OMG...32 pts!

That sounds more like LTC nurse/patient ratio, who are prodominately stable, but a hospital with an ICU!!! Holy cow!!! Talk about unsafe work environment. I'm just getting ready to go work at a LTC facility where I have 32 residents, but if all goes as well same stuff, different day and I barely get by. I wish you the best of luck and of course I would be raising He!! for a long time to come for this high of a liability. I thought that those type of numbers were unheard of in a hospital, guess I was wrong. GOOD LUCK!!!!!!

Usually the days and nights when I expected trouble it wasn't that bad. It is when everything seems ok that the brown stuff comes flying out of nowhere. I wish you the best.

Wow, 4 nurses sounds like a dream to me....but do you take care of the ICU patients too? What kind of floor do you work on? I am medsurg and 4 nurses with 32 patients would be wonderful.....

Wow, 4 nurses sounds like a dream to me....but do you take care of the ICU patients too? What kind of floor do you work on? I am medsurg and 4 nurses with 32 patients would be wonderful.....

Are you really serious? If you are taking more patients than this 1/10.5 ratio than your hospital is setting you and your patients up for a bad situation. I think I would be looking at other options.

trmr- are you kidding??? You have 32 patients with 3 nurses or less? Do you have LPNs or CNAs to help you? I dont know how it would be possible to provide adequate patient care to 10 patients in one shift?

I may be a new nurse, but that just doesnt seem safe to me.

I have only been working in the ICU for a month now, but I have 2 patients that I do full care on, and I can barely get out on time.

If I were you I would write a letter stating something along the lines of "Due to the staffing shortage and the high census I believe that this is not safe practice, I will work my shift and care for my patient assignment to the best of my ability, but can not guarantee safety for all patients." Make a copy for yourself, and that way if you were to end up in court you will have something to lean on. There is nothing wrong with that, and if you walk due to high census isn't that patient abandonment?

There is nothing wrong with that, and if you walk due to high census isn't that patient abandonment?

It's only patient abandonment if you have recieved report, and then to do report off to anyone

Wow, 4 nurses sounds like a dream to me....but do you take care of the ICU patients too? What kind of floor do you work on? I am medsurg and 4 nurses with 32 patients would be wonderful.....

trmr, do you really take care of 8 or more patients per shift on a med-surg floor and if so, what shift are you working and if so, where is this hospital so I can be sure never to go there!!! Girl, that is so unsafe and in my experienced opinion, impossible to do. I really feel sorry for you and your license if you do have to handle that many patients. Do you have a union or any nurses standing up for nurses' rights and patients' rights? I' stunned.:uhoh21::uhoh21:

If I were you I would write a letter stating something along the lines of "Due to the staffing shortage and the high census I believe that this is not safe practice, I will work my shift and care for my patient assignment to the best of my ability, but can not guarantee safety for all patients." Make a copy for yourself, and that way if you were to end up in court you will have something to lean on. There is nothing wrong with that, and if you walk due to high census isn't that patient abandonment?

The issue isn't getting sued (which almost never happens, though nurses worry about it incessantly): the issue is getting hauled before your Board of Nursing over knowingly taking on unsafe care ratios, if a complaint was made.

All that a letter such as this would do is demonstrate on paper that the nurse KNEW beforehand that things were unsafe, and still took the patient assignment. A nursing board (or if it came to that, a plaintiff's lawyer in court) would be all over that.

As another poster said, it isn't abandonment if you haven't taken the assignment. The safest thing is to refuse such an assignment. Period. The hospital has a problem. The nurse should not make that hospital's problem her problem. And as long as nurses will put up with that, hospitals will not do what needs to be done to get more nurses.

The OP said: "I called our super, and she said that was true, and they are having no luck finding a nurse to agree to come and help out. " The reality is that they simply haven't tried hard enough. They can offer incentive pay or whatever, but if the long-suffering (and I guarantee you they are suffering) nurses will take these ratios, the hospital will do nothing more than sigh that "We couldn't find anybody else." To which the nurse needs to answer, "Fine, then you've lost me." And walk out the door. Ratios like this are a snake pit.

The issue isn't getting sued (which almost never happens, though nurses worry about it incessantly): the issue is getting hauled before your Board of Nursing over knowingly taking on unsafe care ratios, if a complaint was made.

All that a letter such as this would do is demonstrate on paper that the nurse KNEW beforehand that things were unsafe, and still took the patient assignment. A nursing board (or if it came to that, a plaintiff's lawyer in court) would be all over that.

As another poster said, it isn't abandonment if you haven't taken the assignment. The safest thing is to refuse such an assignment. Period. The hospital has a problem. The nurse should not make that hospital's problem her problem. And as long as nurses will put up with that, hospitals will not do what needs to be done to get more nurses.

The OP said: "I called our super, and she said that was true, and they are having no luck finding a nurse to agree to come and help out. " The reality is that they simply haven't tried hard enough. They can offer incentive pay or whatever, but if the long-suffering (and I guarantee you they are suffering) nurses will take these ratios, the hospital will do nothing more than sigh that "We couldn't find anybody else." To which the nurse needs to answer, "Fine, then you've lost me." And walk out the door. Ratios like this are a snake pit.

I disagree. Stating in a letter that you will do the best of your ability is not wrong. Whats the alternative? You walk, screw your co-workers even more, and the patients are in even more jeopardy. Ratios as described as above in my hospital would probably only happen in a environmental disaster, and in that situation you work to the best of your ability.

It's only patient abandonment if you have recieved report, and then to do report off to anyone

In some states, if you show up for work and then leave, whether or not you take report or not, it's abandonment. It can be a stickey situation.

That's 8 patients per nurse. Sad to say, but I've done it before, with a myself and a tech, more times that I care to say. Frequently we do 7:1 where I work on med-surg. Maddening.

The other day they were fine toothing one of my rapid responses situations. "Did the nurse notice the trend of vitals over the last few days getting worse......". My answer: high ratios equal poor outcomes.