Nurses, Will you work OT for straight pay?

[klondike]

If you currently work OT for time and one half pay will you continue to work the hours for straight pay? What do you think of the new OT legislation and how it will effect nursing? What do you think of the exemptions for male dominated professions? ie, Police officers, firefighters and EMTs.

[jwk]

Disrespect for the office of our president (no matter who holds it) by using silly names is inappropriate in this discussion.

Amen

[BBFRN, BSN, PhD]

I agree that calling the president names isn't appropriate. While I disagree with a lot of his policies, I still hold a measure of respect for him as our president. We can discuss this issue politely (I hope), no matter our stance on it. I don't disagree with these new changes as a whole, I'd just like to see protection for RNs written in them. I do think some salaried people will see an increase in pay because of these changes. I would like to believe Bush had good intentions in that area. Protection for RNs is now a state issue. That's democracy.

[klondike]

I'm not sure if this has been posted yet or not, but I found this on the Dept. of Labor's website. It appears to me that most nurses have nothing to worry about.

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/fairpay/fs17n_nurses.htm

Malenursingstudent. You need to reread the information below I have printed form the dept. of labor website you refer to. The term "Exempt" means we are now exempted from mandatory OT pay. Read the criteria for being a " Learned Professional". We meet them all and are therefore exempted from mandatory OT pay. All they have to do is declare us as salaried employees and there will be no more mandatory OT pay. As others have said the changes will not come about quickly. But you can be assured the changes will come as the waters are tested. If we are to resist we must resist from the beginning and not wait until we suddenly find that the standard is no further overtime pay. Read the below. It would appear LPNs and some other hospital workers will not be exempted and will continue to qualify for OT protection. What a great way to divide and conquer. RNs can expect to see our OT benefits chipped away. Remember the story of the frog and the pot of water on the stove.

Nurses

To qualify for the learned professional employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met:

• The employee must be compensated on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;
  
• The employee's primary duty must be the performance of work requiring advanced knowledge, defined as work which is predominantly intellectual in character and which includes work requiring the consistent exercise of discretion and judgment;
  
• The advanced knowledge must be in a field of science or learning; and
  
• The advanced knowledge must be customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction.
  

Registered nurses who are paid on an hourly basis should receive overtime pay. However, registered nurses who are registered by the appropriate State examining board generally meet the duties requirements for the learned professional exemption, and if paid on a salary basis of at least $455 per week, may be classified as exempt.

Licensed practical nurses and other similar health care employees, however, generally do not qualify as exempt learned professionals, regardless of work experience and training, because possession of a specialized advanced academic degree is not a standard prerequisite for entry into such occupations, and are not (not exempted from OT Pay)

[casperokc]

I understand your point. But, a HR can not just "reclassify" you without consulting you first. That is a law. You can not be taken down in pay or told one day "Oh, By the way you are salary now." Those are illegal. You can have it offered and decline. Therefore giving them a reason to fire you. But, again as I have said before nurse's were not protected under the old rules. A hospital or doctor could have offered you a salary at anytime and stripped you of overtime pay under the old rules. There was no provision that protected nurses. As far as I can see it will affect a whole bunch of workers. But, as with others under the old rules. These are just a GUIDELINE. That means business do not have to strip you because you are "exempt" Only thing it does guarantee is if you make below the poverty line you will be protected. A hospital still has final say so in whether to pay it to nurses or not. Will some strip you? More then likely. Will all do it? No, to many nurses now a days have a BSN. This means they can go work in almost any field they want to with that BSN. As far as I can see there is a bunch of worrying and nothing to really suggest that this is going to happen. As for the other comments about George Bush. This was pushed by Bush but last I checked pasted by congress. If you want to blame someone politically then call your senators and congressmen they passed it! Bush bashing is so common now without a basis for it besides personal beliefs. So lets keep the politics out of this and discuss the facts of the overtime rules.

Malenursingstudent. You need to reread the information below I have printed form the dept. of labor website you refer to. The term "Exempt" means we are now exempted from mandatory OT pay. Read the criteria for being a " Learned Professional". We meet them all and are therefore exempted from mandatory OT pay. All they have to do is declare us as salaried employees and there will be no more mandatory OT pay. As others have said the changes will not come about quickly. But you can be assured the changes will come as the waters are tested. If we are to resist we must resist from the beginning and not wait until we suddenly find that the standard is no further overtime pay. Read the below. It would appear LPNs and some other hospital workers will not be exempted and will continue to qualify for OT protection. What a great way to divide and conquer. RNs can expect to see our OT benefits chipped away. Remember the story of the frog and the pot of water on the stove.

