Too Many Crabby Nurses!!

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

Why i'm asking is because a lot of the time, when it was time for me to leave, it was also time for the nurse originally assigned to the pt. to leave as well. So am i supposed to give the report to the oncoming nurse, along with my instructor?

(This is why i do not feel that the nurse isn't reponsible for a pt. that's assigned to a student. I would not guarentee that i wouldn't be held responsible as well if something happened to the pt. under the care of a student and their instructor. To me, it would wind up being 3 people getting the reprimand.)

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

Marie, in my years on the floor I've taken report from many a student.....without the instructor there....but with the staff nurse there. That's the way I do it when I precept as well. The student should get used to shift change report. I don't think I've seen the instructor go with the students to give report. It may be different elsewhere though. USF in Tampa has students here in a unique program, where they are paired with nurses and no instructor in site, but available by beeper and they make rounds once or twice a day, but the students are scattered with nurses thourhout the hospital. But the LPN and the cc ADN program usually is done the same way, with the students reporting separately from the instructors.

[Haunted]

I'm sorry but you are incorrect. When a patient is assigned to a student, that patient's care becomes the student's responsibility and her instructors. The facility has a contract with the program that clearly delinates this course of action. You may feel, that the patient remains yours but in reality, he/she does not, while under the care of the student. And, quite frankly, if you inserted yourself into one of my student's clinical experience, I would hold a private discussion with you, regarding responsibilities. And if that did not do the trick, I would go higher up the foodchain. I am responsible for the actions of my students. And they are responsible for their own actions. And they and I can both be sued, as well as the facility.

You assume responsibility, once again, only when the student reports off.

Grannynurse

Sorry again Granny but according to california Nurse Practice act, I as the assigned RN am responsible for that patient until I am relieved by oncoming or that patient transfers off my unit, one way or another. There is no educational contract that exists that would supercede that code of professional conduct.

Maybe the exception exists wherever in the world you live, however NPA and hospital policy are all very clear on these definitions. Additionally, a student nurse is limited in liability, is unable to receive and carry out physician orders, especially telephone orders, and in most cases charting must be co-signed by the assigned nurse.

Your misconception is rather silly on many levels, are we to assume that a first semester RN student will provide care for a patient on 3 IV drips , a FC and possibly on a tele unit? Who's gonna give the IV push? Also, how many patients do you know that would accept a student providing nursing care without clinical guidance? SHEESH!

[Haunted]

I'm sorry but you are incorrect. When a patient is assigned to a student, that patient's care becomes the student's responsibility and her instructors. The facility has a contract with the program that clearly delinates this course of action. You may feel, that the patient remains yours but in reality, he/she does not, while under the care of the student. And, quite frankly, if you inserted yourself into one of my student's clinical experience, I would hold a private discussion with you, regarding responsibilities.

what WHAT???? Sounds like a threat! :rotfl:

And if that did not do the trick, I would go higher up the foodchain.

Higher up on the foodchain? Granny, the buck stops with me! I'm a REGISTERED NURSE, not a fish! Too funny. :rotfl:

:rotfl:

I am responsible for the actions of my students. And they are responsible for their own actions. And they and I can both be sued, as well as the facility.

Yes students must have malpractice insurance to be in a program, but if a litigious patient or family member get's funky over an incident who else do you think they hang out to dry? THE ASSIGNED NURSE, aka Little Ol Me!

I love working with students and really enjoy the instructors. You kinda sound like the xception to that rule!

You assume responsibility, once again, only when the student reports off.

Grannynurse.

[VickyRN, MSN, DNP, RN]

I'm sorry but you are incorrect. When a patient is assigned to a student, that patient's care becomes the student's responsibility and her instructors. The facility has a contract with the program that clearly delinates this course of action. You may feel, that the patient remains yours but in reality, he/she does not, while under the care of the student. And, quite frankly, if you inserted yourself into one of my student's clinical experience, I would hold a private discussion with you, regarding responsibilities. And if that did not do the trick, I would go higher up the foodchain. I am responsible for the actions of my students. And they are responsible for their own actions. And they and I can both be sued, as well as the facility.

You assume responsibility, once again, only when the student reports off.

Grannynurse

At one of our main facilities (a large area teaching hospital), it is actually written in their P & P, that the care of the patient and any adverse outcomes are the responsibility of the primary nurse, regardless of the fact that the patient may be attended by a student and nursing instructor.

[Haunted]

Sorry I really screwed up my response to Denise/Granny! I think the point that has been made is that, YES! there are crabby nurses who impede and prejudice a students progress and perception of the nursing professional and in the past I have ignored them or killed them with kindness.

This topic has spun into a "Who's responsibility is it anyway" thread. I will read responses with interest!

[ceecel.dee, MSN, RN]

Hang in there and resolve not to be "that kind of nurse" when your turn comes.

Ditto!

[studentdeb]

I just started as a unit secretary and have spent my 3rd day today on the floor and the secretary that is training me appears to be crabby all the time, she never smiles, seems to get aggravated when she is taking off orders if there is alot and makes me feel like I am bothering her. I've tried joking with her and she just doesn't budge from her "stone" like appearance. She makes me want to run out the door.

I know she probably wasn't given a choice to train me, but she could act as if she is a little happy. I can't wait until I start on my own so I can learn better and just enjoy being there.

From what I've seen, there are few nurses in this floor who seem crabby and unhappy, but the majority seem to be fine and are very nice.

It's a shame that people get that way in their job, I guess maybe they need to make a change so they can be happy again.

Debi

[grannynurse FNP]

So how is the oncoming nurse supposed to receive report. From the student, or the instructor?

IN programs I have taught, the student reports to the nurse assuming care of the patient, with the instructor overseeing her/his student.

Grannynurse :balloons:

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

And how are you able to do this with a group of, say, 8 students?

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

I'm thinking of the wacky shifts that the nurses work on the floor i did clinicals on, and it would have been impossible for our instructor to do the report with all the students.

[grannynurse FNP]

No disrespect. I don't care how many times you pull me aside. If a patient is in my assignment on the assignment board and student happens to have them, I'm not ignoring that patient.

Here nursing students don't have their own assignment separate from the nurses. The students are usually assigned a nurse, rather than a patient assignment and it's a collaborative effort, with ultimately the staff nurses in charge.

Granted if the student causes the patient harm, that is not my responsibility.

I love working with students. I had one with me the other day. The only thing she was allowed to do was a bed bath, so she did that and shadowed me the rest of the time and we gave each other rave reviews at the end of the day (which was only ten hours for her).

Then, I am not surprised that there are not more problems. The responsibility of an instructor is to supervise the students under her. It is not nor should it ever be, the responsibility of a staff nurse to supervise a student. You are not paid to do this nor, would your malpractice insurance cover you, if you did. The purpose of a clinical experience is to give students guided clinical experience. That means that the instructor choose patients that fit the needs of her/his students and the theory they are currently covering. They are expected to know the drugs, diet, treatments, IVs, tests, diagnose, etc of each of their patients. To assign a student to a staff nurse, no disrespect intended, is putting the responsibility off on someone who is not qualified, even for as something as minor as a bed bath. And spending ten hours, on a floor, just doing a bedbath and following you around, is really not providing much of a clinical experience for the student, no matter how good you are-no disrespect intended.

I have always had written objectives for my students, with the types of patients they can handle and with the aim of providing them the best clinical exerpience possible. Sorry but the p[rogram is not very good, in my opinion.

Denise :balloons: