Pa None Smoking!

LydiaNN · Oct 23, 2005

So making people move to another state makes more sense than having people move down the block to an establishment that better suits their needs/wants?
Sure.
So then why stop there?
I wasn't kidding about the cows. They are the leading cause of cow dung, and I'm not able to eat when this smell blows into the windows of my home. So I guess there should be a ban on cows, and anyone who wants to have them will have to move to a "cow-friendly" state.
Yep, that makes perfect sense.
As for the poor employees, well I work in an environment where there are quite a few nasty things in the air. My employer cannot get rid of all of the things that are bad for me, so there I am. Where do I file the necessary papers to ban steel mills?

Oh my, we really must get a tongue in cheek smilie for this board. I thought the "move to a tobacco friendly state" notion was so ridiculous that my facetiousness would be clear.

dreatx · Oct 23, 2005

Of course there are plenty of things that I believe the government should stay out of. To expound on these would be to hijack this thread. I have shared plenty of my opinions about what the government should and should not do during my tenure on this board. Lots of the regulars can back me up on this! Should I choose to expound further, I will be sure to post a new thread.

Interesting. What I will say is that you are on a slippery slope. This country has entered an era of arbitrarily enforcing the will of a voting plurality on the entire population. This smoking issue is one small thing. It will snowball. Liberals and conservatives alike are on the side of legislating every aspect of human behavior. I will be around this board for a while so maybe we will get to debate other such incursions into the area of personal freedom and responsibility. And I bet THE MAN will make inroads into something you care about, too. The reason i am adamant about this issue is because when you give an inch they take a mile. One day people will be forced to do something that is truly bizarre and unreasonable and it will be justified in the same way this smoking ban foolishness is justified.

RainDreamer, BSN, RN · Oct 24, 2005

I can't go barefoot into a restaurant, right? Why can't I? I hate wearing shoes, I rather go barefoot. But of course I put shoes on when I go inside a restaurant because it's gross and unclean to be barefoot in a place where people eat. Same with smoking, it's gross to be smoking in a place where people eat.

And if it's MY restaurant can I say "everyone can come in here and eat barefoot!!"? Can I? Or will the health department not really like that too much?

LydiaNN · Oct 24, 2005

Of course there are plenty of things that I believe the government should stay out of. To expound on these would be to hijack this thread. I have shared plenty of my opinions about what the government should and should not do during my tenure on this board. Lots of the regulars can back me up on this! Should I choose to expound further, I will be sure to post a new thread.
Interesting. What I will say is that you are on a slippery slope. This country has entered an era of arbitrarily enforcing the will of a voting plurality on the entire population. This smoking issue is one small thing. It will snowball. Liberals and conservatives alike are on the side of legislating every aspect of human behavior. I will be around this board for a while so maybe we will get to debate other such incursions into the area of personal freedom and responsibility. And I bet THE MAN will make inroads into something you care about, too. The reason i am adamant about this issue is because when you give an inch they take a mile. One day people will be forced to do something that is truly bizarre and unreasonable and it will be justified in the same way this smoking ban foolishness is justified.

You speak of the slippery slope as if this smoking ban were the first time government involvement in public matters has been debated. I'd venture to say that people have been objecting to one or another of governmental "incursions into the area of personal freedom" since governments began. If we are on a slippery slope, then we are somewhere in the middle of it, certainly not at the top. And all this talk about enforcement of smoking bans confuses me- is it the bans themselves you object to, or the enforcement of them? As far as people "one day" doing something bizarre and unreasonable; IMHO, that happens every minute of every day.

Monica RN,BSN · Oct 24, 2005

Florida passed that law about a year ago.At least true in Marion County.. not sure about the rest of the state. (I think) time flys so it could have been a bit longer than that.. Voted in during the Nov. elections and became law in january (of which ever yr it was) There is no smoking in restraunts and most bars.

Corvette Guy · Oct 24, 2005

I can't go barefoot into a restaurant, right? Why can't I? I hate wearing shoes, I rather go barefoot. But of course I put shoes on when I go inside a restaurant because it's gross and unclean to be barefoot in a place where people eat. Same with smoking, it's gross to be smoking in a place where people eat.
And if it's MY restaurant can I say "everyone can come in here and eat barefoot!!"? Can I? Or will the health department not really like that too much?

:yelclap:

Well chosen words!

Else567 · Oct 24, 2005

PA just passed that it will be a none smoking state and resturants and bars have to comply within 2 years!! :balloons: WOOOHOOOO:

Hello All from balmy NorthEast,Pa.

In response to Lisa,stating that Pa will be a non smoking state in 2 years.I live in Pa,& have not heard a thing about that!

Can you tell me from which source your quoting ?

