No jobs for LPN graduates anymore?

JadedinPA · Jul 30, 2006

Pagandeva2000,

20 years ago when I graduated from nursing school I never could have believed we'd be at the crossroads that we're standing at now. The thought of ever needing to go back for an RN never crossed the minds of me or my classmates. There were just so many nursing positions waiting to be filled that, at that time, LPN's were almost looked upon as saviors. Now I'm faced with not being able to afford to go back, not having the time to go back and being so long out of school that I don't know that I COULD go back. Not to mention that I find it quite distasteful that, although I'm the same person, with the same skills and intelligence, I'm somehow considered more worthy just because the initials behind my name change from LPN to RN. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm not sure I'd WANT to go back. The whole thing has kind of left a bad taste in my mouth.

I can't help but look back on things and draw a tiny parallel between what's happening to the nation's LPN's and what happened to the Army nurses that returned to the States after serving in Vietnam. Up until Vietnam many of the functions of today's RN's were actually performed by the physician...one of those being the administration of blood. But, as is often the case, that period of war and the insufficient numbers of Dr's in relation to the high casualties forced the delegation of duties that were otherwise given only to a physician onto the Army nurses (RN's). These nurses spent many years ably performing these "physician's" duties and saved countless lives in the process. It was a harsh and belittling return to reality when these nurses returned to the US and were told they couldn't do those duties any longer...that they weren't competent enough to perform "Dr's" procedures. This, unfortunately, is where the LPN is today. Since the program's inception back in the 60's we've served long, hard hours, weekends, holidays away from families, double shifts and provided needed nursing staff so that hospitals and clinics all over the nation have been able to keep their doors open, save lives and make huge profits. Now we're being told we're not competent to perform the duties we've been ably performing for all these years. What's more disheartening is that there is a nation of people (and facilities) out there proclaiming how severe the nursing shortage is and yet, with a body of well-educated and eager LPN's at the ready, we're being turned away in droves. If the prejudice towards LPN's was removed and we weren't being forced out of acute care facilities there wouldn't BE a nursing shortage.

By the way, someone stated in an earlier post that they wouldn't want a new graduate LPN treating them in the ER...too scary. Please, PLEASE don't downplay the education you received!!! By doing so you are only letting those that believe that the RN is the only "Real Nurse" get the upper hand. Believe me, you received in your 1 or 2 year course more hands-on, clinical training than any RN does in her 4 years of training. You can stick your head in books forever but it doesn't mean a THING until you've applied it in a clinical setting. By the time you graduated from LPN school you've been given the opportunity to take the knowledge you've gained from your books immediately out on to the floor and reinforced it under the watchful eye of your instructors. It doesn't work that way in RN school. Most RN programs only have clinicals that last from a few weeks to a month!! Just how much can you learn in that short a period?? The mantra we had in the ER was "See one, Do one, Teach one"...and that, basically is what you have in LPN school. You "see" things in your books and being done on the floor, you then go and "do" that thing in your clinicals and turn around and "teach" it by helping your classmates with their clinical experiences. I would MUCH rather have a new grad. LPN taking care of me or my family member than a new grad. RN!! There isn't going to be anyone out there who's going to come riding to the rescue of the LPN except other LPN's. We need to stay strong in proclaiming and maintaining our self-worth AND our worth as competent nurses who deserve respect. If we can't do that, the cause is lost and we all might as well start practicing now..."Welcome to Sheetz. Pump 5 is on for the blue mini van..."

NoWaNrN, ASN, RN · Jul 30, 2006

I new going into school for an LPN hospitals are weeding out LPN's. The way I look at it I can work as an LPN while going to school for my RN vs working as an CNA while doing all the pre reqs and nursing portion.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jul 30, 2006

Sometimes, I wonder if the practical nursing schools are overly preparing students for skills that may not be utilized as in the past. From my understanding, my hospital used to utilize LPNs for primary care of patients with predictable outcomes, while performing most of the same skills as the RN, but, since last year (because of the change of administrators), the role of the LPN has been switched over to medication nurses. I thought that I would finally learn how to insert catheters, do dressings, etc; but they are not doing that, now. Also, they are not letting the LPN write notes anymore.

I do admit that for the time being, that is easier for me, because I won't be slammed with so much as a new grad, but I often wonder if there will ever be a time where I'll use much of any of the things that I was taught. It is vague what my role would be during a code, and other things. I will be in orientation on med-surg for just 6 weeks, and then I will be sent back to ambulatory care, where, if I'm not careful, I can lose my skills. I don't mind working in the clinic (in fact, I actually prefer it), because I'll still have weekends and holidays off. I'd rather work on the floors when I want to rather than each and every day of dealing with that stress. I just want to ensure that I am marketable in case I want to work somewhere else. I do want to amass more knowledge, though in case of emergencies.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jul 30, 2006

I was the one that posted that I didn't want to start in the ER as a new graduate, and I say that for many reasons. I know the environment that I work in, and many of the RNs are not capable, and what I am afraid of is that I would not have a person to lean on while my confidence is building. I would hate to be in a situation where a person's life depends on my quick reaction, and due to lack of support and confidence, they lose their lives or even the quality of life.

