why do many MAs and CNAs call themselves nurses?

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As I was taking care of a pt, she mentions she's also a nurse. I asked what her specialty is and where she works at. She says she works at a clinic as an MA. In my head, in what universe is an MA a nurse?!

Specializes in Neuro/NSGY, critical care, med/stroke/tele.

Slightly off the scrubs color-coordination topic, BUT another pet peeve of mine that came up on social media the other day: PA students specifically saying they study and practice medicine.

No. You do not come out of PA program with a masters' degree in medicine.

You study *physician assistant studies* UNDER THE MEDICAL MODEL.

That is why your qualification and degree on completion is an MPAS. NOT MM/"master of medicine" or similar.

Telling people you're at a "medical school" may be misleading and, unless people are very familiar with the field, confusing.

/rant! Sorry, this came up when they also posted a "8 things not to say to PAs" link that was BLATANT in its errors about nursing -- specifically saying that nurses cannot specialize (false!), that PAs have more autonomy than nurses (fasle! or at least qualify... do you mean NPs? hey but wait, who has their own independence license?), and on and on. Just no. (It's here: 8 Things Never To Say To A Physician Assistant | Fornewnews)

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Specializes in Stepdown, PCCN.
Slightly off the scrubs color-coordination topic, BUT another pet peeve of mine that came up on social media the other day: PA students specifically saying they study and practice medicine.

No. You do not come out of PA program with a masters' degree in medicine.

You study *physician assistant studies* UNDER THE MEDICAL MODEL.

That is why your qualification and degree on completion is an MPAS. NOT MM/"master of medicine" or similar.

Telling people you're at a "medical school" may be misleading and, unless people are very familiar with the field, confusing.

/rant! Sorry, this came up when they also posted a "8 things not to say to PAs" link that was BLATANT in its errors about nursing -- specifically saying that nurses cannot specialize (false!), that PAs have more autonomy than nurses (fasle! or at least qualify... do you mean NPs? hey but wait, who has their own independence license?), and on and on. Just no. (It's here: 8 Things Never To Say To A Physician Assistant | Fornewnews)

I don't like articles like this one that are so divisive, I recently read one that was really derogatory toward "noctors" and was a huge dig at dnp programs.

However, physician assistants do obtain a license to practice medicine (with supervision, much like a resident physician), and the program determines the degree. Some programs award a master of medicine or medical sciences, others a master of physician assistant studies.

I do think that a person must be careful to be clear and not mislead others as to their education and role.

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Specializes in Neuro/NSGY, critical care, med/stroke/tele.
Some programs award a master of medicine or medical sciences, others a master of physician assistant studies.

Oh wow, I had never heard of that before, thanks!!

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Specializes in Stepdown, PCCN.
Oh wow, I had never heard of that before, thanks!!

I applied to PA programs last year or I wouldn't have realized it either.

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Specializes in Neuro/NSGY, critical care, med/stroke/tele.
I applied to PA programs last year or I wouldn't have realized it either.

It's funny, it's seems like half of the cohort of my accelerated post-bacc BSN program were wannabe PAs who got told they weren't accepted to that program but offered a spot in the nursing program.

I specifically chose nursing because I connect SO much more to the nursing model of care than to the medical model (yes, DO/homeopathic medicine options notwithstanding).

I came into this program WANTING to be a nurse, with all that that means, and hope to go into advanced practice and further my education under the nursing model.

(of course, still 3 months to go before NCLEX, so we'll see how that goes LOL!!!)

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Specializes in Stepdown, PCCN.
It's funny, it's seems like half of the cohort of my accelerated post-bacc BSN program were wannabe PAs who got told they weren't accepted to that program but offered a spot in the nursing program.

I specifically chose nursing because I connect SO much more to the nursing model of care than to the medical model (yes, DO/homeopathic medicine options notwithstanding).

I came into this program WANTING to be a nurse, with all that that means, and hope to go into advanced practice and further my education under the nursing model.

(of course, still 3 months to go before NCLEX, so we'll see how that goes LOL!!!)

That's interesting. I applied for PA because my BS is in biochem and I didn't want another bachelor degree.

I'm going to an NP program that accepts RNs with other BSs. I am more interested in nursing and am really excited to go that route.

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Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
I actually enjoyed reading your response. I 100% agree, that all the 'crap' and rules and administration behind healthcare cannot measure or distinguish a nurse. What I CAN tell you is that you don't respect my response because I'm not even graduated. Fine. I respect that. All I can tell you is I have been in healthcare, my whole life, since my best friend died in elementary. I've been in this field since then. Aside from other positions I worked my way up and worked in risk management and had the most intense, sad, miserable, depressed time of my life for that 2 years. Processes were changed, and improved but at near misses, or with some form of patient harm done. I investigated when things really did go wrong. I backed our patients, nurses, doctors, techs, etc. I spoke with families, to their face, when something went wrong. As far as the name tag thing goes.... I would rather a patient know my name. In situations I got names from patients for example: I heard "That nurse in the green" (That told me an aint or as we called, Patient Care technician) That nurse in the "royal blue" outfit on Saturday in the day......" that uniform color told me right then it was the nurse he is talking about. It's just another piece to that puzzle. Not to blame but to understand the patients perception. I have been and am committed to this field since I was a child etc. I don't need to prove to YOU that I can and am and WILL understand what my patients need.

