Questions about immigrating to Canada

Pediatric Critical Care Columnist · Nov 14, 2009

First of all, welcome to allnurses.com. Your post has been moved to the International forum in a thread of its own because you're asking questions about immigration, which have nothing to do with nursing in Canada at this point. Only a handful of the nurses in Canada right now know much of anything about immigration and IEN registration.

To answer your questions,

1. While it's possible that your application for the CRNE would be rejected due to the amount of time between graduation and application, the only way to know for sure is to apply. But remember you're not applying to write the CRNE, you're applying to be registered as a nurse in a Canadian province, one step of which is to pass the CRNE. Read this: ***Internationally Educated Nurses: VERY IMPORTANT - READ THIS FIRST***

2. The College of Registered Nurses in the province to which you apply will determine if your education will qualify you for registration and thus to write the examination. But remember that you may have to undergo a substantially equivalent competency assessment before they give you eligibility. Read this: FAQ - Substantially Equivalent Competence (SEC) Assessments

3. The Colleges of Registered Nurses have NOTHING to do with immigration requirements. It makes no difference to them if you have PR or if you don't. What they care about is your education, your ethics, your skills and your ability to perform the necessary work of the nurse. Again, you're not applying to write the CRNE, you're applying to become a registered nurse in Canada.

4. Are you looking at moving to BC? That's the only province currently requiring experience from IENs for registration. In their case the 225 hours of experience is paid, supervised work in a facility in BC. It requires your having found an employer willing to give you a job; CRNBC isn't going to do that for you. But when it comes to finding an employer, your lack of experience will be a serious drawback. You'll be competing with nurses who have experience and the ability to walk onto a floor in a hospital and with a little guidance, be able to function independently. And for employers, it's all about the paid work, not the volunteer work. Another thing your lack of work experience in the four years since you completed your education will have an impact on will be your ability to succeed at the SEC and the exam. Without practice we lose those skills.

You have a long road ahead of you before you're ready to write the CRNE. You might also wish to read this: FAQ: The Canadian Registered Nurse Examination (CRNE)

petgroomer · Nov 16, 2009

As the previous poster stated, the only way to know is applying.

In Ontario, for example, you need to have practiced/graduated in the last five years to be able to register. If your proof of safe practice expires before you get your license you'll need to provide new evidence of safe practice, which can be done by completing an approved bridging program. Evidence of safe recent practice/language fluency are not necessary to write the CRNE but to register after passing it.

In your position, I'd apply asap, and I'd be very open minded in case they asked for additional education. It's expensive but the advantages are:

-It's better to be an RN after a year rather than becoming an RPN (if you're lucky) and then going the upgrading route which can take up to three years.

-Completing the program will be used as a proof of language fluency (no need for IELTS/TFI)

-It'l serve as evidence of safe recent practice and will make you more attractive to prospective employers. (Canadian experience is valued a lot more than international experience, don't be fooled into believing otherwise.)

Whatever you decide, good luck and think positively

permedRN · Nov 17, 2009

Thank you so much for your replies. It was a lot of help for me who up to now doesnt know much about canada's way of registering as a nurse. May I know more on the bridging program that was mentioned here ( just in case I lack the education). How many years do I have to study for that? Will that be taken in Canada Universities only? Uhumm, does it costs much? Thank you and God Bless to all..

petgroomer · Nov 18, 2009

The lenght of the bridging program in Canada depends on the results of your assessment/SEC.

After evaluating your file the College will either send you a letter regarding eligibility for CRNE or a letter of directions with the steps to follow to upgrade your education.

There are nurses on this forum who applied in provinces that don't require a BSN yet and then transferred to Ontario. I think they still need to complete their BSN through a recognized university, but they'll do it in a part-time basis and working as RNs in the meantime. IMHO, I wouldn't take the trouble to transfer to Ontario if I was already registered in another province :)

Even if you're not particularly interested in Ontario, I'd recommed you take a look at this CNO report: it'll answer many of your questions and the basic guidelines could be applied to other provinces, even though Ontario has not implemented SEC...yet.

http://www.cno.org/new/notices/NursingFairRegPracticesReport2008.html

permedRN · Nov 19, 2009

Thank you so much petgroomer for ur reply.. but let me clear it that I am also a BSN graduate only that my schooling in BSN became 2 and a half yrs because i'm a second courser here in the Philippines so my other minor subjects from my first course got credited.. also may I ask you if what province should I apply? I mean, I know that the quality of Nursing there in Canada are all the same but is there a province which is not somewhat strict in terms of years of paid employment? Because I fear that after all the expenses I've made on being a permanent resident in your country then I cannot practice nursing, then it's all worthless ( Unless I can find a descent paying job related to my 1st 2 courses,ehehmmm)..Also, I know that this question may somewhat be not related to the topics of this site but may I ask if it is true that if I am a canadian citizen I cannot be a US citizen anymore?? because I am also petitioned in that country as a USRN only that my visa application is still in retrogression .. I hope you guys will not be tired of all my concerns, right now I dont have anyone to asks regarding all these stuff..But all ur replies have been helping me a lot in terms of deciding.. AGain...Thank you and God Bless!!:heartbeat:redbeathe:up:

Fiona59 · Nov 19, 2009

You can't decide on where to live in Canada depending on which province will issue you a practice permit in the fastest method with the least difficulty/inconvenience to you. The rules are in place to ensure that the taxpayers of this country recieve care from competent healthcare proviers.

