No one will hire a nurse with only a Associates???

canaryred · Nov 22, 2011

When I was a hiring manager I preferred to hire nurses who had started as a CNA, became an LPN then an ADN and then if they had a BSN, well that was good too. But I found the best nurses that I have worked with and that I hired followed that general "nurse progression."

I went for the BSN from the start and I found that others that had been the CNA, LPN, etc were just better prepared and just generally good nurses.

Rob72, ASN, RN · Nov 22, 2011

There are so many things wrong with this post, I don't know where to start. It must have something to do with my insufficient IQ...

In essence, then, I can only assume that your position is that increased educational performance demands(standards) do not increase the educational depth, professional competence and concurrent professional acknowledgement...? I.e., graduates from Japanese and German engineering schools do not command higher salaries than the average (non- MIT) US grad, on the world market?

If one recognises that there is a deficiency in an argument, one should be able to identify, and rectify, the deficiency. (see "logic" and "rhetoric", above) If one is unable to do so, it is necessary to determine whether one's response is emotionally based, lacking factual basis, or whether further investigation of the queried position is needed to develop a sound position.

Or, perhaps my statement is so droll and trite that it would be overly taxing to demonstrate its inadequacy.

FYI: one of the most noted proponents(actually an initiator) of the modern, tax-supported public school system was Henry Ford. His stated goal was to provide enough education so that workers would be competent enough not to hurt themselves in factories. I believe it would be hard to argue that the curriculum has changed much in 100 years.

Meriwhen, ASN, BSN, MSN, RN · Nov 22, 2011

I thought that was an interesting perspective, especially since she is very educated.

Education does not necessarily equal intelligence...nor common sense.

Nor does it provide nursing perspective if one is not a nurse.

mandaleni23 · Nov 22, 2011

FWIW I just found out that NONE of the hospitals in my area hire ADNs anymore. (I got this information from credible sources: I volunteer at one of the hospitals and I found out from HR there, an attorney I work with is associated with another hospital that recently made the switch, and I'm planning on attending my BSN program at the final hospital - we were told point blank at the open house that they no longer hire ADNs.) In I'm going for my BSN, but my friend is going for her ADN (which, as it turns out, her program will take about the same amount of time and cost the same amount of money as my BSN). I tried to breach this topic with her, but she doesn't believe me. For her sake, I hope she's right....

CNA1991, CNA · Nov 22, 2011

Let me clarify a few things: I live in the Bay Area, specifically, Livermore,CA and I attend Las Positas college which is an affiliate of Chabot college. When I say that it will be more expensive to attend a BSN program, I am not only accounting for program costs but resources as well. The closest 4 year that I know of is San Jose state, which, is about 35-40 miles away(probably slightly more for me, considering I live of the far side of town closer to Tracy,CA). I pay for college by myself and still live with my parents, and I doubt I would be able to move out on a CNAs salary while going to school full time. The school I attend now is about 5-10 miles away. When I say nurses without a degree I mean LPNs and Diploma nurses. I admit, they are even stingy about hiring CNAs that don't have the Acute certification around here sometimes. The thing is, I am literally willing to take any job once I graduate even if it it's not one I want and work from there. I guess my area is somewhat "crowded" with new grads but I am willing to relocate (or, become a travel nurse for awhile). The closest hospital near me and the one that I have always wished to work for is valleycare. The three programs I am considering are: Ohlone, Merrit, and Chabot.

Valleycare:http://www.valleycare.com/careers/careers_opportunities.html

Las Positas college:http://www.laspositascollege.edu/

Chabot college:http://www.chabotcollege.edu/

MissM.RN, BSN, RN · Nov 22, 2011

Hi CNA1991! Your counselor is probably trying to help, but in the end isn't really helping! I agree with many posters, it completely depends on your region and hospital networks. Do what I did - research before you start an RN program. I was thisclose to attending a community college ADN 5 minutes from my apartment, but then I checked out hiring practices in Boston. Turns out I needed an expensive BSN that was 45 minutes away. "No degree" nurses are probably those who have hospital-based diplomas, but they are (relatively) rare where I come from. Again, depending on where you live, I might get the cheap (and frankly better clinically) education at your CC, start working asap, and then have your new employer foot the bill for your online RN-BSN degree from your local State U or University. It will likely transfer seamlessly. Same license, same degree, a third of the cost. Good luck! And tell that counselor to do his/her homework :)

