new corporation investigating health care workers

Elvish, BSN, DNP, RN, NP · Sep 12, 2007

MLOS -- My concern is that, by signing the waiver that CRNI is referring to, you are basically giving these people permission to do background checks, to hire private investigators (yes, I read the fine print once) to find out pretty much whatever they want to find out. I agree with you that it's unlikely that they'll want to know or even care what books I checked out of the library. But once you agree to one bit of the puzzle, tptb might just feel more at liberty to check on the other stuff. If I've checked out a book about Cesar Chavez, think about all the things they could 'assume' about me then...

In another thread, a poster talked about wanting to take college classes in Farsi but was discouraged by her academic advisor because it would likely put her on a government security-watch list. The topic of the thread is not government watching us, but the point is the same. People should be able to take the college classes they want, and I should not have to be signing waivers that give outside organizations carte blanche to dig up every detail of my personal life. Even if it probably wouldn't happen, I don't like to think that it could.

CRNI-ICU20 · Sep 12, 2007

MLOS, to answer your question, "What is the source of the concern on the part of some of you that these other steps will be taken?"

The PreCheck website and the waiver form state this:

"investigative consumer report, which means a consumer report or portion thereof in which information on a consumer's character, general reputation, personal characteristics, or mode of living is obtained through personal interviews with persons having knowledge."

NOW...for you, the personal interviews with persons having knowledge were people you chose, and provided references for....

THIS COMPANY ISN'T INTERESTED IN THE PEOPLE YOU CHOOSE....THEY ARE INTERESTED IN HAVING A PERSONAL INTERVIEW WITH WHO THEY CHOOSE....

You don't get to list anyone on the form, or any other form with them....

While your experience has been not so invasive, that hasn't been the case of MANY nurses across this country...many of whom were involved in legislative processes that labeled them as "troublemakers" and then they were blackballed as potential employees at other hospitals....

If you read the fine print on this form, you realize that it isn't just a run of the mill background check.

Apparently, some hospitals and healthcare companies DO find this to be a cost effective process, because they are looking for the "right kind of employee"...ie one that won't rock the boat, won't pose a risk to the hospital (which is a big deal if there is ever a lawyer, a judge, and a jury involved)....so I think that your assumption is short sighted....

because there are plenty of nurses here who have been victims of this very thing....and are still trying to get the CORRECT information placed about them.....not to mention the nurses in Mesquite, who were fired.....

Perception is reality....

Your perception is that since nothing bad ever happened to you, that this is a non-existent problem....that no one would ever go that far to investigate a person for a job that only pays $23/hr.....

You are gauging this situation based solely on what you have experienced....this isn't wrong, or bad, it just isn't the whole picture...

Besides you, there are many who have had really horrible experiences with this....

You also base your opinion on "cost effective" thinking.....

And while some healthcare facilities may not go this "deep" into a person's life, the fact that they are outsourcing background checks with a company THAT DOES DO THIS AS THEIR ROUTINE BACKGROUND CHECK does somewhat override that thinking....

The reality is that healthcare facilities are paying out big bucks to these companies to do background checks....I don't think they want just a little bang for their buck....they want the whole ENCHILADA....because they are, after all, paying a private firm for information....(information, you stated earlier,that is readily available on the internet....) SO, if it is soooo available and cheap, why WOULD a hospital/employer need to hire a private background check company to do what is "readily available?" Esp. if they are worried about "cost effectiveness?"

The reason is: HR's all over the country have bought into the trend of thinking that they can tell what kind of person they have applying for a position based on that person's lifestyle, habits, "characteristics"....

This kind of information ISN"T on the internet, or readily available....

so they have to hire a company to go do this....

They reason, (wrongly) that if a person pays their rent on time, or if they read only happy family orient stories at the libraray, or if they subscribe to New Yorker Magazine, that they are well adjusted, well suited individuals that will enhance their organization....this is the baloney that is blathered from every podium at every HR convention in every city in this country....I know this to be true, because my best friend works for one of the largest corporations in this country in HR....and she tells me why this is happening....

This has to do with "psychological profiling".....a projected outcome based on loosely gathered facts and innuendo....from people recent or past who may or may not have had positive relationship with the intended potentiate....

This company has tons of clients....

And get this...they don't have a physical address...(wonder why that is???) all they have is a post office box....

Not my idea of an upfront interview...ya know?

teeituptom, BSN, RN · Sep 13, 2007

Trust me, Big Brother already has his eyes on you. You may think Im paranoid, but if any fears are true than its called fact not paranoia. Cameras are going up all over, people wander around with cameras to catch you. They say they are citizens but are they really. Do we know that for sure. Secretly they may really be Big Brother. You cant really tell can you.

CraigB-RN, MSN, RN · Sep 13, 2007

Personally I don't have a problem with it. I'm honest in all job applications, and I'd rather have a company who knows what they are doing look into things than some secratary checking it out on the internet. According to the Internet, I crashed a plane and dies a few years back.

When it comes to hiring, to many people lie on their applications. When i was A DON, I had Meth addict apply. They hadn't been convicted but 5 different arrests made me pretty suspicious.

i will admit that the time line of information they are asking is a bit excessive. I only have to go back 5 yeras for a mortage and 8 years for my security clearance.

Yes there can be abuses. There can be abuses of everything. But to me the beninfits outway the negative things.

