Ok, I know that organ donation has been discussed here more than once, but I couldn't find anything that addressed my particular question/issue........so here goes.
In this year's presidential election, many of the exit polls showed that people voted based on their "family/moral values." It seems they (not me!) voted for Bush because they felt he stood for those values, especially in regards to gay marriage, abortion, etc. I was very distraught after the election because I hear these people talking but I don't see these people taking moral action! Organ donation is just one of the areas that angers me.
How can the majority of this country stand on such moral high-ground and then show such PATHETIC organ donation numbers? People are dying because they can't get an organ when there are plenty available, but they get buried with the patient! How can you proclaim to be such a good person with such high moral values when you aren't even willing to donate your or your family's organs in the event of their death? I really don't see that as being a whole lot less than murder.
I'm not even a nurse yet, so I'm not right in the middle of this yet, but I do dread it! Anyway, this is just something that disturbs me deeply and I wanted to get your take on it, especially those of you, if any, that are not willing to donate. I'd like an explanation!
It is a very short step from being a good thing, to being the right thing, to being the law. In our society it will be law one day that the state has the "right" to harvest your organs without your ok. I believe 100% that this will be wrong.
It's not the law here. But we call on every death anyway. These are usually harvested for eyes and skin, and the overwhelming majority of them are rejected by the agency or refused by the family. I don't deal with brain death on my unit.
I don't see where they are going to harvest organs without consent. Our society likes to sue too much for that to happen. One of the basic rights in medicine is the right to refuse. Before what you predict to happen it would have to go past the nurses associations and the physicians groups first, as I know there would be objections. The organization themselves would not advocate harvesting organs without consent I'm sure.
You're entitled to your opinion, and I respectfully disagree. :)
What do you not understand about it? We are a nation governed by non-medical people. It does not have to make medical sense to become law. In Georgia when our former governor heard that babies could become smarter by listening to classical music he made it a requirement that all new mothers received a cd of classical music to play at home. It did not matter to him that it was just a theory. It was highly unlikely in our parent's day (some 30-40 years ago) that God would be kicked out of school, that 2 men or 2 women would go to court to allow them to legally marry, that putting on a seat belt would be a requirement to drive, etc. Just curious: of those who read this how many of you would be ok with a mandatory organ donation law?
Was it mandatory that those mothers accept the CD and mandatory that they play it? They hopefully had the right to refuse and throw it in the trash if they wanted to.
I agree that our lawmakers are non-medical. They may not even listen to nurses, but they would doctors. (Which is probably how the CD law came into effect, the politician listened to some doctor). If the doctors and nurses stood against this they would not make it mandatory, especially with threats of lawsuits.
I would not be o.k. with a mandatory organ donation law.
But you make some interesting points about our "rights", such as the right to refuse to wear a seatbelt. So never say never.
Whoa NurseGuy - let's slow down and get off the slippery slope here. First of all, I agree with you that the process should remain completely voluntary. I'm not advocating that it become a mandated process. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and desire not to become an organ donor, and I respect that. However, as a future health care professional, you have a responsibilty to educate yourself on both sides of the issue and NOT continue to perpetuate the myths surrounding organ donation. You have not addressed any of the questions posed to you regarding your beliefs/reasoning for your negative view of organ donation, particularly the ones posed to you by Vizla's Mom in post #78
Nurseguy, please don't take offense when I ask you this: Have you ever personally witnessed, or been a part of, the organ donation process in action?
that putting on a seat belt would be a requirement to drive
Off track here for a minute...
When you don't wear your seatbelt, you not only endanger yourself, but others as well.
One example: You're not wearing your seatbelt. You're hit or you hit another car and you're ejected straight into the path of me. I swerve to avoid hitting you and end up in some ditch or hitting yet another car. You're dead (or brain dead) and I suffer a couple of broken bones, but otherwise I'm ok mainly because I was wearing my seat belt!
This was one of the best laws ever put on the books and another educational topic for nurses to share with their patients.
Whoa NurseGuy - let's slow down and get off the slippery slope here. First of all, I agree with you that the process should remain completely voluntary. I'm not advocating that it become a mandated process. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and desire not to become an organ donor, and I respect that. However, as a future health care professional, you have a responsibilty to educate yourself on both sides of the issue and NOT continue to perpetuate the myths surrounding organ donation. You have not addressed any of the questions posed to you regarding your beliefs/reasoning for your negative view of organ donation, particularly the ones posed to you by Vizla's Mom in post #78
I'm wondering the exact same thing.
