Pot Smoking and Nursing

Nurses General Nursing

Published

Im angry.

I work for a small clinic in Northern CA. There are three RN's on staff at all time. Recently our Office Manager decided to start drug testing of all staff including Doctors. Well, one of the Nurses I work with came back positive for marijuana use. My thought was "Well she should not be doing it anyways" I was actually glad to see her get in trouble.

After discusing it with the Doctors they came up with a new unwritten policy. They will overlook marijuana. Basiclly, you can smoke all the pot you want but just on the weekends not during "on call" days. I questioned one of the Doctors about it and his response was to "chill"

Does this seem wrong to anybody else? Do Nurses really smoke pot on there days off?

To all the comments about practice acts... I wonder how many

recreational users even knew what their states NP act said when they go

their license???

george

52% of the recreational users dont know their nurse practice acts when they get their license.

48% hard core stoners know it word for word.

the better question would be WHO CARES?

i dont need some hokey piece of rhetoric to tell me how to live my life. if you revere this then thats good for you.

i know this...i am one damn good nurse. i give my patients everything i have WHILE I AM AT WORK...

i am kind and compassionate and i work for the patient...no matter what.

i dont and never did need a piece of paper to tell me how to do that.

Who cares? Well, your BON cares, your law enforcement agency cares and I bet your patients do too...as nurses are being sued more and more frequently today, which translates to 'they are watching us.'...

Good luck to you Thisnurse, I think you may need it.... I get a mailed list every month listing names of nurses in my state who didn't care about that 'piece of paper' called their nurse practice act...the BON just LOVES to publish their revoked and stipulated licenses for public viewing.

And now I will agree to disagree with Thisnurse's viewpoints; and am sending my sympathies to the original poster and all California nurses who are watching this strange pot tolerance develop in their workplace. This is a tough situation for you, please take care of yourselves! :)

Originally posted by thisnurse

To all the comments about practice acts... I wonder how many

recreational users even knew what their states NP act said when they go

their license???

george

52% of the recreational users dont know their nurse practice acts when they get their license.

48% hard core stoners know it word for word.

the better question would be WHO CARES?

i dont need some hokey piece of rhetoric to tell me how to live my life. if you revere this then thats good for you.

i know this...i am one damn good nurse. i give my patients everything i have WHILE I AM AT WORK...

i am kind and compassionate and i work for the patient...no matter what.

i dont and never did need a piece of paper to tell me how to do that.

thisnurse,

I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt because I really don't know you and this is obviously a hot-button issue for you.

I will admit that your statements worry me. Your nurse practice act is not a "hokey piece of rhetoric". It's the law. It describes and delimits your practice. Your are accountable to know it and adhere to it.

As a nurse, it is shocking to discover that nursing isn't just a 9 to 5 job that you leave behind at the end of the day. You can punch out (on the time clock) from being at work, but not from being a nurse. And no, I'm not saying that we wear a mantle of sainthood (because we don't) but if our own knowledge doesn't permeate our own self-care and our own self-knowledge, then we will likely live at constant odds with who we are and what we do. Taken to its' _worst_ extreme, it amounts to living a lie and most of us just can't do that for long and still like ourselves.

for most of us, we recognize the dichotomy between what we do and what we recommend (exercise, eat right, practice good self-coping, use alcohol in moderation if at all). This real life experience teaches us to tolerate and understand our client's failings when they, too, are imperfect.

But we all recognize that a line exists when a nurse is so far away from what he or she teaches that it erodes his or her credibility. Drugs and alcohol can certainly cause people to cross the line, as can morbid obesity, when a nurse generates excessive med errors, when a nurse fails to recognize significant problems and leaves you to deal with burgeoning crises repeatedly and on and on.

We accept our fallibility and work toward the highest level of professional practice we can (and that's what "hokey piece of rhetoric is about").

Nurses who flirt with illegal drug use, excessive use of alcohol, misuse of prescription or other drugs, or poor self-care practice risk crossing a line where they erode their credibility significantly AND risk violation of the nurse practice act.

Good luck, thisnurse. This is obviously a close-to-home topic in some realm for you. You've told us "not you" but perhaps someone you really care about. You're in a tough spot and that's not easy.

Peace to all.

as a certified bat (breath alcohol tester), i disagree:

suzannasue,

breathalyzers don't generate a number, they either are positive

or negative.

this is totally incorrect. the bat, administered in our er by me and several others, and by me at several remote, oh locations, was calibrated regularly, and absolutely displayed and printed out quantitative breath alcohols!

the company that i am currently employed by has an absolute zero tolerance policy for both drugs and alcohol. in addition to randoms, a panel 10 and a bat are administered to anyone with an occupational injury. anyone who requests tx for substance abuse is accomodated. if they wait until they test positive; however, they are otd!

i took a male to the occ med's office last year after he dropped a die on his foot. bat restults at 11 in the morning:0.078. this means that he had been drinking the night before, but what was his level at 7 a.m. when he began work, and did this contribute to his accident? :rolleyes:

Suzannasue,

Told you wrong time, wrong place.