There is also a downward trend for the demand for overseas nurses. BC, AB, and ONT have ceased recruiting overseas. The maritime provinces are starting to reduce their hiring. Local, Canadian new grads are having a hard time finding first jobs. Our economy has suffered, not as badly as the US perhaps but enough to cause reductions in healthcare funding and the pennypinching has started.

We live in a huge country with extremes in climate. You need to research which area meets your needs.

I'd worry about getting here and finding a job more than obtaining Canadian citizenship and then hopping south to the US. Many Canadians find this attitude offensive and resent being used as a stepping stone for entry inot the US.

It's time to realize that a nursing education no longer guarantees entry into the country or countries of your choice.

g!rL22 · Nov 23, 2009

hi im an RN here n the philippines but have no hospital experience yet. I just would like to ask some tips and advice. Here are my concerns:

I'm applying as a live-in caregiver in canada. if ever my temporary resident visa will be approved, and would become a permanent resident later on, and if i want to pursue my nursing career there, will i be qualified even if i don't get any nursing experience here in the philippines?

if ever i'm already a permanent resident, can my husband (who's also an RN here in the Phil) go directly to canada and apply for CRNE?

can i take the CRNE while i'm still working as a live-in caregiver or a nanny?

some are seeking for a community home care nurse, will my experience as a caregiver (ex;disabled/elderly care) can be considered as an experience? they say for example they require 1-2 yrs related experience, can it be consider if i don't meet the exact required experience since they stated they require an equivalent combination of education, skills and experience?

what are my other options if ever they will not approve my application to take the CRNE because of limited experience?

I hope you could share some tips. I'm just new here and this is my first post...

THANKS a LOT!

petgroomer · Nov 23, 2009

hi im an RN here n the philippines but have no hospital experience yet. I just would like to ask some tips and advice. Here are my concerns:
I'm applying as a live-in caregiver in canada. if ever my temporary resident visa will be approved, and would become a permanent resident later on, and if i want to pursue my nursing career there, will i be qualified even if i don't get any nursing experience here in the philippines?
Yes: the Colleges of Nurses (but the one in BC, which does require Canadian work experience) are able to evaluate your file based on education alone; that being said, experience is always a good point if your education doesn't exactly meet all the requirements to be considered equivalent to that of a nurse educated locally.

if ever i'm already a permanent resident, can my husband (who's also an RN here in the Phil) go directly to canada and apply for CRNE?

Directly to Canada, no: you need to do all the process to sponsor him, unless he wants to spend all the time to apply as an independent worker. CIC is fair (at least theoretically) and the process to reunite family members is (usually) faster if both the sponsor and sponsored meet all the requirements (quite a few). Applying to CRNE directly is not possible, he needs to apply for registration (sticky on top, CRNE).

can i take the CRNE while i'm still working as a live-in caregiver or a nanny?

Sure, once you are given eligibility to write the exam you can do whatever you feel like in the mean time. Very important: study hard for it if you're given the opportunity to take it: three missed shots and back to school.

some are seeking for a community home care nurse, will my experience as a caregiver (ex;disabled/elderly care) can be considered as an experience? they say for example they require 1-2 yrs related experience, can it be consider if i don't meet the exact required experience since they stated they require an equivalent combination of education, skills and experience?

That's a question between you and your prospective employers: any experience that is not as RN is not acceptable by the Colleges, but I'm sure employers will be willing to look into it if you are able to portrait your experience in a good light and make it count towards the position they're looking to fill: resume writing and interview skills come to mind now too. Learn as much as you can while you're not working as a nurse: knowledge is not heavy and you can take it with you anywhere you go

what are my other options if ever they will not approve my application to take the CRNE because of limited experience?

It's not limited experience but education what could play against you during the assessment: the College may suggest you take a bridging program. Since you don't have experience you shouldn't let more than five years lapse between graduation and registration. Your graduation date will be taken as the last time you practice nursing safely, and it needs to be no more than five years to be counted as "recent safe nursing practice". If you don't have the recent practice requirement, you'll need to take a bridging/refresher course even if your original education was deemed as equivalent.

I hope you could share some tips. I'm just new here and this is my first post...
Here is a link that could help you even if you're not coming to Ontario:

http://www.cno.org/new/notices/NursingFairRegPracticesReport2008.html

itsmejuli · Nov 23, 2009

.Also, I know that this question may somewhat be not related to the topics of this site but may I ask if it is true that if I am a canadian citizen I cannot be a US citizen anymore?? because I am also petitioned in that country as a USRN only that my visa application is still in retrogression

I'm a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.

You cannot hold both Canadian and American citizenship in the US.

I will also tell you that there is no shortage of inexperienced RNs here in the US. Many newly licensed RNs are having a difficult time finding jobs across the US.

Don't expect any miracles in either Canada or the US for inexperienced nursing jobs.

Unless you're applying for a US visa lottery or have a serious job offer in the US I doubt that you will get a work permit here. The economy is so bad that there are few jobs to go around.

Silverdragon102, BSN · Nov 23, 2009

I'm a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.
You cannot hold both Canadian and American citizenship in the US.

Are you sure about this as I have seen it written that the US accepts you can be a citizen of another country as long as that country allows dual citizenship.

CIC on dual citizenship http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/publications/dual-citizenship.asp

US INS http://www.uscitizenship.info/uscitizenship-dual-citizen.htm

loriangel14, RN · Nov 24, 2009

Yes you can indeed be a dual citizen with both US and Canadian citizenship.I have a nursing coworker that has both.

Working as a live-in caregiver or nanny is not accepted as nursing experience. You must be working as a licensed nurse for it to count.