My school was a NEW LPN program where I graduated in the first class. Many things were lacking there. We only had clinicals once or twice a week, and most of the time, our clinicals were held in the evening, with a tired, underpaid instructor (who did the job as a favor to the program director) that had another day job who would send us home after only two or three hours. This was the whole experience in my year of nursing school. I had the book knowledge, but did not see much. Never did a dressing or changed a catheter on a live person. FORGET about learning medications...that pharmacology class was a complete disaster. I had to take a one day pharmacology review course outside of my program AFTER I graduated in order to understand the simplest things about the drugs in order to prepare for NCLEX. And, still, I saw at least 8 drugs that I had never seen or heard of before in my life. We had our pharmacology course during fundamentals of nursing, and after that, from med-surg until OB (and only OB), they told us that they would NOT focus on medications since we already had a pharmacology course. Now, who the heck heard of THAT?? Now, in spite of all of this, I passed NCLEX with the minimum amount of questions, but I knew that I would have to count on my job experience in order to learn. Currently, I have pulled out my pharm text as well as my med-surg text to read since I am not under the school gun, anymore.

In terms of school, I totally get your point. Unfortunately, I really hated my school experience. I graduated top of the class, but I hated the competitiveness, pettiness and stress they put the students under. And, I bitterly despised the road to NCLEX with the constant answering ridiculous questions and reading a year's worth of material; not having a clue as to what they would ask you, and when I got to NCLEX, there was not a thing on there that I studied. NOTHING on asthma, diabetes, heart failure, no OB or women's health questions, no endocrine disorders, and one cheap shot peds question (I admit I was glad about THAT, peds is not a favorite subject of mine). I was flabbergasted, and I told myself that win, lose or draw, I would not walk into taking that exam a second time. Most of the questions I got were insanely irrelevant (from my prespective, anyway). And, I refuse to enter into school for the RN just to have two or three more people respect me.

Because this was a new program, the director did all that she can do to get most of the students to pass, and that meant curbing grades and voluminous extra assignments and group projects in order to get the failing students (out of 35 students, only three-including myself- were really passing honestly) to graduate. I saw some students fail an exam, and they would make us take the EXACT same exam two days later, and when I would get a 90, because some of the students got to re-read the material, a few would get a 95 or 100, while I made the effort to study before the first time! I was OUTRAGED!! I used to take the exams and move on into the next phase, and had I also peeked at the one or two answers I got wrong, I would have gotten 100s as well! I didn't even go to the graduation to receive my valedictorian award. I TOTALLY understand your rage...just that mine has come from a different direction. I STILL study to ensure that I know the best that I can towards whomever I have to take care of, but I will not join this game again, whether I can afford it or not. Funny enough, my job paid my tuition and released me on full time leave with pay to attend school, and while I am glad that I am a nurse, I can freely say that I would never do it again under those circumstances. I am seeing some of my co-workers who also got their licenses that I actually witnessed cheating throughout the whole class, and they walk in there like they are bright bulbs, yet, I *KNOW* the real deal with them.

Sorry for the rant... and please, do not let this negatively influence those that are currently studying to become practical nurses. I plan to be a darned GOOD one, but, I can see the challenges involved.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jul 30, 2006

I new going into school for an LPN hospitals are weeding out LPN's. The way I look at it I can work as an LPN while going to school for my RN vs working as an CNA while doing all the pre reqs and nursing portion.

You will gain a foundation in LPN school and if you are fortunate enough to gain a great deal of clinical experience while in training, it will go a long way for RN school. I wish you the best of luck in your profession!

zoeyzoe · Jul 31, 2006

HI all. I am a new LPN graduate. I took my nclex July 12, Which was a Wednesday, found out on Friday the 15 I had passes. On Monday my job hunt began. Since then (which has been all of 2 weeks) I have had 3 job interviews, 2 job offers, and have another job interview tomorrow. THERE ARE NO LPN JOB SHORTAGES HERE IN ATLANTA. True, most of the hospitals have phased LPN's out (THAT'S THEIR LOSE NOT OURS) but there are still plenty of places in need of LPN's. My advice to those who are having trouble finding a job is:

1. Don't just fill out applications on line, find out where the human resources office is, and if they allow it, go in and fill the app out ,take your resume.

2. If you do go in, always dress professionally.

3. Ask to speak to someone there, you'll be surprised, a lot of the time they will see you then, look over your resume and schedule you for an interview.

4. Be friendly, professional, and assertive.

5. Sometimes you may have to go a little further from home, if there are not many jobs in your area.

JadedinPA · Jul 31, 2006

HI all. I am a new LPN graduate. I took my nclex July 12, Which was a Wednesday, found out on Friday the 15 I had passes. On Monday my job hunt began. Since then (which has been all of 2 weeks) I have had 3 job interviews, 2 job offers, and have another job interview tomorrow. THERE ARE NO LPN JOB SHORTAGES HERE IN ATLANTA. True, most of the hospitals have phased LPN's out (THAT'S THEIR LOSE NOT OURS) but there are still plenty of places in need of LPN's.

Hi, zoeyzoe. I don't think folks have been saying so much that there aren't any jobs available for LPN's. I think what they've been saying is that there aren't jobs available to LPN's where we can really use the skills we've been taught and/or have cultivated from experience. Out of curiosity, may I ask what type of setting (LTC, Dr's office, Personal Care, Hospital, etc.) your interviews and job offers have been in?

I agree with you that the phasing out of the LPN from acute care settings (ER's, CCU's, hospitals in general, etc.) IS their loss...but I have to disagree with you on your assertion that it's not OUR loss. I've said it before and I'll say it again. LPN's are bright, intelligent, well-trained professionals that are more than capable of giving competent care in acute care settings and we should be given the opportunity of HAVING THAT CHOICE. We should NOT be told we're not worthy enough to work in certain settings. In my 20 years as an LPN I've worked with some pretty incompetent RN's that knew less than I did but made more money and garnered more respect just because they had the initials RN behind their names. Case in point...just this AM I was discussing a patient of mine with 2 RN's. The patient is a diabetic with urosepsis that has been remarkably unresponsive to aggressive treatment with antibiotics. The patient's condition has continued to decline and she began bleeding from her nose, mouth, urinary catheter, etc. I made the statement that I feared the patient was exhibiting DIC (Disseminated Intravascular Coagulation) and would not survive. I received two blank stares...until the one RN was brave enough to quietly ask, "What's that?" Not only did I have to inform BOTH RN's what DIC stood for, but I also had to explain to them that it's a systemic hemorrhagic disorder often seen in sepsis, trauma patients or L&D patients with abruptio-placenta that's characterized by generlized bleeding, particularly from body orifices and can result in circulatory collapse, end-stage organ failure, and death. The response? "Oh, I'd never heard of that. Are you sure that's a real thing? It sounds like something made up by Hollywood." And these were NOT new RN's!! Yep...LPN knew more, gets paid less and is told that her status as an LPN makes her "unfit" and too "undereducated" to work in a hospital. (**walks away nauseated and gagging**)

zoeyzoe · Aug 3, 2006

Hi Jaded. I took it to mean people could not find any jobs as LPN's. My interviews have been at a hospital (where I did clinics), Homehealth agency for field supervisor position, Physician office, and Hospice. The job I didn't get an offer for was the HOSPITAL, They only had the one position on the med surg floor and I guess it went to someone with more experience, considering I'm a new grad in all. I am a little sadden by the fact that LPN's are being phase out of the hospital, but I can't let that bother me. I've heard that this kind of thing happens every few years or so, and then they start to rehire and the cycle starts again.

Humbled_Nurse · Aug 3, 2006

Jaded:

I was shocked to hear that you had to educate those RN's on what DIC is, but then again I'm not surprised. Whether you are an RN or LVN all nurses need to take personal accountability on learing all they can on disease process, their particular specialty area, etc... All nursing school does is provide a foundation of nursing/medical knowledge. It is the schools responsibility to present accurate and up to date info., but is is up the student to learn it and retain it. I have been a nurse for 8 years now and I am always reading something medical whether it is my A&P book, micro. book, or a book related to my specialty. It amazes me how much some nurses don't really know about disease process. Yea, we learned it in school, but unless you keep reviewing it you won't retain it. It amazes me how much I don't remember from school.

I commend you Jaded for being so knowledgeable. I don't think it has too much to do with whether you are an LVN or RN what really matters is what you do after nursing school as far as continuing and expanding your knowledge base.

raremoon22 · Aug 4, 2006

I live in South Florida and there are hopitals in my area that have a high demand for LPNs. I know that some of my fellow classmates have job in hospitals.

rebel1 · Aug 4, 2006

keep trying- I have been an LVN for 31 years- there is still good jobs out there for us. I remember when I was in school- they kept saying they was going to discontiue hiring LVN/LPN but everytime I look at the paper - I see several postings. I agree that some hospitals are not hiring LVN's but home health agencies and doctor's offices are- keeping trying and good luck

LanaBanana · Aug 6, 2006

I think it would be very sad for LPN programs to shut down because there is a great need for LPNs. Hospitals do seem to be swinging more to the RNs, but there is an aging population out there that is going to need care, and much of that is done by LPNs - whether in assisted living, nursing home, home health, etc. I do think that PN programs should tell students that some jobs may be limited. I interviewed last week for a CNA position and asked the HR rep about transitioning to a LPN job when I graduate and she said if there is a position available then that's fine, but they are currently limited in the hospital. However the hospital has it's own hospice, home health, assisted living that you can work in. The other option is that sometime a nurse manager will see the way you work in clinicals or as a CNA and will allow you to take a job that was originally classified as RN. I have a friend who got her job in oncology that way. The manager that hired me told me if he sees me working hard and sees potential then he would go to bat for me for an LPN job.

I am planning to go straight for the LPN-RN bridge program which takes 2 semesters (but still contemplating LPN-BSN because I have all the prereqs.) So hopefully that would satisfy a manager or hospital to know that I am in pursuit of my RN.