Losing respect for nursing students

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

I've always been one that enjoyed having students. Im not one to eat the young. We were all there once. But I feel like I'm losing respect for some of the new students coming out. I guess I'm old school but we did not sit when we were students and we did not stand at the desk and gossip. You did not see a nurse or a doctor standing and a student sitting. Uniforms that look disastrous and hair hanging down. They are at times loud and unruly. Is the respect for our profession gone? Or is it just me?

I feel your pain. The last time I had to deal with students, I thought it would have taken dynamite to remove them from the desk (and no, they weren't doing anything productive). Staff shouldn't have to beg to get at the computers nor put up with eye rolls when asked.

No, it's not just you.

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

Kjnsweets- its not just you. We have nursing students who rotate through our unit (med-surg). Here is a brief summary of their make-up. 3 have the so-called "tram stamp tattoos on their chest, neck and top of their buttocks- seen from the revealing un-ironed scrubs. Every nail has a multi-color design and a ring on each finger. They are loud and they text in front of the patient while doing vitals or educating the patients. I had to pull 2 of them out and speak to them about our profession. One did not comb her hair for a week and said that it represent how clinicals make her feel. I asked her why she chose nursing- the money of course, not cleaning patients or listening to them whine. go figure. I am old school and I still hold my role as a nurse in very high esteem.

What does that mean?

I can just hear the director of my nursing program: "If your uncombed hair is a representation of how you feel about clinical, then it is obvious to the both of us that you need not return in the future."

FuturePsychNP · Apr 29, 2013

I feel your pain. The last time I had to deal with students, I thought it would have taken dynamite to remove them from the desk (and no, they weren't doing anything productive). Staff shouldn't have to beg to get at the computers nor put up with eye rolls when asked.
No, it's not just you.

I don't find an issue with anyone sitting. Instead, after reading through all of this, and posting a few replies myself, I take more of an issue with those who lack the assertiveness to tell another person to get out of the way. If they roll their eyes, they roll their eyes. You're not insulted or harmed, and the eye roller is merely trying to save face. It's a social reaction among those that aren't trained to do what they're told when they're told, and I can't really blame them for it. I'm not condoning any part of any of this. All I'm saying for all readers is if there's someone in your seat tell them to move, get out of the way, un*** the chair, go sit over there, or any number of common phrases. As a student, worker, or any other role if I don't have something I feel like I should be doing I'm going to sit down.

SaoirseRN · Apr 29, 2013

In my experience, students described in the OP have been in the minority. The ones I can recall have all been of different ages and backgrounds. I honestly think these types of people exist everywhere. There will always be a student, a trainee, a new hire, etc, who just doesn't seem interested in following the rules or don't think they apply to them. Not limited to nursing. For the most part the students I have worked with have all been eager to learn, respectful, and professional in appearance.

SaoirseRN · Apr 29, 2013

In my program, it isn't the RNs who are supervising us with med passes and procedures, it is the clinical instructor. And for the senior-level nursing students, depending on their clinical setting, they will oftentimes pick up the nurses' patient load and do the majority of the workload, with the licensed RN supervising them.
So yeah, students DO some of your work...

The point is that the patient is still the responsibility of the RN, even if the clinical instructor is supervising. Yes, physically you are doing the work, but I still have to assess my patient, chart, check that the meds were given and that tasks have been done for them. So physically, yes, you've done some work, but that doesn't mean I can just forget about those things for that patient.

This isn't a complaint, just a fact.

For the record, I love teaching and always volunteer to preceptor students or have them work with me. I make myself a go-to person, or "safe" person to go to with questions, even if I'm not working one on one with the student or new grad that day. I accept the extra work involved, but it is extra work.

RNdynamic · Apr 29, 2013

A few years back, I had a nursing student take a chart out of my hands and very rudely said 'uh I'm a nursing student, BSN program, thanks'. I was appalled. I was working in CDI at the time and our charts were a hybrid of electronic and paper. I was clearly reading the chart and writing queries. I went over to the student and said 'I'm an employee here, MSN, kindly wait your turn'. That clinical group did things that never would have flown at my school. Yelling at instructors - coming in late - not prepared - expecting staff to give up charts so they could review their patients - it goes on and on. To the instructors credit, she stood her ground with the students and sent some of them home.