Again, I do like your response though, I appreciated hearing your insight. Change is hard, magnet is real, it is here and it is backed by research. But all in all, I do agree, I have been in some areas of "Magnet" status places and I'm like this is a joke this is not magnet (And yes, I've talked to my state leader in VA about it).

Back to the point though about nursing assistants calling themselves nurses, yes there is a legal issue, but if we can do what we can to let them understand what we are doing and why and what our role is then hey, cool. What harm is there in that? We are a TEAM. Without the nurse aid there is no NURSE. Without the nurse there is no doctor etc.

You have not been in health care since elementary. You were a visitor in elementary. (Elementary school, I'm presuming.) You were on the outside looking in.

Magnet status was once something to be proud of; now it's a joke. Hospitals turn themselves inside out when the Magnet review is coming; as soon as it's over things go back to business as usual.

Unless and until you are licensed as either an RN or an LPN, you are not a nurse. Therefore, you cannot presume to know or understand the role of a nurse and your advice as to how nurses should be conducting themselves professionally is not only irritating and incorrect, it's invalid and insulting. No matter now much you THINK you know from visiting patients, from working in the risk management department or from your Accelerated BSN program.

And as far as the topic -- MAs and CNAs calling themselves (or allowing themselves to be called) nurses -- that's illegal in most states. And it's incorrect. Yes we are a team -- we are all integral and important members of a team. But MAs and CNAs are not medical students nor are they nurses. And nurses -- even those who hold doctorates -- are not physicians.

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Specializes in Med/Surg, Ortho, ASC.
That's interesting. I applied for PA because my BS is in biochem and I didn't want another bachelor degree.

I'm going to an NP program that accepts RNs with other BSs. I am more interested in nursing and am really excited to go that route.

Lol! Read that to say "an NP program that accepts RN's and other BS'ers." Gotta slow down and stop skimming.

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Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Actually we're being taught in nursing school the importance of returning to coloured uniforms. Many associations have reviewed studies and are coming forward recommending hospitals return to uniforms, with the discussion of implementing nation wide standards again. It's become a serious concern in recent years that patients are misidentifying health care workers, and that both time and potential accidents can be saved by making the identification easier across the board. Of course we are also being taught the importance of properly introducing yourself (including your credentials) at all times as part of this.

Now I'm in Canada so perhaps this isn't being discussed in the states.

It may also be your opinion that coloured uniforms serve no purpose, however that is not one shared with nursing associations, regulators or researchers.

Color coding uniforms has been discussed in the states for years. It's been done. And it's been proven that patients and their families STILL don't know who the nurse is. Nursing associations are locked helplessly in their ivory towers, regulators and researchers need to spout SOMETHING to justify their existence. With respect to your teachers, of course.

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Specializes in Med/Informatics.
Color coding uniforms has been discussed in the states for years. It's been done. And it's been proven that patients and their families STILL don't know who the nurse is. Nursing associations are locked helplessly in their ivory towers, regulators and researchers need to spout SOMETHING to justify their existence. With respect to your teachers, of course.

Well I've yet to see any peer reviewed studies being supplied from yourself or anyone else disagreeing with colour coded uniforms, and at this moment in time I have too much homework to find one, but I'll see if one of my instructors can link one for me. That being said so long as this is just a matter of opinion I think I'm going to stick with believing what my professors and the associations recommend, as they are far more likely to be up to date on latest research. I'll keep an open mind if anyone has any studies about it though, thanks.

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It's funny, it's seems like half of the cohort of my accelerated post-bacc BSN program were wannabe PAs who got told they weren't accepted to that program but offered a spot in the nursing program.

I specifically chose nursing because I connect SO much more to the nursing model of care than to the medical model (yes, DO/homeopathic medicine options notwithstanding).

I came into this program WANTING to be a nurse, with all that that means, and hope to go into advanced practice and further my education under the nursing model.

(of course, still 3 months to go before NCLEX, so we'll see how that goes LOL!!!)

I'm right there with you. My well meaning good friend has told me on numerous occasions that she doesn't understand why I don't go to medical school. She says this because she sees how studious I am and how book smart I am.

But, I love the nursing model, and love my FNP more than my family doctor. Her approach, while doing the exact same thing as the doctor she covers for, just says nursing, all around. I love it.

I don't take it personally because she's my friend. But it bugs me what the general public thinks nurses are. I'm not going to be able to change anyone's mind that nurses are just as intelligent and capable of learning even more (advancing their degree) as doctors.

My own dear husband told me the other night that he hopes I have a good night and that hopefully time will fly by for me on my shift, being busy putting patients to bed and all.

No babe. That's what I did as a CNA.

Sigh...

Lol, then there are the opposites who ask tons of medical questions..

"So I have this thing here (points to body part)...what is it?" My cousin asks me a lot of peds and OB/Gyn questions. Little does she know I simply Google it (out of genuine curiosity) because those clinical rotations were so long ago. Then I tell her to call her OB or peds office and ask the nurse actually working in that field.

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Specializes in HH, Peds, Rehab, Clinical.

I've worked in facilities that required certain colors for certain staff (RN's wore ceil blue), and facilities that let any staff wear anything they cared to scrub-wise. Made NO difference. Patients called anyone wearing scrubs "nurse". I've also worn a big RN placard under my photo ID, same thing. All persons in scrubs were considered nurses by most patients

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