Nurses working harder than doctors?

lovehospital · Mar 22, 2009

So your conclusion is based on the fact that what You have 24 patients, or that nurses take care of patient's in 24 hours? Okay you spend a few hours in clinicals. The comment nurses have to recognize health status and know pathphysiology and disease. What the heck are you learning in school to even begin to compare yourself ( a student) to any doctor at this point of your not yet started career. Come back when you are dry behind the ears and know alittle more about what you are talking about.
Doctors and nurses are two different perspectives of the health care field. I could not imagine worrying about this as a student. Personally I was much to busy worrying about my own patient's, worrying about studying and learning. You try to and believe you know the ins and outs of other medical personel around yourself. I say bunk.

So you treat your nursing students just like the residents treat medical students?To my understanding a good,efficient nurse which equals to a safe nurse know pathophysiology of the diseases,signs and symptoms.If she/he doesnt know how will be she able to monitor the patients condition and to pass the meds without understanding how the meds work in your body.

Nurses are not trained monkeys and programmed machines,I would think they have brains.

How can I compare myself to the docs,I'm not and I'm not arguing who is smarter.

But I learn a lot in nursing school,not only the nursing care but as well as about diseases/patho,medical treatments,nursing treatments,diagnostic tests,how the meds work,different procedures.

I might not have an equal knowledge about the detailed anatomy and complex patho (although planning to take a course in it once I get my license).

SunnyAndrsn · Mar 22, 2009

Our hourse gertonologist is responsible for approximately 1/3 of our patients and counting. In addition, he works with two other area LTCs, I'm sure with similar pt. loads. He's in our facility 1-2 days per week, arrives by 7am, and takes his meals in the facility. So that's at least 60pts. per week that I know of that he is responsible for...assuming he puts in days like this at all of the facilities, plus his clinic hours, and on-call hours, I'd say I have the easier job in many, many ways.

While we've had our issues (who doesn't have MD stories, LOL?) I have a great deal of respect for him, and try and have all the needed data gathered before I bring a pt. concern to him, as is MY job. He also has an NP student working with him right now, and any nurse who has precepted knows that it can be very tiring being a teacher on top of your normal job.

I've seen him have very difficult conversations with family members, so it's not always the nurses who do the difficult talks. Let's remember that while we do a lot of pt. teaching, the MDs are explaining prognosis, etc, which presents it's own challenges as well.

MDs are practicing medicine; We are nurses--we practice the art and science of nursing. Very different roles, and with mutual respect between the two professions, a lot can be accomplished. While it would be nice if an MD would pitch in and help with hands-on care, it's NOT their job, and with 60+ pts. to my 24, our gerontologist is very busy too.

I came to conlusion that although I respect (the doctor's knowledge and ultimate decision making) that nurses work harder in physical and mental way.Sure the doctors are on the call 24 (not talking about surgeons cause they sure work hard) but we nurses coordinate everything,watch patients 24,have to recognize changes in health status,as well as know pathophysiology/diseases,deal with ongoing issues.

Sarcolemma · Mar 22, 2009

But I learn a lot in nursing school,not only the nursing care but as well as about diseases/patho,medical treatments,nursing treatments,diagnostic tests,how the meds work,different procedures.

hate to bust your bubble, but nursing school doesn't teach you squat. Your nursing school education is a 2 foot concrete base for a 200 story building that you may or may not choose to build.

my education in physiology/pathophysiology/medical diagnosis began in the ICU.

edit to say i'm probably at the 25th story of my understanding right now. the more you learn the less you know.

GilaRRT · Mar 22, 2009

So you treat your nursing students just like the residents treat medical students?To my understanding a good,efficient nurse which equals to a safe nurse know pathophysiology of the diseases,signs and symptoms.If she/he doesnt know how will be she able to monitor the patients condition and to pass the meds without understanding how the meds work in your body.
Nurses are not trained monkeys and programmed machines,I would think they have brains.
How can I compare myself to the docs,I'm not and I'm not arguing who is smarter.
But I learn a lot in nursing school,not only the nursing care but as well as about diseases/patho,medical treatments,nursing treatments,diagnostic tests,how the meds work,different procedures.
I might not have an equal knowledge about the detailed anatomy and complex patho (although planning to take a course in it once I get my license).

Agree with the others. What you learn in nursing school only scratches the surface. I cannot begin to describe the education the last seven years of continued learning and experience has provided. Yet, I understand my knowledge is basic on many levels when compared to the big picture. I am constantly reminded and humbled by this realization.

Instead of having a big chip on my shoulder for people who have knowledge and experience above my level, I choose to respect them for the hard work required to attain that knowledge and responsibility. In addition, I try to constantly learn and apply this knowledge to my practice.

You are obviously still a student and not experienced enough to look at the big picture. You need to give your self a few years post graduation to really gain an appreciation for how massive and complicated the animal of medicine is, then come back with your thoughts.