Nurses

To qualify for the learned professional employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met:

• The employee must be compensated on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;
  
• The employee's primary duty must be the performance of work requiring advanced knowledge, defined as work which is predominantly intellectual in character and which includes work requiring the consistent exercise of discretion and judgment;
  
• The advanced knowledge must be in a field of science or learning; and
  
• The advanced knowledge must be customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction.
  

Registered nurses who are paid on an hourly basis should receive overtime pay. However, registered nurses who are registered by the appropriate State examining board generally meet the duties requirements for the learned professional exemption, and if paid on a salary basis of at least $455 per week, may be classified as exempt.

Licensed practical nurses and other similar health care employees, however, generally do not qualify as exempt learned professionals, regardless of work experience and training, because possession of a specialized advanced academic degree is not a standard prerequisite for entry into such occupations, and are not (not exempted from OT Pay)

[VickyRN, MSN, DNP, RN]

personal attacks will not be tolerated.

voice your opinions freely, but remain respectful of other posters. there is a diplomatic and civil way to get a point across, without resorting to personal attacks, rudeness, or sarcasm.

[CseMgr1, ASN, RN]

I don't have a choice. I'm exempt, which means IF we are offered OT pay, we are paid straight time...or nothing.

[klondike]

Since the U.S. Department of Labor announced the proposed changes in OT legislation it has begun to advise employers how to get around those changes thus avoiding the payment of overtime to low paid workers who might become eligibile under the new rules. One suggestion ; if anticipated regular and OT pay will exceed the minimum for eligibility simply raise the regular pay to just above that amount and thus avoid the OT. Another was to cut the pay to a rate that when combined with OT will more nearly equal the original pre OT rate. A spokesperson for the DOL said essentially, 'we are not saying an employeer should do these things, were only pointing out options'. I'm not trying to be a doom sayer but this new legislation is opening the door to one gigantic opportunity for employeers to bamboozle the American worker. The rules of the game have been drastically changed. Nurses, by and large, don't organize, and don't stand together in a united front. Employeers, for most of us the hospitals, are forming state wide organizations, in part to curtail the rising tide of increased wages and benefits to their employees. Increased pay and benefits equals decreased profits and the converse is also true. The old economic rule of supply and demand has been slowly pushing our wages up, as well it should. This move will be counter productive, when applied to the medical industry, to hospital employees in general, nurses in particular, and ultimately to the welfare of the patients. It will allow, however, for increased corporate profits in the medical industry.

[jwk]

Since the U.S. Department of Labor announced the proposed changes in OT legislation it has begun to advise employers how to get around those changes thus avoiding the payment of overtime to low paid workers who might become eligibile under the new rules. One suggestion ; if anticipated regular and OT pay will exceed the minimum for eligibility simply raise the regular pay to just above that amount and thus avoid the OT. Another was to cut the pay to a rate that when combined with OT will more nearly equal the original pre OT rate. A spokesperson for the DOL said essentially, 'we are not saying an employeer should do these things, were only pointing out options'. I'm not trying to be a doom sayer but this new legislation is opening the door to one gigantic opportunity for employeers to bamboozle the American worker. The rules of the game have been drastically changed. Nurses, by and large, don't organize, and don't stand together in a united front. Employeers, for most of us the hospitals, are forming state wide organizations, in part to curtail the rising tide of increased wages and benefits to their employees. Increased pay and benefits equals decreased profits and the converse is also true. The old economic rule of supply and demand has been slowly pushing our wages up, as well it should. This move will be counter productive, when applied to the medical industry, to hospital employees in general, nurses in particular, and ultimately to the welfare of the patients. It will allow, however, for increased corporate profits in the medical industry.

Nursing shortage, nursing shortage, nursing shortage, nursing shortage

[klondike]

And we can only hope that the same attitudes, on both sides, that have created this shortage will not allow this new factor to make it worse. Time will tell. Human Resourses. Human = people. Resources = Something to be used, discarded and replaced with what you hope is a never ending supply.

Nursing shortage, nursing shortage, nursing shortage, nursing shortage

[Corrections RN]

Not for straight time pay.

[pghfoxfan]

I will not work OT for straight pay either.

I love how, the first time I heard about this "law" was the day it was passed. WTF! This should have been known a long time ago when we could have rallied and tried to stop this.

Nurses make up the largest group of workers, yet our voices are not heard. WE need to support our own and VOTE and let our voices and opinions be heard. If we would stick together, there would be no stopping us.

[BBFRN, BSN, PhD]

This was known a long time ago- Karen has been posting updates on this for quite a while, but a lot of people didn't take notice I guess. NRSKaren does a great job of keeping us all up to date in the activism/politics forum on issues that may affect us as nurses.