I still have big problems with the use of your words (or anybody elses in this context)

It seems to me that in using the word Nazi that easily, it may be one of the reasons to "harmless" the real meaning behind that word and what these "people" did.

Of course I am very aware of that, growing up in a country occupied by Nazi-Germany and now living in a country being one of nazi-Germany greatest allies.

Still, how is it possible that someone smells of alcohol and hasn't drunk a drop?

Take care, Renee

There have been so many good and valid points made here that forming a solid opinion behind which one can stand consistently is a challenge. At heart I have always been a "live and let live" kind of girl, and so it's hard for me to feel that it's truly OK for your employer to monitor what you do on your own time. But I also have never smoked pot, and even though I do find a lot of laws stupid, I have always lived with the notion that it is in my best interest to respect them. If I accept a job with a company that says, "Drugs are illegal and we expect you to refrain", then I don't have much defense for myself if I willfully violate that. The point about people validating and rationalizing what they want to do was also well taken- my husband and I are great fans of all kinds of wine. But it must matter that ETOH is in fact legal. Never having used pot, I cannot accurately compare the after-effects of the two, but it was always my feeling that ETOH is legal partly because it can be enjoyed safely and sensibly. I have some wine nearly every evening but can't remember the last time I got even a buzz, so I know that ETOH can be used with very little, if any, imparment resulting. This of course changes considerably with every drop consumed, and so I fully agree with the concern of being able to detect any hint of it in a co-worker. So much of this argument, I think, lies in the necessity of believing what you're told by the user in question; if someone tells you, "Oh, I just used some mouthwash", it is hard to totally trust that because if you totally trusted this individual you wouldn't have asked in first place. We also are asked to trust in that person's assessment of his or her own abilities (I've only had one drink, one joint, one Benadryl, I got 4 hours of sleep & that's plenty for me, etc). Someone who has never had Benadryl would have a very hard time putting total faith in what he/she was told by someone who had taken it recently and looked or acted a little differently than usual. This kind of trust is hard for most people anyway, but especially for people like us who have the opportunity to hear so much BS and denial from the patients we see. Cynicism sort of grows on its own whether you want it to or not. And even though nurses should not be held to any higher standard of sainthood than anyone else, there are a few factors that set us apart. If my father, who is a banker, goes to work sleep-deprived or post-Benadryl, that's far from ideal, but he is very unlikely to seriously endanger anyone. My job involves a lot more reponsibility for the physical wellbeing of others, which I knew when I took the job, and it's something I take very seriously. I would call in sick if I felt unable to safely care for my patients for any reason because it is part of the responsibillty toward others that I accepted when I chose this profession. I also have a detailed description of how I am to perform my job, and instead of being a company policy, this is a law. My license is of great value to me, and since I'm not the one who made up the rules of how to keep it, I don't have a lot of choice except to abide by them. If I don't like them, then I can get another job with fewer specifics of desired behavior.

Just sort of thinking out loud here, but it is very obvious that this is a real hot button here. We should not judge lest we be judged- other people have lived in circumstances we know nothing about, and everyone is entitled to an opinion. We do need to stand up for and beside each other, and all of our patients deserve the best we can give them.

Semstr,

alas...and once and for all...the use if the foamy alcohol foam for hand cleaning generates a powerful etoh aroma...i have had pts ask what I was drinking after I had used this product and have put my hands before their noses for them to know exactly where the aroma of alcohol originated. The "fruity" smell lof etoh lingers for only a few moments but there have been several nurses other than my friend sent for breathalyzers due to the "foam". There gave also been nurses sent for breathalyzer testing at this facility because they "smelled a little fruity"...all results were negative and the culprit of the suspicious odor was never determined yet it was understood that on certain days when "certain nurses" were working, the complaints of etoh smell were more frequently logged. Thus,their attempt to weed out those who did not conform to their belief system. their high expectations of physical attractiveness,their language,etc...was

manifested by the reporting to administration the nurses they hoped to ruin.

My terminology shall stand. I use those words with full meaning.

I know what "those people" did. The term was not used casually.

And remember...those who fail to learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.

Perhaps we should agree to disagree.

[]

Still, how is it possible that someone smells of alcohol and hasn't drunk a drop?

Take care, Renee [/b]

Could it be the fruity breath of a diabetic, or some other carbohydrate as it is metabolized?:)

Someone mentioned being a pot smoker for several years and using it on a daily basis. From my generation, it was a "fad" thing to do. The people I know from high school and college that did that outgrew it. Not everyone who uses pot HAS to use it and continues to use it. It's just like alcohol - not every that has had a drink HAS to keep drinking and continues to drink.

Yes, Sin City has it's vices to be sure. Voters approved the medicinal marijuana law without any problem. STILL, nurses are held to a standard.

