I have been working at my current workplace, a hospital downtown, for a little over a year now as full-time. As of Monday I will transfer to part-time because I am starting a new job closer to home. Both managers are aware.
This afternoon I received a phone call from my current manager scheduling a meeting with her, human resources and a union representative on Monday. She would not give me any details except that it was SERIOUS, which is what worries me most, and she would pay me for my time (odd but nice). I asked if it was about a patient (which is my #1 concern) and she said no. But that's all she would tell me. I know this will be at the back of my mind all weekend long, stressing me out! This is the first time I've been asked to come in on my day off and meet with people other than her. Any ideas what it could be about?
Although I don't think this behind the reason and if it was I will tell her the truth. I called in sick yesterday. I don't call in often ... maybe a handful the entire year. This time it was legitimate, I had schedule conflicts at both workplaces and couldn't find anyone to pick-up my shift. It left me with no choice. I can't be at 2 places at once. I called in really early so they a good amount of time to call or a replacement.
If they let me go, I would be OK with that. If not, I was planning on leaving soon or later. I was unhappy there. I just feel the situation could have been dealt with better. Thank you for all your comments/criticisms, they have given me a different perspective about the situation and nursing in general. I appreciate it. I wouldn't be able to talk this openly anywhere else.
Sweetheart, that is the great thing about these interest-specific forums - they are GREAT for airing this kind of thing to the very and only people who can understand. I'm very pleased you had this resource to turn to. Tbh, I've been in this kind of situation, where management has had you on the end of a very long, very dodgy pole, so many times it isn't funny. What I wouldn't have given to had had such a group to turn to.
In the end, you made a wrong decision for all the right reasons as seen from your POV. Now put it behind you, move on to your new job and enjoy it.
God bless you and be with you - you sound like a kind of nurse I'd have loved to have on my team.
Meadow85, first off I am going to say this not to make you feel badly, but there appears to be some people who do not seem to be aware of how this is an issue for an employer
To call in sick accepting sick pay for that shift and ;yes to end up caught at another job, yes it is considered fraud. A form of stealing. While Meadow was not aware of this, it does remain a good lesson to us all..
Fraud was the exact term I had heard them use at work when it happened to a co-worker who called in sick but went to their second job. This must be a common type of conclusion for management
Indeed it is.
I think it's petty to call and check on her. My guess is the manager is mad she got another job and she called with revenge on her mind. She didn't make an innocent call to go over a question she had with the patient. She wanted to find her doing wrong and got her wish.
That doesn't mean Meadow was right because she wasn't. She made a mistake and handled this situation poorly. I'm sure she learned a good lesson but going after her license for this would be malicious and extreme.
Typical anti-management rhetoric, if I may say so. IMO she was just doing her job. She had reasonable concerns that the sickie was a cover-up and it was her job to prove or disprove her suspicions and take appropriate action.
Question is, were her actions entirely appropriate?
Creating the atmosphere of tension and duress was most INappropriate and smacks of a witch-hunt mentality. That's neither nice nor necessary. Making such a gargantuan affair out of it - it being a first offence - was the same. It was - in effect - a single, minor indiscretion and her actions were totally over the top. I think the manager, though correct in her concern, was showing signs of being an extreme control-freak.
In the end, there is only this to say, meadows - you fell foul of a nasty piece of work. Shake the dust off and forgeddaboudit! She not worth the angst!
This thread has certainly evoked many opinions, concerns and trains of thought.
I noticed that the OP stated she is in Canada.
Each province develops "standards of practice" which are based on the CNA's "code of ethics". Although I have not reviewed each province's standards, I believe (unfortunately for the OP) that there may have been a breech on that level.
Union contracts, hospital expectations and standards of practice all need to be considered in this case. And yes, unfortunately calling in sick for one job and going to work at another is something one can be fired over and disciplined at the college level for IF it is a long-term practice.
The OP has told us she didn't know that it would be a problem, and has learned the hard way that it is. Unfortunately for the bulk of us, there are some people who have made a practice of purposefully doing this (i.e. taking sick leave from one facility and working FT at another) and have been disciplined by the provincial college of nurses and have made management very suspicious of situations such as these.
OP...you have learned your lesson. From my experiences, I have only seen this go to the college of nurses when it has been going on over a long period of time.
Check your province's discipline decisions and see what has happened in the past. I don't think you fit the bill.
AllNurses.com is an invaluable resource. We can talk anonymously here (if careful) about issues no one can understand that is not a nurse. I've discussed numerous difficult issues on this forum, and have received an incredible amount of wise advise and amazing support here.
I cannot confide in my co-workers because unfortunately word gets around fast around here. When I got the new job, I told 1 person and all of a sudden everyone is asking and congratulating me etc. Lesson learned. Keep your personal life private.
I think the OP could have handled the situation better(ie if you're going to lie to your employer about being sick, cover your tracks:D)but I still think her NM is petty and not someone I'd want to work for. I agree with those who think the manager was mad the OP had another job and was just waiting for an opportunity. If it were me, I'd suggest she pucker up and kiss my chubby white hienie and do it fast, because I'm outta here!