su9032 · Nov 23, 2011

I will graduate in a few weeks with an ADN and I already have an interview scheduled the day after I graduate for an RN position. I was told not to worry since I've already proven myself as a nurse tech. Also, I have completed all the pre-reqs for an RN to BSN program and they know that I will be getting my BSN.

rnkitka · Nov 23, 2011

Of course the higher education the better.........But I've been an RN for 13 years and have never had a problem getting a job with an associates.

Good Luck!

ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP · Nov 23, 2011

Well sure Princess, while the world is simple.
You just began nursing school, and all you have behind you is high school. Spend some time taking all of this in and as you move along in school and life some of what's said here is going to click.

And you know what? It is shame that someone straight out of high school "gets it" moreso than a lot of people twice her age. I've done my research, and I'm pretty aware of the economy and what employers want, and they want someone with experience AND a higher level of education. So...

If you want to be condescending, do so in a way that isn't so obvious or better yet, don't talk to me. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't have been so rude if I was some forty year old.

I have nearly three years of COLLEGE and nearly five years worth of hospital experience behind me. Don't assume things. It makes you look silly.

ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP · Nov 23, 2011

Um just wanted to say my LPN school was 9 months long. 40 hours a week for school, but only 9 months long.... Of course it's not an ADN but I just wanted to throw that in there.

Yet LPNs don't have all the responsibilities that an RN has. So, moving right along....

ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP · Nov 23, 2011

That is a false premise. One needs to define the "standards" before making that statement. With all due respect to those who have attained BS/BSN, I submit that a majority(based on the number of BS grads across all disciplines) are quite commonly lacking in logic, rhetoric, basic grammar, integrational thinking and heuristic reasoning. If BSN programs were instilling these arts, Nursing would not be suffering the identity crisis we currently have.
Current standards mean that those of reasonable intelligence, and more than average income (or more than average loans/grants) will pass. Maintaining current educational standards, but requiring a BSN is simply making employment a "pay-to-play" affair. This is how the Communist culture worked (failed to work) for 50 years.
Schools are actively denying IQ, i.e., we now have "emotional intlligence", "artistic intelligence", "empathetic intelligence". This is nice, and makes everyone feel good, but if the reality is that many nurses below MSN have difficulty formulating a cogent 1 pages thesis, the standards are pretty damn low.
If we want to, "raise professional standards", mandating an IQ of >100, as demonstrated by standardized testing would be a much greater step. The obvious difficulty is that this means that not everyone can, "be whatever you dream to be..." Got news kids. That was crap when your parents were paying to send you to public school. Its crap when other taxpayers are funding Fannie & Freddie so you can go to college.
In 1900, if one graduated from University(2 years), one could generally speak at least 2 languages, calculate in calculus, trig, organic chemistry, be conversant in botany, zoology, economics- then whatever field of specilization one sought. Show me a BSN program with grads at that level, and I'll listen, otherwise, its politics and economics.

You won't find too many lazy, unintelligent people in med or law school...just sayin'. Why? Well not too many lazy people are going to put themselves through four years of undergrad plus many more years of post-grad school and not too many unintelligent people would be able to get into a decent/legit med or law school.

Whereas, there are diploma mills out there that will accept ANY nursing student, push them along with mediocre education and set them onto innocent patients knowing damn well they are unprepared and ill-equipped to take care of them.

And an IQ test would be a poor way to measure one's intelligence. I know smart, incredible people who do not test well but still blow the straight A students away in clinical.

ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP · Nov 23, 2011

So your predecessors in nursing were unintillegent, lazy, ill-prepared underachievers????

Uh, no. Way to misconstrue a statement. :uhoh3:

But it if means anything, all of my PROFESSORS and CLINICAL INSTRUCTORS have a MS and BSN. So...