If I get together with my old high school buddies and someone pulls out a bong for "old times sake", do I partake? Would it be prudent of me to do so? Is it worth my license being revoked? Hell no. They can get high all they want, sleep it off and stagger down the Strip the next day. As a professional, I don't have that option. Well, I can stagger, but I prefer to sashay. :roll

I think the original issue in this thread was whether or not it was right to insist on drug testing, only to ignore the results when an employee came back positive.

MrsNurseCA, I understand being miffed by this turn of events. I too, would question the rationale behind drug screening when steps weren't taken (as far as you know) for corrective measures. But beyond that, I don't see that there is much you personally can do to change the current situation, unless you decide to take this to the next level and contact higher authorities. Tough call.

On another note, if I speed, cheat on my taxes, engage in sexual activities cited illegal by our laws, let my child stay home for a hangnail, or don't wear my seatbelt .... it will NOT endanger my patients. Most DO affect the public, however, so I PERSONALLY choose to refrain from participating in those behaviors in general.

It sends a pretty poor message to the people we're trying to educate, when we advocate illegal and possibly health endangering activities.

::Returning to her sheltered, cloistered, white picket fenced, Pollyanna, white bread life::

Lori:)

Specializes in cardiac, diabetes, OB/GYN.

I think there is quite a bit of "middle ground"...Probably all we can hope for is to at least meet on some common ground and agree to disagree...Nurses should not HAVE to be considered above everyone else. Nurses are human. They have a right to lives outside their workplace. We may not and DO not always agree to what transpires after work, but this country guarantees us equal freedom..That is why we reside and work here. I'm proud to be an American and NO one is going to take that away from me.

I haven't elected to partake in drugs. That doesn't make me an angel. That simply speaks of a personal choice. However, I do NOT support random testing on a whim..If a policy is in place prior to hire, and an employee ( Nurse or otherwise) , is impaired, I support intervention and action...

There is no need or reason to attempt to highten opposite views with either name calling or hightly argumentative banter. It does nothing to solve the discrepancy of opinion and, thought the majority of people involved in that sort of reply, in some way appear to think it swings the pendulum of opinion to THEIR point of view, what it does , in REALITY, is force people to be reactionary vs actually "listening"

Opposing viewpoints make UP a discussion and don't generally detract from it...

We're all different, and I personlly respect and enjoy the fact that we are, but NO ONE does or will EVER have the right to surveille me outside of work unless while AT work I engender some sort of impairment to either myself, my co workers or patients..Period....No one ELSE need agree with me on every facet, but a true American has every right to expect some privacy outside the workplace....Like the song says, "This is MY country"....Work is SECOND to family and life in general...And nurses, simply because they are nurses, have every right and expectation to be treated and treat themselves and others, as everyone ELSE does....

This has been a subject of debate for many years now..... Here are the facts: 1. It is considered an illegal substance.

2. Yes, you may be impared for 24 hours. at a declining rate. therefore the longer it has been since you toked the less impared one is.

3. Alcohol is just as bad if not worse than smokin a doobie. I am a ER Nurse and I have seen Hundreds if not thousands of cases where people have cause injury and death to others by thier drinking. I can not think of any cases that i was involved with personaly where people were killed due to someone smoking pot.

Is it right??? People keep saying that it is in your system for 28 days, NOT SO. It will be in your system for 28 days if you are a habitual user. If you smoke pot once in 1 day it is gone. Now if you do an ounce at one time it will be there but just a few hits from a pipe or a joint NOT.

Also hospitals are quick to jump all over people when they test positive for MJ. I will let you in on a story that happened to me. I was drug screened and I tested positive for pot. Here is the kick, I dont use. I was forced to resign from my job. I was turned in to my state board, sent to a 10 day in patient evaluation for chemicaldependency, Had numerous drug tests ( which were all negative) had a hair follicle test taken which showed up negative. # doctors who deemed me not chemically dependant. Had a DNA sample test performed on the original sample taken by the hospital. But guess what, the hospital failed to maintain that sample so therefor it could not be tested for my DNA nor could it be re drug tested. I ended up getting screwed by my state board. I would have been better off if i would have smoked.

I know a lot of nurses who partake in this kind of event. Smoking a doob. Never once have i ever smelled it on them at work, or saw any indication of usage. i know they use but It never effected thier job performance. I work in a Level I trauma center in a charity hospital. I know what people look like when they are high, i know the behavior patterns. Nurse who use AFTER work are not necasarily impaired to where patient safety becomes an issue. I would let most of them be my nurse any day of the week. Those that i wouldnt, well i wouldn't let them be my nurse even if they didnt toke. Will the laws ever change. NO

Will any nursing board look the other way NO. If you are going to do it, Dont do it before work and for gods sake dont get caught you will be in the ringer and there isnt anything one can do about it. I jumpede through all the hoops came out perfect and still got screwed by the board.

THINK ABOUT IT, IS THE HIGH REALLY WORTH ALL THE TROUBLE???

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