WARNING: This is a controversial topic. Some readers may object to the viewpoints to be posted within. If you are one that cannot tolerate controversy, you have the right to not read this thread. Otherwise, all viewpoints are welcome.
Hello, this is Olive Vines here. I have been wanting to post a thread on this topic for a while. However, I have postponed doing that until now.
My observation is one that many minority nurses can relate too. Especially minorties in small southern towns such as the one I reside in. Here we go.
It seems to me that non-white, non-female nurses have the hardest time getting a job outside of acute care facilities. I live in a small town that is about an hour away from a metropolitan area. I have noticed that when it comes to needing nurses, a lot of physician offices, healthcare clinics, schools seem to overlook equally qualified minority nurses. I am including male nurses as being a minority because that is what they are in this profession.
When I take my daughter or accompany my mother to the doctor's or dentist's office, the staff is 9 times out of 10, overwhelmingly caucasian. But on the other hand, you go to any hospital and you will find that black females abd male nurses account for a large percentage of staff in those areas. We all know that non-acute care can be stressful, but not as near as stressful as primary care or any other branch of nursing. I see this strange trend in long term care facilities as well.
The only places where I have seen the exception is in large metropolitan areas where white people do not tend to reside. And I see a lot of black and male nurses relocating to Birmingham and Atlanta to get top notch jobs because the opportunities have been denied in small cities such as where I live. And while most of the jobs they garner happen to be in acute care facilities in those large cities, there seems to be more job satisfaction for some reason.
And while I'm on the topic. I also have noticed that I have better nights when most of my patients are African-American. Those patients tend to be less demanding of my time and take me more seriously as a health-care provider. But, on the other hand, when I have white patients, especially older white males, I see myself being ran up and down the hall for the non-essential things. And also, I get a lot of lip from the patient as to what they are NOT going to do or what medicine they are NOT going to take until they talk to their doctor. But, hold it right there, here's the kicker. When a nurse, who happens to be white, has had that same patient before, they seem not get that same attitude or disrespect from that same patient. They get a very nice, compliant patient while I put up with crap from them.
And one last thing, and this is just a personal vent: I am so tired of being mistaken for Environmental Services, Dietary or the PCA by white patients. And this is all while I have my namebadge that has RN, BSN on it. That's a big pet peeve of mine.
Now, I welcome any viewpoints on this topic because I feel it needs to be addressed. With a nursing shortage, why be so picky? Why do minorities have to be destined to work in acute care while white female nurses can have their pick and choose? And why aren't male nurses as accepted by older patients as female nurses are? And before I get bashed and called out for being prejudiced against whites, let me just say, my father is white so that pretty much kills that notion. I just call it like I see it and what I experience. What do you all think? I welcome all with open arms and I promise, I will not be offended by anything you say.
Sharon brought up a point I was thinking because I read it recently. Blacks are not represented in the same percentage in the nursing profession that they are in the general population, so most of the nurses in any setting are going to be white. Getting more minorities in the profession would be a start.
Our Public Health Department here has quite a bit of black nurses working there. I know several black nurses come to the unit who work for insurance companies. Blacks practically run all the LTC's here. I don't frequent MD's offices, so I can't say, except my doctor's office (while I live in a mixed neighborhood, his office is in a white part of town) is all white staffed.
I agree with Sharon, keep trying. Not to negate your experience, I've lived in the deep south in a smaller city and I know how it is. I'm sorry for your experiences.
Hello, Tweety, and thank you for responding. Thank you for your kind words as well. What part of the country do you reside? Is your town or city more diverse in the makeup of your population. I would love to live where everyone mixes together easily and gets along. I feel that we are stuck in a time warp around here. The rest of the country is moving on and our race relations are so stagnant. It's time for people to accept one another and respect each others differences.
With the baby boomer generation coming into the healthcare system sicker and sicker, we need everyone who wants to make a difference to be able to do that. And everyone should have equal opportunity.
I know a nurse manager who is black. But I can see what you mean about small rural communities. They are very tight knit and whether you are white or black you will face job discrimination because you aren't related to so-and-so who's family has been in this town for generations and who knows such-and-such who's family has also been here generations and generations.
I've experienced it first hand. I by no means have an easier time because I'm white. I've found out that in the rural communities it's about who you know and who you're related to.
i understand your feelings about being mistaken for the nursing assistant, housekeeper, etc. i am african-american and work in a small rural hospital and am the only black person in the icu. whenever someone assumes that i am not an rn, i smile and politely let them know that i am an rn and go about doing my job professionally. it irritates me, but i have been an rn for over 20 years and this still happens to me sometimes. i just take it in stride and move on.
many people have pre-conceived notions of others who are different than themselves and it's how we handle ourselves that confirms or unconfirms those beliefs.
you'd be surprised at how even other "educated" health care professionals buy into stereo-types of different cultures. i guess it's all a matter of not experiencing relationships with others of different backgrounds. i am extremely grateful that i grew up in a multi-cultural environment so that i "know better" than to pre-judge people.
