Life as a minority in nursing

lifelearningrn, BSN, RN · Jan 8, 2011

The Commuter,
"Actually, studies have proven that resumes and job applications with black-sounding names receive 50 percent fewer callbacks than resumes with white-sounding names"
I believe that but I don't think it has anything to do with race. It has to do with having a unique name, or an unusual name or a nonstandard name or a nonstandard spelliing of a name. I can probably dig up some of the actual studies if you want, they are quite commonly referenced in baby name books/websites. There is a strong correlation almost no matter what the parameters of the study. The exceptions are certain narrow niches that I don't remember specifically - among the uber famous celebrities, I think, or certain performance or fashion careers. Some studies have tried to find the reasons on this phenomenon (like whether people were associating the name to a particular race or socioeconomic status) but it is just as true when the parameters of the studies preclude that.

Go ahead and dig those up. I think the whole "Un1qu4" names and spellings thing come along recently enough that a lot of that population hasn't hit the workforce yet. However, if there are studies, I'd love to see them.

Saysfaa · Jan 8, 2011

Ok. It may take some time to do a thorough job.

Here is one... http://www.kaaj.com/psych/namebk.html

Note that, like the resume study, the research was intended to measure response to the name only.

muneca13 · Jan 8, 2011

I reallly don't think that being a minority has a great effect on your studies or you getting hired, I do belive it has to do with the people who often are supposed to guide you , like The Commuter mentioned her parents knew nothing when it came to her trying to obtain a degree, there are plenty of people who grew up with this type of thinking, it's really hard to break the cycle which in my opinion is one of the most important aspects of you attaining something better for yourself! I work in a hospital where the diversity is amazing , there are plenty of minorites in what we would call 'powerful positons'. Where there is a will there is a way and what we need to learn to do is not be so focused on being able to get a job because you are brown, purple or orange focus on being confident, not you per say but anyone who may think that we are less than!

want2banurse35 · Jan 9, 2011

I can totally understand, respect, and appreciate the point that you are trying to make. However, the blunt truth is that not all kids succeed in school, no matter how much they want it. Parental influence and social class are huge determinants in a kid's success in school.
For example, a little boy might want to grow up to be a doctor. However, the kid is being raised in a lower-class household. His mother is a cashier who reads at a 6th grade level, cannot do any math beyond basic arithmetic, and barely squeaked by in high school. His father is a gas station attendant who is illiterate, only knows basic arithmetic, and did not attend school beyond 8th grade. There are no books in the household, and the parents cannot help with homework because they do not always understand his assignments. His parents have experienced personal failures with the educational system, and they do not discuss school with their son. These people are present-oriented and do not talk about future events such as college attendance and career planning.
Most of us know that a future doctor needs an exceptionally strong background in mathematics and science in addition to excellent reading comprehension skills, critical thinking skills, etc. His parents were not able to inculcate these things into him at home, and the school system can do only so much with an underprepared student. No matter how badly the boy wants to be a doctor, his disadvantaged background is helping to thwart his ambitious dream.
Children need to be cultivated toward education well before those formative preschool years. A poor child enters school with a smaller vocabulary, less academic skills, and more distractions in life than their more advantaged classmates. In other words, certain kids start far behind in the race to success.

I totally agree with you in the terms of distractions. How can you be a good student when you are worrying about where is your next meal coming from or you have to walk pass several drug dealers on the corner on your way to school everyday? I used to volunteer at a school in a rough neighborhood and I saw so many things that just broke my heart. I will never forget it was circle time and the kindergarten kids were telling the class what they did for the weekend and one of the little girls stood up and said,"my daddy got shot on the weekend." It was just very sad. During that time, I bought a couple of pairs of shoes for students because theirs were run down with holes in them. I have even purchased coats because some of the children would have on sweatjackets in the pouring rain. :crying2: The school I currently volunteer in now is in an affluent community and these kids are wearing $100+ coats.

allnurses Guide · Jan 9, 2011

I did not mean to pick two that were both associated with age or any other particular reason that they might rank where they do.
Meadow, Presley, Niamh, Rebeca, Sade...
all of which are also ranked near LaKisha on the list of most to least common names also won't fare well against Emily.
It doesn't matter why the name might be unusual.

I remember seeing more than one study done in the past about the name issue. What they did was to have teachers grade papers that were the same other than the students' name. One would be (as an example) Bertha or Zelda (apologies to those readers named Bertha and/or Zelda :)) or other name that people tend to view negatively. The other would have a name like Carol or Debbie or Lisa. Those were names with positive associations at that time.

The Berthas and the Zeldas were consistently given lower grades for the same work as the Carols and the Lisas. I believe it was the same for boy-names as well.