Your story sounds completely fabricated.

kjnsweets · Apr 29, 2013

There are alittle of both. Young and second career. I find the second career ones aren't so bad. I think that most of it falls on the instructor. I was taught by an army nurse she was very strict and demanded respect but I thank god she was like that. When I graduated I learned to trust what I had learned. These students need to learn that if they want respect they need to act respectful of our profession. I still love having the ones that show a genuine concern for what we do. Our profession is not a get rich quick job. It is very demanding with a high burnout rate. It is sometimes very unforgiving but at the same time the most rewarding. If you are a student next time you go to clinical a please look at the way you act and ask yourself would I want my nurse to act this way????

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

This thread is VERY much one-sided, but that doesn't surprise me.
I am in nursing school, but I also work as an aide on a floor that "hosts" nursing students, so I see both sides. My clinical groups have been very respectful, and yes, we do sit down....to chart and look up meds, not to surf on Facebook. We are expected to everything we've been taught in our class and to build up on previous skills. It is shocking that there are some students who have to be chased down and told to do vitals, assessments and baths. At my clinicals, we were doing all of that AND the more complex skills we learned in lab.
I love how some nurses complain about students but then forget that the students are doing some of their work (passing meds, performing skills). To the nurses who are complaining about nursing students and lamenting about the erosion "old-school" values, I give you this:"Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers."

― Socrates
So before people complain about the younger generation, please take a look at the past. Older generations have whined about the youth since before Christ, so what makes you think that this new generation is particularly deviant? I'm sure when you were students, the RNs complained about your generation as well.

That being said, I think some of the complaints are valid. Whenever I see a nurse standing, I offer my seat to them. If there is a learning opportunity, I am one of the first to raise my hands up. However, I do see some of my classmates hesitate to practice skills and huddle around to gossip (but I've seen professional nurses do this as well) and when I'm at work and I see nursing students crowd ALL of the computers, I do get frustrated. Yes, I understand they are here to learn, but when they see an employee standing there waiting for a computer, you should offer to give yours to that employee.

I think it really has to do with the program...this isn't generational in the least.

I don't think there's a problem with nursing students sitting at the desk, as long as they do not inconvenience staff. Students may help with some of the work staff nurses need to do, but that's it...they help. Don't get me wrong, it's greatly appreciated, but it's not the same as having a full assignment and watching over a student(s).

When my class was in school, we usually charted at the counter by the desk, a chair the hallway or in the report room. We just did not take up space that could have gone to staff.

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

But you don't lighten my workload. I once spent nearly 15 minutes with a student explaining that Yes, it was OK to give the Coumadin with a "elevated" INR of 3.0. Over and over and over I explained that an "elevated" INR was the goal! I ended up giving the drug because she "just didn't feel comfortable" giving it.
Re: Hair - there are several young nurses on my unit. Most are pretty good. One however, always has her hair down - it gets into everything. People have told her to put it up, a couple of families have even complained but she keeps it down. Gross

When I was in school in the early 80s some of the guys had longish hair that touched the collar. One of my instructors made my one male classmate pull his hair back into a tiny ponytail. We ragged on him the whole day, calling him "Thomas Jefferson."

netglow, ASN, RN · Apr 29, 2013

When I was in school in the early 80s some of the guys had longish hair that touched the collar. One of my instructors made my one male classmate pull his hair back into a tiny ponytail. We ragged on him the whole day, calling him "Thomas Jefferson."

Off topic, but when OCNRN63 and I talk - we take over....

Why can you NOT pull a football player's hair. If he's got hair down to his butt, well, to me you should be able to pull it. When I was in grade school the boys pulled the girls hair - and nobody penalized them for it. Now that men want to be women, and get extensions and everything (not even real folks) they want to have their cake and eat it too. IDK, maybe it's because extensions are not cheap?

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

I asked the student if they knew what Coumadin was for. They did not so I should them how to look it up.
I asked if they knew the pt's medical hx. They did not so I helped them look it up.
I explained that an elevated INR is expected and. Also showed them how to look at past results.
Even with all of this, they were still fixated that the INR was not normal.
And for the record, other staff tell new staff to go to me for help because I teach them things without making them feel stupid.

This is the problem...you did all of that and she still didn't/wouldn't get it. Not just that, but you were criticized for how you handled it. What if you'd had another needy student on top of the one you already had? How are you supposed to get your own work done?

OCNRN63, RN · Apr 29, 2013

In my program, it isn't the RNs who are supervising us with med passes and procedures, it is the clinical instructor. And for the senior-level nursing students, depending on their clinical setting, they will oftentimes pick up the nurses' patient load and do the majority of the workload, with the licensed RN supervising them.
So yeah, students DO some of your work...

Perhaps that's true in your clinical setting, but it's not the case everywhere.