quote:"those patients tend to be less demanding of my time and take me more seriously as a health-care provider. but, on the other hand, when i have white patients, especially older white males, i see myself being ran up and down the hall for the non-essential things. and also, i get a lot of lip from the patient as to what they are not going to do or what medicine they are not going to take until they talk to their doctor. but, hold it right there, here's the kicker. when a nurse, who happens to be white, has had that same patient before, they seem not get that same attitude or disrespect from that same patient. they get a very nice, compliant patient while i put up with crap from them." end quote
as a nurse, you are the boss...the patients are in your domain and there are ways for you to take control and set boundaries. change your attitude about yourself and you will see the change in respect you get from your patients. be professional, knowledgeable, and remember, you are a good nurse and they are lucky to have you caring for them.
good luck to you,
robin
thank you for responding. and thank you for the encouragement. lately, i have been a little firmer in my interaction with the disrespectful patients. and i wish i could say it was because i have "grown", but it isn't. sadly to say, i think i have become a little hardened with the conditions i experience at my job in acute care. i love the skills i have garnished within the last year. i have seen myself become more confident and skillful. but, acute care is very physically and mentally taxing. i have been beside myself lately and i feel it's because i am becoming burned out already. and i never want to feel that way about nursing because i feel that god has a plan for me to be a great nurse. but, i am so saddened by how expendable the hospital feels nurses are. we are the backbone of the hospital and we need better conditions in order to provide safe and adequate conditions for our patients. and i want to get away from it because i'm so afraid i'll lose my license one day in these conditions. and it seems that i am denied to opportunity to expand around here. i feel it's not fair, but then again, life is not fair all the time. but, that doesn't make it right.
I am so fortunate in my facility and the last one I worked in! There is so much of a mix of races and sex that to me, it is wonderful and actually representitive of the population of our community! Of course I live in the pacific NW...in a somewhat rural town (not to far from a large city).
There have, of course, been bumps in the road at the last place I worked in...and ALF. Many times female residents did not want male CNA's or Nurses...we acknowledged that. And some of these older folks...well...had a probelm with anyone of another race...we acknowledged that.
I mean, some older men of WWII that served in the Pacific got very angry if a Oriental looking person was tending to them...same with some folks that were not raised to accept black people. We would acknowledge that, however...I once told a WWII vet that I was mostly German...so did that exclude me??? Or the time I said "does it matter the skin color of someone that wishes only to help you??? Who will even clean you just because they know it would make you feel better and help you?" I won both those actually...
But other than that...I am very happy to be able to say I have been working with awesome people of many different backgrounds, races, sex, etc! My community is a wonderful mixture...so is our country...so it would stand to reason that people of all races, creeds, colors, sex, should wish to help others and be in healthcare :). Therefore I don't understand why anyone would be declined to help...
Hello there. Thanks for your response. It sounds so wonderful to be able to experience so much diverse culture. In my city, it's basically your either black or your white. There is no gray area. Well, I'll take that back. In the last 5 years, we have seen almost a 500% increase in the Hispanic population. There are a lot of migrant workers and their families around here. But, the two main groups are blacks and whites. And while I have parents of both races, I identify myself as being black because nobody looks at me and and say, "Oh, well, you know, her father is white." No, around here if your "mixed" you're black and I've accepted that. But I can see how so many mulattoes and octaroons and quadroons back in the Reconstruction-era South tried to "pass". Being black can be hard sometimes. And I don't know why that is. What did black people ever do to deserve the treatment we experience sometimes? And I still love all people. This country has come a long way, but I feel that this part of the country is lagging behind at times.
I don't know what to tell you. Maybe it depends on where you live.
I am a white female. I spent 16 years working in a hospital, so I quess that places me outside of what you posted. I worked in acute care hospitals in smalll towns and big cities. One of my supervisors was a black female when I was in a hospital setting.
I've worked in clinics too since leaving a hospital setting. I didn't leave because I am white but because I'm old!!!:) I worked for a black female internist to boot in a clinic, as well as Asian internists, female, male..........
I'm talking southern california, so we were pretty racially mixed. There were whites like me, mexicans, blacks, asians, you name it. LA's pretty big, and so is San Diego.
I have never worked in the south, so maybe your experiences there are different. But I would never deny your experiences.
Hello and thank you for your input. The South's ethnic diversity is growing, but we're still basically black and white here. And it seems that even the foreign born doctors still prefer to hire white nurses in their offices. So, it's hard for a black nurse when those doctors adopt the thinking of the locals. There is one white doctor who has all black nurses, receptionist, phlebotomist in his office, but I seriously believe he is attracted to black women. He even flirted with me at the hospital one time. But his office is the exception and he is not from around here. But that shouldn't be why I get hired by anyone. I want to be able to use my license where I want, not where I am allowed to go.