What Commuter was talking about is a name-based value judgement, but it goes toward a different type of bias. To be honest, though I know it is wrong and unfair, it isn't hard to imagine that some may pre-judge the personal characteristics of someone based on a name associated with culture or ethnicity. As some she mentioned aka Tanika or Deshawn or like that. There are people who do the same thing if it is Jorge Gonzales or Lee Kyung-Soon, too.

I live in the midst of a high population of immigrants from South Korea. Many regularly give their children Americanized names even if they are school age. Most near me happen to be devout Christians, and choose Old Testament first names. I don't agree that a child should be obliged to change their birth name to emigrate to another country, but they - I believe feel there is an advantage to doing that.

Saysfaa · Jan 9, 2011

I've seen those "grade the papers" things too but there are also various studies that show the Berthas do not have statistically different outcomes in life based on their names. The differences are only statistically significant if the teachers had never met the children or seen pictures (or that idea whatever the actual scenarios).

JeanettePNP, MSN, RN, NP · Jan 9, 2011

I agree with those that say that minorities (and males) are double advantaged in nursing school admissions, in scholarships and in the job market.

mary240 · Jan 9, 2011

i want to accomplish my goal and go back to school. i registered lpn program for 15 months, but iam nervous and uncertain. when i read their program guide book, it says a student will be permitted to fail only 1 nursing theory course (80%). in the entire length of the program. , however , following a second failure in any other nursing theory course in the entire length of the program, the students will be required to withdraw and not re-admitted to the program. i have the talent, but i have that fear to reach my goal. what advice you would give to me

cookie91 · Jan 10, 2011

wanttobanurse35 i completely agree with you. The school i attend is placed in a rough neighborhood and it is very discouraging to wake up every morning and go to school. The college i attend is ranked low because of the student body. I do not feel it is respected enough because the students who attend are all minorities; either in race and/ or social status. Some classes even feel like they are high school level.

Something else that kinda bothers me is that there are more people who are attending college after high school. There are also more schools like community colleges with open admissions. I feel more minorities or kids who did poorly in high school are choosing to attend to go to college and getting in. Now getting an associates degree is a joke and a bachelors degree is equivalent to a high school diploma. I thought college was about being a successful scholar ,and a challenge when stepping to the "real world"

i am simply trying to work hard and over pass what statistically may be true about my name, race or class so i can at least provide for my self.

allnurses Guide · Jan 10, 2011

I've seen those "grade the papers" things too but there are also various studies that show the Berthas do not have statistically different outcomes in life based on their names. The differences are only statistically significant if the teachers had never met the children or seen pictures (or that idea whatever the actual scenarios).

The Bertha vs Carol studies weren't based on real people. I wonder how the various studies you mention could reliably say one way or the other whether a name could have a negative impact on their "outcome in life". What does that mean?

It would seem that it would be difficult to impossible to indentify a name as the cause of anything since the number of variables over the span of one' lifetime would be so daunting a number it hardly seems worth it to try. So I will be curious to see how they were able to isolate that one factor.

metal_m0nk, BSN, RN · Jan 10, 2011

I think minorities have an advantage if anything. If an employer has to make a decision between a white and a minority candidate for a position the minority wins everytime.

The trend you're describing in equal opportunity hiring is countered by the fact that far fewer individuals in minority populations than whites are in a position to be eligible for employment in the first place due to the circumstances that are being discussed here. This is evidenced by personnel profiles. Only 34.1 percent of the private industry workforce in 2009 were minority employees - which means that there are nearly 2 white employees for every one minority employee in private industry.

If it is true that minority candidates have ultimate priority in hiring, then evidence suggests that more than 65% of the workforce that would have hiring priority doesn't even make it to the point of being considered for employment.

http://www1.eeoc.gov/eeoc/statistics/employment/jobpat-eeo1/2009/index.cfm#select_label

dudette10, MSN, RN · Jan 10, 2011

The trend you're describing in equal opportunity hiring is countered by the fact that far fewer individuals in minority populations than whites are in a position to be eligible for employment in the first place due to the circumstances that are being discussed here. This is evidenced by personnel profiles. Only 34.1 percent of the private industry workforce in 2009 were minority employees - which means that there are nearly 2 white employees for every one minority employee in private industry.
If it is true that minority candidates have ultimate priority in hiring, then evidence suggests that more than 65% of the workforce that would have hiring priority doesn't even make it to the point of being considered for employment.
http://www1.eeoc.gov/eeoc/statistics/employment/jobpat-eeo1/2009/index.cfm#select_label

I wasn't able to open up the files, but I want to point out that 65% of the population of the US is white/not hispanic, so the employment figures you presented are proportional to the overall population.

What you might find, however, is that minorities are in lower paying positions. I say that because my former company put out an employment/diversity brochure every year touting the number of women and minorities employed. In fact, the percent of employees who were women was higher than the percent of women in the US population.

However, when you saw the breakdown, women and minorities were disproportionately employed in nonmanagement positions, while the management positions were overwhelmingly white men.