GOP releases healthcare plan; actual plan not included

  1. GOP releases healthcare plan; actual plan not included
    Source: Salon

    Remember the House Republicans' alternative budget plan where the only numbers were the page numbers? Well, they've done it again!

    House Republicans presented a four-page outline of their health care reform plan Wednesday but said they didn't know yet how much it would cost, how they would pay for it and how many of the nearly 50 million Americans without insurance would be covered by it.
    You can read the proposal here (pdf file).
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    About blue note

    Joined: Apr '09; Posts: 1,211; Likes: 2,651

    41 Comments

  3. by   CRNA2007
    Maybe it's because there are not anywhere near 50 million Americans without health care.




    Quote from blue note
    GOP releases healthcare plan; actual plan not included
    Source: Salon

    Remember the House Republicans' alternative budget plan where the only numbers were the page numbers? Well, they've done it again!

    You can read the proposal here (pdf file).
  4. by   GCTMT
    There are about 47 million people in this country with out health insurance, 79% of which are American citizens , the rest are believed to be immigrates, it remains unknown as to what ratio are legal/illegal.

    I read about the Republican plan this morning on Politico. The details are not forthcoming. It's my assumption that this is nothing more than a political maneuver that suggests, "hey, look at us, we care about health care reform too". The plan will most likely be shot down. I am guessing it is a crap plan.
  5. by   blue note
    Quote from GCTMT
    I read about the Republican plan this morning on Politico. The details are not forthcoming. It's my assumption that this is nothing more than a political maneuver that suggests, "hey, look at us, we care about health care reform too". The plan will most likely be shot down. I am guessing it is a crap plan.
    Now, now....maybe they'll come up with some nifty charts to go with their non-plan plan! Like this one, from their proposed budget plan.
  6. by   CRNA2007
    Try closer to 8 million



    Quote from GCTMT
    There are about 47 million people in this country with out health insurance, 79% of which are American citizens , the rest are believed to be immigrates, it remains unknown as to what ratio are legal/illegal.

    I read about the Republican plan this morning on Politico. The details are not forthcoming. It's my assumption that this is nothing more than a political maneuver that suggests, "hey, look at us, we care about health care reform too". The plan will most likely be shot down. I am guessing it is a crap plan.
  7. by   GCTMT
    Sure, CRNA, 8 million. Whatever, you say.
  8. by   wowza
    Seriously that 47 million statistic is overblown and misleading.

    8.3 million make $50-75K per year and 8.7 million make >$75K per year. These people can afford insurance but chose not to buy insurance. They are willfully uninsured- doesnt count.

    10+ million are not US citizens. They also dont count

    Recap- we are now down to 20 million unisured

    Then if you take into account those only temporarily without insurance (the report included anyone, who even temporarily did not have coverage) you drop that 20 million much lower. 47 million is a lie flat and simple.

    Similarly, if we took all those who were unemployed at some time in the past year we would not have our current unemployment rate of 8-9% we would have nearly double that. Aren't statistics great



    On a different note the plan the republicans came out with was laughable at best. What a pathetic excuse for a plan!
  9. by   blue note
    Quote from wowza
    Seriously that 47 million statistic is overblown and misleading.

    8.3 million make $50-75K per year and 8.7 million make >$75K per year. These people can afford insurance but chose not to buy insurance. They are willfully uninsured- doesnt count.
    Not according to this recent study:
    New Study Finds Fewer Families Can Afford Health Insurance
    The majority of uninsured American families who are not covered by group health insurance through an employer cannot afford to buy health insurance, according to a new study by the Department of Health & Human Services' (HHS) Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality (AHRQ).

    Some experts have suggested that because 23.8 million uninsured Americans under age 65 who do not have access to employer-based health insurance have incomes above the federal poverty line, they can afford to purchase policies if they so choose. But new data show otherwise.

    "Wealth, Income, and The Affordability of Health Insurance," published in the May/June 2009 issue of Health Affairs, shows that measuring families' median net worth--the value of their savings plus other assets minus debt rather than just income--provides more precise estimates of the percentage who could purchase policies if they chose to do so. Until now, most studies have used income alone to estimate how many more Americans could be covered by health insurance.

    "This study has important implications for defining who can afford to pay for health insurance in the next wave of health care reform," AHRQ Director Carolyn M. Clancy, M.D., said. "We need accurate, evidence-based findings to ensure that we are providing policymakers with reliable information."

