

On 1/1/2021 at 5:56 PM, Davey Do said:

There really is something to that, subee!

As a young adolescent, I raised mice as pets and to make a little money selling them to pet shops. I had, at one time, 108 mice. I built cages for them that were like high-rise apartment buildings with three rooms in each apartment.

I noted this: Eight mice in a one foot square area of living space did well. No fights, babies were born and given care. However, if I over populated the area, fights, sometimes to the death, would break out. The male mice with the biggest testicles were bullies, hoarded food, and the mothers often ate their babies.

I learned how to perform surgeries, removing the male mice testicles, putting them under with my Dad's starting fluid which contained ether!

Even then, I knew I was destined to work in the medical/psychiatric nursing field!

 

That is one of the most interesting childhood preoccupations I have heard of!  As regard to the males with the biggest testicles, I've always called that testicular toxicity and wondered if men with that condition were led to prison more often than men without toxic levels.  But the world crowding, IMHO, has influenced our lives tremendously for the worst which has influenced how people behave at work. Since food and housing have become so expensive people have to work harder to pay for subsistence and I don't have to explain to You how that contributes to people feeling more oppressed by having to tolerate hostile work environments which don't really care about their budget sucking employees.  It's not like the past when we worked for an individual hospital who valued their team.  I know it's not like that everywhere but generally, we have become corporate widgets instead of people of value to the an administrator who has no patient care experience.  I feel sorry for the nurses just starting out.