And I work in a union facility-they are not allowed to interrogate you about why you are taking sick time. If they get really persistant, you can file a grievance for harassment.
At any rate, lesson learned for the OP on several fronts..One, regarding the sick time and two, realizing that there are some real doozies of employers and that no one should stay in a sucky job.
Best of luck, OP.
My union rep. said she could not file a grievance on my behalf because ultimately I screwed up. It doesn't matter how the manager handled the situation or how she treated me.
You sound very intelligent, meadow. Some people come to this site, post a thread about a situation such as you have, then get all mad when people tell their honest opinions.
Instead, you are totally open to learning more, and hearing all sides. I really like that, you sound like you have what it takes and I admire that.
So, if I call in sick, and am not really sick, is that considered fraud? My union contract says nothing about "fraud changes" if sick time is used for non-sick days. It just says I am entitled to XX amount of hours sick pay per month worked. Just sayin...
What I now know is that in my province that is considered faud. When you call in sick you better be physically sick lying in bed. When I had some time to think about it I realized that if this was true then that would mean that most employees where I work are committing fraud, since we get sick calls almost every day. They just don't get caught. How do I know they are not physically sick? They tell me stories about how they spent their day off driving up north to the cottage. They don't get follow-up phone calls because the manager has a hunch. I got one because she knew I had another job. My union rep. told me you could call in sick and bump into your boss at the mall and still get around it. Funny how things work.
Some of you all are doing the same thing that happens in a crime.
Mr. X does this and that. Mrs. B reports it. Instead of everyone focusing on the fact that Mr. X indeed committed the crime everyone instead is mad at Mrs. B for being a snitch or petty or whatever...
It's a bit immature.
How can you judge someone you don't know?
Ultimately the OP made the mistake. The management is legit in it's claim of fraud as it is a fraud. Look up your state law concerning sick time. They also have a right to check up on you.
Even if they didn't have the right, the OP lied... Even if it wasn't fraud and not a problem they would still have to address the lie. Employees don't just get to lie. A nurse or anyone without integrity and honesty is headed for trouble.
I bet many nurses here wouldn't tolerate someone that forgot to give insulin and then lied about it. If you dropped a patient and then lied about it would you get mad a HR for wanting to disciplining you?
It's a business... Why do people expect businesses NOT to run like businesses?
Although I see where you are coming from, I felt your example was a bit extreme. Lying about your nursing practice could result in death. Calling in sick is not a life/death situation. It is not the same thing. Sadly, it took me awhile but I now realize that it is all about money. It isn't about the safety of nurses or patients or else we wouldn't be short-staffed, have so many sick calls and poor morale. Its about profit.
Let me ask you this, if a police office arrests someone do they not have to tell the person what they are being charged for and explain to them their rights? And what if the officer used excessive force, does it make it right, because the accused was found guilty in the end?
I have always, always refused to be called in 'On Monday" for something without being told what it is. I personally would call the union rep and tell him/her you want a reason for this meeting.
So, if I call in sick, and am not really sick, is that considered fraud? My union contract says nothing about "fraud changes" if sick time is used for non-sick days. It just says I am entitled to XX amount of hours sick pay per month worked. Just sayin...
I just found my employee handbook. whew can't imagine why I kept it, but here goes.
Cause for Termination or discharge
Falsification of reason for absence
So I would have to say you call in sick and is it a form of fraud Oh who knows what it is. That is why managment gets the big bucks to figure out.
I think this is the one that pertains to sick days and such. Course now how does one define sick? To me I don't feel good, I am too tired as I got no sleep the night before even though I tried to sleep, I am ruminating over personal problems to a degree that I fear I would be unsafe at work. colds, flu, etc goes without saying.
Does it mean I stay home if I have called in sick.. Yah sure you betcha. It would be just my luck if I were not sick and was out and about I would run into someone at work. So I stay home.
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Sister Fox
85 Posts
Sweetheart, that is the great thing about these interest-specific forums - they are GREAT for airing this kind of thing to the very and only people who can understand. I'm very pleased you had this resource to turn to. Tbh, I've been in this kind of situation, where management has had you on the end of a very long, very dodgy pole, so many times it isn't funny. What I wouldn't have given to had had such a group to turn to.
In the end, you made a wrong decision for all the right reasons as seen from your POV. Now put it behind you, move on to your new job and enjoy it.
God bless you and be with you - you sound like a kind of nurse I'd have loved to have on my team.
Indeed it is.
Typical anti-management rhetoric, if I may say so. IMO she was just doing her job. She had reasonable concerns that the sickie was a cover-up and it was her job to prove or disprove her suspicions and take appropriate action.
Question is, were her actions entirely appropriate?
Creating the atmosphere of tension and duress was most INappropriate and smacks of a witch-hunt mentality. That's neither nice nor necessary. Making such a gargantuan affair out of it - it being a first offence - was the same. It was - in effect - a single, minor indiscretion and her actions were totally over the top. I think the manager, though correct in her concern, was showing signs of being an extreme control-freak.
In the end, there is only this to say, meadows - you fell foul of a nasty piece of work. Shake the dust off and forgeddaboudit! She not worth the angst!