What myth am I perpetuating? I DO NOT have a negative view of donating organs. I have a negative view that our elected officials will respect our desire to keep organ donation completely voluntary. And since when have our elected officials ever felt the need to ask us first before they passed a law for our own good? My information comes from the person that spoke at our school to try and get us to be organ donors. He is the one who actually goes to the hospital and asks the people to donate. I will state for the record: I am COMPLETELY for voluntary organ donation.
When you don't wear your seatbelt, you not only endanger yourself, but others as well.
One example: You're not wearing your seatbelt. You're hit or you hit another car and you're ejected straight into the path of me. I swerve to avoid hitting you and end up in some ditch or hitting yet another car. You're dead (or brain dead) and I suffer a couple of broken bones, but otherwise I'm ok mainly because I was wearing my seat belt!
This was one of the best laws ever put on the books and another educational topic for nurses to share with their patients.
What a stretch. What happens to me in my car has nothing to do with you. I suppose you think the government has the right to tell me to wear a helmet when I ride my motorcycle?
I suppose you think the government has the right to tell me to wear a helmet when I ride my motorcycle?
If you're going to ask this, then you have just one of many answers to the question of "why is my insurance so high"? It's a broad circle of one problem that leads to the next, and so on.
There's no 100% guarentee that people would always take responsibility for themselves and their actions.
Another question that's come to mind: what about the people that have cirrhosis of the liver related to alcohol abuse? Should they be excluded in the receiptient catagory, so that people with genetic liver defects, etc. can receive?
I ask this because of certain celebrities whose past is well know, that have received transplants. Although i think money and fame had a LOT to do with the treatment they were able to receive, and not necessarily with "who is in the most dire need".
Assuming that you don't go crashing through the windshield. It's not that big of a stretch, it's happened before.
Statistically how often does it happen? Again, I feel like I am being chastised because I basically want to be left alone in this world, do not want the government making every decision for me, and this especially covers being carved up after I am dead. Out of over 100 responses to the original question I have read less than 5% that try to convince me why I should donate, the others have tried to convince me why I am wrong.
What myth am I perpetuating? I DO NOT have a negative view of donating organs. I have a negative view that our elected officials will respect our desire to keep organ donation completely voluntary. And since when have our elected officials ever felt the need to ask us first before they passed a law for our own good? My information comes from the person that spoke at our school to try and get us to be organ donors. He is the one who actually goes to the hospital and asks the people to donate. I will state for the record: I am COMPLETELY for voluntary organ donation.
Well for one, you stated more than once that you feel families are coerced into donation and that representatives of the OPO essentially badger people into consenting. This is not the case at all, and once again, the vast majority of families are never approached in the first place because most decedents are not eligible to become organ donors.
Sorry if you find this insulting because that's not my intent, but you just don't appear to be very informed about the process of organ donation, and have based your entire body of knowledge about the subject on one talk you received in nursing school.
As an ICU nurse who often works closely with OPO reps and has been an active part of many organ donation cases, I feel I have a responsibility to educate others about the reality of organ donation. I have no desire to force anyone to do anything they don't agree with fundamentally, but I will not sit idly by and allow common misconceptions to proliferate. If nothing else, at least read these:
Statistically how often does it happen? Again, I feel like I am being chastised because I basically want to be left alone in this world, do not want the government making every decision for me, and this especially covers being carved up after I am dead. Out of over 100 responses to the original question I have read less than 5% that try to convince me why I should donate, the others have tried to convince me why I am wrong.
People are not convincing why someone is WRONG, they are giving opinions that do not necessarily agree with yours, and nobody is chastizing anything, they're providing their own point of view.
Statistics? Not sure, although the scenario that begalli described happened in this area over the summer. It sometimes a statistic to someone, untill that 'statistic' happens to them.
Tweety, BSN, RN
36,273 Posts
It's not the law here. But we call on every death anyway. These are usually harvested for eyes and skin, and the overwhelming majority of them are rejected by the agency or refused by the family. I don't deal with brain death on my unit.
I don't see where they are going to harvest organs without consent. Our society likes to sue too much for that to happen. One of the basic rights in medicine is the right to refuse. Before what you predict to happen it would have to go past the nurses associations and the physicians groups first, as I know there would be objections. The organization themselves would not advocate harvesting organs without consent I'm sure.
You're entitled to your opinion, and I respectfully disagree. :)