But I will admit, I've maintained a top secret security clearace for my Air Force job since 1978 so I"m a bit more used to stuff like that.

CRNI-ICU20 · Sep 14, 2007

To Craig:

My issue isn't with giving the information, or even having information being looked into about me; my issue is that once you have gone through this process, you have NO recourse to right any wrongs being databased about you....which can THEN be accessed by other places...

In the AirForce, YOUR INFORMATION IS KEPT SECRET....AND ONLY CERTAIN PEOPLE CAN HAVE ACCESS TO YOUR INFORMATION....

A civilian who is being investigated by a third party vendor has no security assurance....

This third party vendor is not answerable under the Fair Employment Act, per se, because much of what is "gathered" isn't about RACE, CREED, GENDER, OR AGE.....THE information they gather has to do with

characteristics, mode of living.

My issue has always been about what happens AFTERWARDS...ie, is the information stored? Who has access to it? Does it get outsourced outside of this country? Does the information or any part of it get sold to other companies/entities???

While I don't, and you don't have anything to "hide", per se....that isn't the point....THE POINT IS WHAT IF THE INFORMATION THAT WAS DATABASED ABOUT YOU IS/WAS INCORRECT?? How would you be able to get a company like this to change it? They don't have to answer to any part of the federal code....because they are not employing you directly....and they are not overtly discriminating against you as a civilian...so who would you appeal your case to?

The only way a company like this could be hammered is IF:

You signed a waiver stating information to be given ONLY to COMPANY A.....and they then went on to give information to some other entity about you....then you could get them for breaching your signed signature....but that's it!! and they STILL don't have to change what they say about you...

THat's what is bad about a company like this...

I understand that people lie on applications....but you admitted that even with a minimal check, you were able to siphon out a meth addict....so why would a non-civilian non-top-clearance individual need to have a background check this invasive in order to work at the bedside??

CraigB-RN, MSN, RN · Sep 14, 2007

I don't think the fears you have are fears that are nurse job specific. I think that data minning is a social issue that has already reached beyond the point were there is an easy fix.

I don't see much difference other than scope of things that went on in the past. I can remember co workers not getting jobs and then finding out that something was said about them at another job. Not "legal" and def not Kosher.

If you can find out that something is incorect, as of now at least there are ways to get it corrected. may not help you with the job you just applied for.

As an administrator I utilized one of those services, That's how I found the meth addict. As a working staff nurse, I agree that they are looking at way to MUCH information. Is there anything that can be done about it. Probably not unless we elect the right people to gov office.

P.S. I routinly check my credit history and do searches on my stuff. I'm just more comfortable with what my neigbors may say about me because of that security clearence stuff.

Speed Freak · Nov 30, 2008

And here I thought that my late 70s early 80s career in Media was buried and forgotten. Just that mustache alone (and the horrible black socks) would be reason enough not to hire me.

I hope they don't dig deep enough to find that incident with the Batman suit, two strippers, jumper cables and alligator. That is best left buried.

SBinGA · Dec 1, 2008

I had to sign up for this last semester as a Respiratory Therapy student.

My teachers explained it to us this way:

The company conducts a background check and sends it to the hospitals we will be clinic-ing. The jist of it is that we are given a 'score' on hireability-- no personal info is given out to either the hospitals or my professors.

So basically, if you have bad credit or criminal convictions that flag the system, you get a lesser score than a person with a clean record.

The hospital then chooses to hire you based on your score, they do not see all your personal info.

Speed Freak · Dec 1, 2008

The hospital then chooses to hire you based on your score, they do not see all your personal info.

Somehow, this seems even worse.

First you have to pass the schools background check, then the state before certification, the your employer runs you through Group 1, now this. What's next? Having the Pyschic Friends Network do a Tarot Spread and Astrological Chart?

Why don't the hospitals just put up some money had start some nursing and med schools at convents and monasteries. That way you can make sure the males are eunuchs and the females virgins and have nothing else to worry about.

This reminds me of the inspections that we used to have in the Army. If you had everything squared away, the commander would then go to the white glove. If that passed, the commander would thin hit corners with a q-tip. If that passed, he would take your ammo magazines apart. He would dig, for hours if he had to, until he found something.

Jeez! A background check should suffice! What do you mean the background check brought up nothing? Use that other agency. Oh you did? Use the other one. Gee, Mr. Speed Freak, but it says here that you once colored outside the lines while using crayons on a picture of a bunny in Kindergarten and we just can not abide the likes of you here. We have residents to worry about.

This borders on stupid.

THAT Nurse., BSN, MSN, DNP, RN, APRN · Dec 1, 2008

I might have told the school to get bent, they want to run things like a credit check on you.

The background check is no big deal at all, I can understand considering the drugs we deal with. But a credit check? A motor vehicle history? I see no reason for this other than digging for their own amusement at out expense. Professionals should not be used as toys.

Batman24 · Dec 1, 2008

I find it overboard and would look for another job opportunity.

StreetRN · Dec 1, 2008

You know, you don't have to sign the form. You don't have to work for that organization. Look elsewhere. With that said, past behavior predicts future behavior, so most of this info can be used to predict how someone will fit into an organization. Most employers are wary of potential employees who live beyond their means, live a reckless lifestyle, or have legal issues. These can all be costly behaviors and many employer doesn't want to assume the risk. :twocents: