MA's Calling themselves Nurses

toadie · Jan 21, 2005

funny what people's perceptions of themselves are. MA's can give immunizations and boosters. dont believe they can give meds except in LTC, but depends on facility and state.

and, my good girlfriend is going to school to be an MA and she is convinced that it is the almost the same "degree" as a BSN. i like to keep my opiniions to myself on that matter.

moonchild20002000 · Jan 21, 2005

MA's are NOT allowed to call themselves nurses,this needs to be reported to the state BON.

usmc94201 · Jan 21, 2005

I was informed the MA's are not state regulated and that all their training is OJT. And yes the meds she gave my daughter were actually Immunizations.

LPN01112005 · Jan 21, 2005

I was informed the MA's are not state regulated and that all their training is OJT. And yes the meds she gave my daughter were actually Immunizations.

Not all MA's are only trained on the job. Some are trained in technical schools. In GA I've done clinicals in doctors' offices that employ mostly MA's and they DO act as nurses. In fact, they take nurse calls! It is my understanding that they do this all at the expense of the physician's license for whom they work. I've seen them give immunizations, rocephen, deco, B12, etc. they also do EKG's, vision screens, hearing screens, phone in prescriptions to the pharmacy....in other words, they do EVERYTHING an LPN would do in a doctor's office but without the license. I don't have a clue what MA's are paid, but it's probably a little less than the LPN, of course it were much less, they'd be starving. I think they are a valuable part of the healthcare team, but it is rather frustrating that they can call themselves nurses and the patient most times is none the wiser.

SmilingBluEyes · Jan 21, 2005

I do not believe in ANY state can an MA refer to herself as nurse! Check w/your board of nursing and report this. This is misrepresentation, at the least.

James Huffman · Jan 21, 2005

MA's are NOT allowed to call themselves nurses,this needs to be reported to the state BON.

Non-nurses calling themselves nurses is an irritation, but not necessarily against the law. In most states that I've seen, the protected terms are ''registered nurse," "RN," "licensed practical nurse," or '"LPN." I think there's also a feeling that if a person is representing themselves as an RN or LPN, they are driving very close to the edge, too.

In most situations (medical offices), the license they are operating under is that of the MD who hires them. If the doc is comfortable with them doing a certain procedure, then it's between the doc, the MA, and -- of course -- the patient.

Jim Huffman, RN

ldynwht · Jan 21, 2005

Glad to hear I am not the only one irritated by MA's calling themselves Nurses. In the office where I work they always called themselves the "Nurse" and proceeded to act the part such as giving advice and telling people on the phone if they really needed to be seen or not.I complained, they would get talked to and continue to do it. Finally last year in my state(CO) it became illegal, a misdemenor. to call yourself a Nurse unless you were an RN or LPN.

Antikigirl, ASN, RN · Jan 21, 2005

If I was to come up to a MA and they presented themselves as a nurse, I wouldn't go running off to the BON right off the bat! I would simply let them know that representing themselves as a nurse isn't ethical or moral, that is not true, that it is impersonation, and yes..they can get into legal/criminal trouble! I would talk to them first giving them the benifit of the doubt that maybe they don't know, or somone before them said it was okay!

I have an MA at my own PCP's office, and my entire family and some of my residents and staff that also go to that PCP thought she was a nurse too...although if I think of it...she never directly said so. When I asked her, she told me "I get that all the time, no I am a MA". Now she represented herself well, and we both talked about how maybe she should wear a different uniform or a lab coat to distinguish herself from the one RN's and LPN's.

Now she and I work to correct people thinking she is a nurse (don't want my patients thinking she is a nurse), and she has no probelm admitting she is an MA..in fact she loves it!

This being a little different situation, it can prove that there is always a story behind an issue, and best to get your facts before damaging someones certification/licenses by going directly to the BON.

BUT, if I tell an MA that and they don't listen (and believe me I would check and I have many other folks that would check too) then I have given a warning and would report them. Or even talk to the human resource department for that facility or even their supervisor and talk with them too!

Misrepresentation is dangerous stuff, but then again how much accidental 'misrepresentation' happends every day?

Heck, in RN school I actually got a review from Physicians on a psych unit because of my school uniform! LOL! We couldn't wear name badges because it was a psych unit, so they really didn't know I was a student nurse unless they actually looked at the huge blue patch on my shoulder..LOL! But I really shined in this area, and they thought I was an intern and got a WONDERFUL review! LOL, I kept that for sure, I was so proud of myself...I keep it in a scrapbook~! But then I thought...okay then how many patients or patient families thought I was an intern? I had no idea I could be seen as one at all! If someone had asked, they wouldn't have a doubt I was a Nursing Student, and when the board of review there found out they giggled and said...are you sure you want to go into nursing??? LOL (I told them I would switch if they could pay for med school! LOL!).

SmilingBluEyes · Jan 21, 2005

The problem is, often, doctors ENCOURAGE this misrepresentation, for many reasons oftentimes. So yes, correcting them is a good thing, but sometimes, this is deliberate. And if so, it's illegal.

LorraineCNA · Jan 21, 2005

the majority of MA's aren't just people yanked in off the streets with OTJ training. Most are either certified or registered with either the AAMA or AMT. To qualify for the testing for certification or registration you must have attended a school certified by either the CAAHEP or ABHES. There are strict educational guidelines for the accredited schools.

I'm a CNA going to school for MA. I'm in an 8.5 month accelerated program. If it weren't an accelerated program, I'd be in school for a year. There is only one hour a day of my classes that is administrative. The rest is 2.5 hours a day of clinical and 1.5 hours of terminology, including all the body systems. I will also have completed 2.5 months of (unpaid) externship.

When I graduate and become certified, I will legally be able to give injections, perform venipuncture, EKG's, limited radiology and various other tasks. IOW, I will be able to perform MOST of the technical tasks that an LPN might in an office environment, plus phlebotomy. I ALSO will be able to perform any front office task, which is why a lot of MD's prefer to hire MA's now in lieu of nurses. Yes, I have had hands on training in all of these areas.

I started coming to this board when I was trying to decide between nursing school and MA school. I decided that I really didn't want the stress of attending a nursing school that was not local to me (there isn't one local) to make a starting wage of 12.00 an hour as an LPN, which is what the hospitals are paying LPN's here in PA. Of course, LTC pays more, but I've seen the stress and burnout in that area of nursing having been a CNA.

Will I call myself a nurse? Absolutely not. I will be proud to call myself a CMA. I've worked very hard to earn that right, just as hard as you have to earn the title of nurse.

It really bothers me that most here are so quick to assume that MA's are non-educated and unqualified personnel when that is simply not true in most cases. I've known some nurses who acted very non-educated and unqualified even though they've acheived the coveted title of "nurse". In fact, I don't believe I've ever seen as much in-fighting between the ranks as I see within the nursing ranks. MSN vs. BSN vs. ADN vs. diploma RN, etc.

CMA's or RMA's are not "less" than nurses, but DIFFERENT than nurses.

Yes, I'm very well aware the flames are coming.

Lorraine

CNA

future CMA

GingerSue · Jan 21, 2005

If I was to come up to a MA and they presented themselves as a nurse, I wouldn't go running off to the BON right off the bat! I would simply let them know that representing themselves as a nurse isn't ethical or moral, that is not true, that it is impersonation, and yes..they can get into legal/criminal trouble! I would talk to them first giving them the benifit of the doubt that maybe they don't know, or somone before them said it was okay!
They probably don't know all these things about titles, education, legal issues, ethical issues. I've met RN from another country who was so intimidated by the doctor she worked for, she was doing things that she wasn't supposed to do - she found a way out.