Again, anyone who can struggle and make it through medical school to start practice as a physician is as hard a worker any anybody I know. This does not mean they have the right to treat anybody poorly; however, this thread is not about how doctors treat nurses, is it? You clearly stated your point with the first post, yet you seem to stray from this point quite often.

lovehospital · Mar 22, 2009

hate to bust your bubble, but nursing school doesn't teach you squat. Your nursing school education is a 2 foot concrete base for a 200 story building that you may or may not choose to build.
my education in physiology/pathophysiology/medical diagnosis began in the ICU.
edit to say i'm probably at the 25th story of my understanding right now. the more you learn the less you
know.

If nursing school didnt teach you a squad how on earth did you pass NCLEX? Of course we can't expect nursing school to carry our hands like in the kindergarten, however nursing school direct us toward the areas that need to be studied.It is only up to YOU how much knowledge you will gain in nursing school,if you just want to merely pass then of course there will be claims similar to yours.

RN1982 · Mar 22, 2009

There is a difference between nursing school and the real world. They are two totally different entities. School teaches you the basics, helps you get licensed and get a job, it doesn't teach you anything about reality.

Sarcolemma · Mar 22, 2009

If nursing school didnt teach you a squad how on earth did you pass NCLEX?

thats a good point. nursing school did teach me how to pass the nclex.

Music in My Heart · Mar 22, 2009

It's true that a lot of docs act like jerks, and should respect nurses more- but that's not related to how hard they work.

Of course, more than a few nurses act like jerks, too.

Having just spent a few weeks in a clinical rotation through a medical residency clinic I have to say that I felt much more welcomed and included by the residents and attendings during my first few days than I did by many of the floor nurses during my first few clinical days at the hospital.

I agree completely that the nasty god-complex 'tude has nothing to do with their smarts, skill, nor how hard they work. One of the nicer docs I've met is a big-shot neurosurgeon who *could* sport a chip the size of Everest but doesn't. You certainly do what he says and he has very high standards but he's also just a decent human being who respects other people...

And he works like a freaking dog.

truern · Mar 22, 2009

The whole premise of this thread is ridiculous. First of all, the OP has no experience working with doctors other than a few clinical hours each week. Secondly, if she comes across IRL like she does here it's no wonder she doesn't get respected by the docs or anybody else for that matter.

Personally, I've never felt disrespected or belittled by any of the docs I work with...far from it.

azhiker96, BSN, RN · Mar 22, 2009

I came to conlusion that although I respect (the doctor's knowledge and ultimate decision making) that nurses work harder in physical and mental way.Sure the doctors are on the call 24 (not talking about surgeons cause they sure work hard) but we nurses coordinate everything,watch patients 24,have to recognize changes in health status,as well as know pathophysiology/diseases,deal with ongoing issues.

Well, I think by now we've seen that this opinion by a nursing student is not widely shared by experienced nurses.

Good luck in your career and I hope that you continue to learn after graduation.

Hekate · Mar 22, 2009

Of course, more than a few nurses act like jerks, too.
Having just spent a few weeks in a clinical rotation through a medical residency clinic I have to say that I felt much more welcomed and included by the residents and attendings during my first few days than I did by many of the floor nurses during my first few clinical days at the hospital.
I agree completely that the nasty god-complex 'tude has nothing to do with their smarts, skill, nor how hard they work. One of the nicer docs I've met is a big-shot neurosurgeon who *could* sport a chip the size of Everest but doesn't. You certainly do what he says and he has very high standards but he's also just a decent human being who respects other people...
And he works like a freaking dog.

I think that you are making a good point.

All areas have their nice, and not so nice people.

I have worked with great nurses as well as great doctors throughout the years. I also have encountered jerks in both professions.

That being said, let's try to imagine for a second that you are the doctor and that you have to rely on the nurses to keep your patients safe and report to you changes in status or anything relevant to their health and safety.

You have no other choice but to rely on the nurses because you can't possibly be in 50 different locations at the same time.

Now imagine that at least 1/3 of those nurses aren't "that good"....

If you were in that role, wouldn't you demand and expect the highest standards of care?

My husband is finishing his residency.That's 4 years of undergrad, 4 years of medical school, 4 years of residency with debilitating hours and work load.

Total: 12 years studying and working your ass off, without a cent in your pockets!I believe my husband has respect for nurses (he married one too), yet he has encountered his fair share of dumb, lazy (or both) and B***H nurses.

So every now and then, he does get angry at a nurse. Usually with reason...

Let's be honest here, we all know/work with a few nurses that we wouldn't let touch a family member with a ten foot pole ! Right?

If you deal with only a few on your floor, think that the doc actually has to deal with all of them! night and day, 7 days a week, all year around.

Now maybe you are a saint, but even the most even tempered person can be tried by this amount of stress.

Just today, my husband was telling me about an infant he saw in the ER with suspected meningitis. He ordered to start an antibio IV stat. 1 hour 1/2 later, the baby still didn't have an IV inserted and therefore hadn't received the antibiotic....right there it's the difference between a meningitis treated early on and full recovery....or a much darker prognosis!The baby's nurse was at the nursing station chatting.... He is a very calm man, but he lost it with that nurse! Would you blame him?

NurseLoveJoy88, ASN, RN · Mar 22, 2009

Love hospital- I must say you are a brave soul and your skin must be thicker than wool, cause you keep posting threads that tend to get under alot of people skin). You're exactly what AN need. Really, you have the most interesting threads.