Thanks

Elsie

Corvette Guy · Oct 24, 2005

And what about the people who work in these establishments? Is there some reason they shouldn't be covered by OSHA protections? Are they meant to choose between making a living and not being exposed to a toxin that may make them cause them discomfort, asthma, allergies, or even worse, die a horrible death? We've had a smoking ban in bars for years in this state, and guess what? People get used to it.
Just as we choose to do most everything else we do in life, I imagine people choose those jobs. That really is an appalling argument because these bans do cuase some bars to go under so please don't act as though you care about those workers since many of them find themsleves out of work after these bans and business owners lose their businesses after these bans. The small neighborhood joints get killed by this foolishness. And no little children hang out at these spots.
Ah, yes, you have the right to do whatever you please on your property, with the proviso that you have put into your own post... as long as it's not against the law. If smoking in public places is illegal where you live, how do you figure that you can smoke there just because you happen to own the place? Do you believe yourself to be free to commit other crimes there, too?
Smoking is not illegal. It would be better if they just outlawed smoking. That would be different. The bans state you cannot use a legal substance on your property.

That would be fine with me if smoking cigarettes were illegal, yet I seriously dubt that will ever happen considering the tobacco lobbyist, etc.

1BlessedRN · Oct 24, 2005

Illicit drugs are illegal. That's what makes them illicit. Alcohol abuse that puts anyone else in harm's way is also against the law. Smoking isn't banned because it annoys anyone, it is banned because second hand smoke is a known carcinogen, and smokers have no constitutional freedom to expose others to this danger. Noise pollution is also illegal. This is why there are local ordinances defining when annoying noise becomes pollution. Even bratty kids can be prosecuted when the behavior escalates to where it causes physical or property damage.

:yeah: :yeah: :yeah: well said!!!

Someday-C.R.N.A. · Oct 24, 2005

I can't go barefoot into a restaurant, right? Why can't I? I hate wearing shoes, I rather go barefoot. But of course I put shoes on when I go inside a restaurant because it's gross and unclean to be barefoot in a place where people eat. Same with smoking, it's gross to be smoking in a place where people eat.
And if it's MY restaurant can I say "everyone can come in here and eat barefoot!!"? Can I? Or will the health department not really like that too much?

As a matter of fact, YES.

You CAN open a restaurant and serve barefoot diners.

Some religions/cultures demand it.

And discriminating against someone's religion/culture is illegal.

The healt dept. will make sure your food standards are up to snuff, and be on their way.

So go ahead and open 'er up. .......I like to go barefoot myself.

Balder_LPN, LPN · May 16, 2006

I had to bump this thread, cause I just loved this discussion. In the meantime WA state has enacted a smoking ban here.

Feelgood liberalism at it's best. If you dont know what that is I'll define it real quick

Feelgood Leberalism: Generally middle and upperclass liberals who feel guilty about all that they have, like to return to the more deprived portion of the population by passing laws for "thier own good" or "societal good" when in actuality they have acomplished nothing more than assuaging their own guilt by going home with a warm glow (Feelgood) about all the greater good they have done.

I think that makes sense, lets apply it here.

Since nonsmokers dont like to go to restaurants and bars with smoke they often stay out of them (same for employees) so for actually protecting people they have done little to nothing. But it sure made them all FELLGOOD when they walked out of that voting booth!

In reality the 25ft from an opening in a public building had to go because in downtown areas that put people in danger in the middle of the street (no kidding). Now all you have to do is walk down the street to get second hand smoke, but it is not in the bar; where it was confined to those who made the choice to be exposed.

Another thing, we have some cigar clubs where you pay to put your cigars in the humidor and stop by to smoke with your friends; Guess what? OUT OF BUISINESS!! To me that seems like an Unconstitutional denial of Due process.

However the Native Americans sure love it. The Indian casinos are the only places you can smoke around here now. And buisiness is up for them.

I'm fed up with libs shoving stuff down my throat "for my own good"

chase4myheart · May 16, 2006

I am a smoker and I am in the nursing program. All that I can say is that I guess my Marlboro's have saved many of a person's life when I am stressed out. I know that smoking contradicts everything that I am learning in nursing school, but it's my choice. I don't force anyone to sit beside me when I'm smoking, and I don't try to shove my habits down someone else's throat. I try to be respectful of the nonsmokers. I agree with what was posted earlier. I feel that the good old Land of the Free is going to be a thing of the past. When the government starts regulating so many personal aspects of our live's then we are headed toward Communism. I'm sure that the people in the Soviet Union are told that the many laws that they have are for their own good. Obesity is a major cause of diabetes and heart disease. Should the government pass laws to make sure that everyone maintain's their correct body weight? I'm sure that would save the healthcare industry and insurance companies billions of dollars. Obese people cause injuries to nurses when nurses try to move them. Well, let's just pass a law that Americans can only consume x amount of calories per day. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it. I think that some things are just private and should be left to the person's own discretion. I think that smoking is one of those things. When the government starts invading on your rights, where will it end? I don't think that anything good will come out of it.