LPNs in the ED

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Specializes in Psych.

Ok, here's another question for you all,

In our ED its all RNs except for a couple of LPNs that have been there forever. They are awesome, but it does pose some problems like they can't do IV meds or initial assessments and that falls onto an RN to do. Some of the RNs are resentful that there are LPNs in the ED because they view it as being more work for them because of the things the LPN can't do. I think LPNs could be great resources if used correctly in terms of their scope of practice. Instead of giving them bed assignments perhaps having them float and do things like foleys, PO meds, pain level reassessments, helping with med reconciliations, etc. Maybe encourage our docs that not everyone needs an IV and not all meds need to be IV for all pts so the LPNs can do more. Any thoughts?

D

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Specializes in LPN, Peds, Public Health.

why cant the LPNs do IV meds? As far as I know we can't spike blood and we can't do initial assessments... I'm sure its different in other states. LPNs on the floor should take work off of the RN, not add to it...

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Specializes in Psych.
why cant the LPNs do IV meds? As far as I know we can't spike blood and we can't do initial assessments... I'm sure its different in other states. LPNs on the floor should take work off of the RN, not add to it...

LPNs aren't allowed to do IV push in our state. Most of our ED meds are IV push.

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Why why why are we having yet another LPN vs RN discussion? Get over it already. If you don't like LPN's in the ED, then take it up with the Nursing Supervisor. Til then, I'll just keep doing my job, and you can do yours. BTW-I personally think that with the salary differences, RN's don't have much room to complain, especially given just how much gets dumped on the LPN's...

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Specializes in Onco, palliative care, PCU, HH, hospice.
Why why why are we having yet another LPN vs RN discussion? Get over it already. If you don't like LPN's in the ED, then take it up with the Nursing Supervisor. Til then, I'll just keep doing my job, and you can do yours. BTW-I personally think that with the salary differences, RN's don't have much room to complain, especially given just how much gets dumped on the LPN's...

I don't think the OP intended this as an LPN vs RN thread.

Yeah, if the LPN's there can't push IV meds it maybe best for everybody to utilize them as a float nurse and do the tasks you described. That takes the load of the RN's not to mention the LPN as well I would imagine it can be just as frustrating for them trying to hunt someone down who isn't busy to push some Dilaudid for a patient in horrific pain. Hopefully the nurses on your unit can come together and figure out a solution that will work well for everybody.

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I personally don't like the whole RN vs LPN thing. As far as I'm concerned the educational process should be amended and all nurses should be equal. LPNs do 99% of what RNs do without the pay. A nurse is a nurse. I've met LPNs who are far better with their skills than RNs. It's just another way employers get RN work without RN pay.:nurse:

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Specializes in med/surg/tele/neuro/rehab/corrections.
Ok, here's another question for you all,

In our ED its all RNs except for a couple of LPNs that have been there forever. They are awesome, but it does pose some problems like they can't do IV meds or initial assessments and that falls onto an RN to do. Some of the RNs are resentful that there are LPNs in the ED because they view it as being more work for them because of the things the LPN can't do. I think LPNs could be great resources if used correctly in terms of their scope of practice. Instead of giving them bed assignments perhaps having them float and do things like foleys, PO meds, pain level reassessments, helping with med reconciliations, etc. Maybe encourage our docs that not everyone needs an IV and not all meds need to be IV for all pts so the LPNs can do more. Any thoughts?

D

I think if these LPN's have been there forever then just leave it as is. Why would they want to basically be "downgraded?"

Some ED's are split in two like one side is minor procedures and that's where LPN"s are utilized because the people there don't need IV's. That might be a wiser decision.

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Specializes in CCU/CVU/ICU.
Ok, here's another question for you all,

In our ED its all RNs except for a couple of LPNs that have been there forever. They are awesome, but it does pose some problems like they can't do IV meds or initial assessments and that falls onto an RN to do. Some of the RNs are resentful that there are LPNs in the ED because they view it as being more work for them because of the things the LPN can't do. I think LPNs could be great resources if used correctly in terms of their scope of practice. Instead of giving them bed assignments perhaps having them float and do things like foleys, PO meds, pain level reassessments, helping with med reconciliations, etc. Maybe encourage our docs that not everyone needs an IV and not all meds need to be IV for all pts so the LPNs can do more. Any thoughts?

D

This kinda goes along with another thread regarding medics. So, my question is, what can an LPN do in the ER that a paramedic cant? or vise-versa? OR...are their ED roles similar??? If they're similar, why the resentment of LPNs in ER as opposed to the near-unanimous admiration for the 'helpful medics' in ED (other than that medics are mostly 'cute' males). Do ED-LPN and Paramedic roles over-lap?? Aside from some far-flung rural places (or the occaisional bigger place) do the majority of ED-Paramedics have roles similar to LPNs...or are medics more 'tech' than LPNs?//

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Specializes in Psych.
I don't think the OP intended this as an LPN vs RN thread.

Yeah, if the LPN's there can't push IV meds it maybe best for everybody to utilize them as a float nurse and do the tasks you described. That takes the load of the RN's not to mention the LPN as well I would imagine it can be just as frustrating for them trying to hunt someone down who isn't busy to push some Dilaudid for a patient in horrific pain. Hopefully the nurses on your unit can come together and figure out a solution that will work well for everybody.

Thank you. As I think I clearly stated, the question is not an LPN vs RN thing. The question is what is the best structure to allow LPNs to work in the ED. It is really frustrating for the LPNs I work with. In just the blink of an eye one of their PTs is suddenly intubated and bam they have to trade patients with someone. Or someone needs pain meds IV push as you stated and they need to track down an RN to do it. They are not somehow less in skill or ability just because the rules don't allow them to do such things. But its wrong to place them and us in a position where we are constantly frustrated. We do have a lower acuity section of our ED but even there IV meds are the norm. My point with the post was to ask for any innovative ideas from my peers as to how LPNs could be meshed into the ED system to make things run more smoothly, not start an LPN vs RN debate. As it stands, it appears our ED is looking to phase out LPNs completely which I feel is wrong and inappropriate.

D

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Specializes in Psych.
This kinda goes along with another thread regarding medics. So, my question is, what can an LPN do in the ER that a paramedic cant? or vise-versa? OR...are their ED roles similar??? If they're similar, why the resentment of LPNs in ER as opposed to the near-unanimous admiration for the 'helpful medics' in ED (other than that medics are mostly 'cute' males). Do ED-LPN and Paramedic roles over-lap?? Aside from some far-flung rural places (or the occaisional bigger place) do the majority of ED-Paramedics have roles similar to LPNs...or are medics more 'tech' than LPNs?//

Not quite sure I follow. In our ED paramedics drop off pts but don't help out the ED staff. They are far too busy making multiple runs. Actually we have very few paramedics who drop off to us. Its mostly EMTs.

D

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Specializes in ER, L&D, RR, Rural nursing.

In the provinces of Canada things are changing and there are very few IV meds an LPN can't give. Anything IVP, being one of them.That being said, there is a place for them, it just has to be figured out. Best use of resources and all.

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Specializes in ER,ICU,L+D,OR.

I like LPNs and LVNs. However in todays world with all its legalese

It is difficult to employ them usefully in the ER

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