    Using national survey data, the researchers found that the median net worth of families who purchased health insurance was $105,819--nearly 35 times greater than the median net worth of only $3,057 for families who were uninsured. Median net worth means that half the families had net worth above or below that amount.

    In contrast, the median income of families who purchased health insurance was $41,086--only 2.3 times greater than the median income of $17,690 for families who were uninsured.

    The researchers, who used 2002 and 2003 data from AHRQ's Medical Expenditure Panel Survey, also found that 4.1 percent of families with access to employer-based health insurance were poor (family income below 100 percent of the federal poverty line) and 11.1 percent were low income (family income 100-199 percent of the federal poverty line). In contrast, among families without access to employer-based health insurance, 33.8 percent were poor and 28.4 percent were low income.

    According to Didem Bernard, Ph.D., an AHRQ economist who led the research, the standard model based on income alone used by economists works well for estimating who will enroll in employer-based health insurance. However, it does not work well for who will purchase non-group coverage because it overestimates health insurance enrollment for people with low net worth and underestimates for people with high net worth.
  10. by   wowza
    Quote from blue note
    Not according to this recent study:

    That recent study doesnt negate any point I have made. It is in response to those saying if you are above the poverty line you can afford heath insurance:
    " Some experts have suggested that because 23.8 million uninsured Americans under age 65 who do not have access to employer-based health insurance have incomes above the federal poverty line, they can afford to purchase policies if they so choose. But new data show otherwise."

    What I am saying, is that if you make over 50K you should be able to pay for health insurance. The article even says the median income of those buying insurance is 41K, well below the 50K I was saying- supporting my claim. You can definitely afford heath insurance above 50K (and probably below that) if having health insurance is one of your priorities. If not fine, but politicians shouldn't use those personal choices as leverage to get what they want politically.

    So still, 17 million of that 47 million can afford insurance but choose not to get it and 10 more million are illegal immigrants. We are still down to 20 million which does not take into account the "temporarily uninsured."

    Thus the 47 million probably triples the real number. It just gets people more fired up than 10 or 15 million would.
  11. by   Pierrette
    A good explanation of the uninsured:

    http://www.creators.com/opinion/larry-elder.html
  12. by   blue note
    Quote from wowza
    Thus the 47 million probably triples the real number. It just gets people more fired up than 10 or 15 million would.
    Not that I agree with your numbers interpretation, but I for one, would be fired up even if it was "only" 10 or 15 million people. It doesn't make it any more acceptable to me.
  13. by   Ginger's Mom
    Actually I live in a state where is is mandatory that every citizen be covered. If you don't have financial resources you get a government plan ( AKA Medicaid). If you can't afford a full payment you pay want you can afford. If you have the finances and elect not to have a plan you pay a fine.

    Some hospitals are closing, there are very few nursing positions open. The jury is is still out where or not this is a success, it was passed with republican governor and a democratic house and senate.
  14. by   HM2VikingRN
    the commonwealth fund has a new report out about the un/underinsured: (its a lot closer to 100 million than 10 million.)

    most people in the u.s. fall into one of these categories and have personally experienced the shortcomings of our current system. even before the severe recession, an estimated 116 million working-age adults—two-thirds of all adults—reported they were uninsured or underinsured, had medical bill or debt problems, or experienced difficulties obtaining needed care. the beneficiaries of reforms that ensure affordable health insurance and access to high-quality care would include:
    • 46 million who were uninsured at the start of the recession, and 55 million who were uninsured at some point during the past year;
    • 25 million working-age adults who are underinsured;
    • 72 million working-age adults who have difficulty paying medical bills;
    • 49 million small business employees who now pay higher premiums than employees in larger businesses;
    • 4 million adults under age 65 with individual coverage whose premiums go toward high overhead costs, leaving less room for benefits;
    • one-third of insured people who change plans frequently, often not by choice;
    • 46 percent of workers with employer coverage who do not have a choice of plans;
    • medicaid beneficiaries, who would have expanded choices and better access to care if medicaid provider payments were increased;
    • women, who as a group carry greater financial burdens from health care expenses;
    • 13 million young adults without coverage;
    • older adults and early retirees, who have few affordable insurance options;
    • 2 million disabled individuals in the waiting period for medicare coverage;
    • any medicare beneficiary who now pays high hospital deductibles or high premiums for supplemental coverage; and
    • 37 million adults and 10 million children who lack easy access to a regular source of care.
    http://www.commonwealthfund.org/cont...nd-center.aspx

    the difference is that this is data driven work not based on suppositions.....

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