Now, I am by no means comparing my life to what those people went through. That was horrible and nothing can compare to that. But, I feel sometimes I am ignored in this society. I feel like my desires and happiness do no matter. I am black, so does that mean that I have to live in an urban setting? Don't I have a right to live in a small town and live comfortably and have a job I like.
I know that there are many successful black people. But as I said in a previous post, it seems that most white people can have anything they want in this country. And forgive me for anybody that statement offends. Because I know that there are poor whites that are equally struggling. But that barrier they face is often only socioeconomic. My barriers can be socioeconomic, but I can overcome that. What I cannot do anything about is the skin I'm in.
And I do not deserve to be the one that is hired only if the white applicants do not want the job. I do not deserve to go into a department store and be watched by a hawk as if I'm always going to take something just because I am black. I work hard and spend my money there and I don't appreciate that. I do not deserve the police to ignore perpertrators of crimes against me because I am not a "helpless" white female (This really happened and I feel that the police laughed the whole thing off. They had everything they needed including license plates and a very good colored video tape of the criminals, but never got any justice for that.
Sorry for going off on a tangent) And my child definitely does not deserve to be told by another child that she cannot play with my child because she is black. All people are beautiful in my eyes and we should all be treated accordingly. And I feel that black people are at the bottom of the respect ladder in most people's minds. And it's not right. And what happened after Hurricane Katrina was inexcusable and a lot of people in high places didn't do enough, soon enough.
Now, I am by no means comparing my life to what those people went through. That was horrible and nothing can compare to that. But, I feel sometimes I am ignored in this society. I feel like my desires and happiness do no matter. I am black, so does that mean that I have to live in an urban setting? Don't I have a right to live in a small town and live comfortably and have a job I like.
I know that there are many successful black people. But as I said in a previous post, it seems that most white people can have anything they want in this country. And forgive me for anybody that statement offends. Because I know that there are poor whites that are equally struggling. But that barrier they face is often only socioeconomic. My barriers can be socioeconomic, but I can overcome that. What I cannot do anything about is the skin I'm in.
And I do not deserve to be the one that is hired only if the white applicants do not want the job. I do not deserve to go into a department store and be watched by a hawk as if I'm always going to take something just because I am black. I work hard and spend my money there and I don't appreciate that. I do not deserve the police to ignore perpertrators of crimes against me because I am not a "helpless" white female (This really happened and I feel that the police laughed the whole thing off. They had everything they needed including license plates and a very good colored video tape of the criminals, but never got any justice for that.
Sorry for going off on a tangent) And my child definitely does not deserve to be told by another child that she cannot play with my child because she is black. All people are beautiful in my eyes and we should all be treated accordingly. And I feel that black people are at the bottom of the respect ladder in most people's minds. And it's not right. And what happened after Hurricane Katrina was inexcusable and a lot of people in high places didn't do enough, soon enough.
Thanks for posting this. It is very enlightening, especially the part about the police response to a crime against you as a black women.
I am white and have worked as a NA, and rarely have seen a white NA. I think there is definately a tendency to see black women as strong and independent, able to take care of themselves. I think this is well founded in my experience, yet to have this result in less consideration for a afroamerican women who is a victum of a crime is just appalling.
I do think if you apply for jobs in more metro areas, even in the suburbs of those areas, you will find there is less prejudice.
And what was that? I didn't notice any discrimination during Katrina
People want to say that because New Orleans was mostly black the govt. left them to themselves. However, the Mississippi Gulf Coast is 80% white and these folks were left to themselves as well. Was the abandoment of the Gulf Coast an act against white Southners? Anybody can holler descrimination. And please forgive me if I sound irritated, but I am. I grew up as a white male in central Mississippi and let me tell you, you are not the only one who can gripe about the "other ones" being mean to you. I cant even drive through my old neighborhood in Jackson (which is now mostly black) without being hollered at by black men to get out. As far as your black patients being so kind to you, I glad to hear that. Maybe we can trade because mine generally cop an attitude the second I walk into the room. Of course, the moderater will say I am inflammatory for saying this but the original poster can get by with saying that the black pts. are nicer than the white ones and it' all good.
yikes, this is a touchy subject. i am nursing in the state of minnesota. there is a small percentage of african-american nurses where i work, but not many. i am in a clinic setting. i am thinking it is the area you live in? where there are higher percentages of minorities. just keep praying and keep a positive attitude and things will turn out the way they are meant to be. i sincerely hope you get the job that you dream of.
As a nurse, you are the boss...the patients are in your domain and there are ways for you to take control and set boundaries.
Sorry, but is the patient not the boss/customer- yes there can be some limits, but if you are not there to take care of the needs and sometimes the demands of your patient, then you are in the wrong profession.
As far as the discrimination part, you can add New Orleans to the list with Atlanta and Birmingham.
God, what a somber yet infuriating situation. with my rose tinted glasses i would love to believe that prejudice is long gone. yet it literally sickens me to learn that not much has changed in the south. there are no easy answers. in regards to yourself personally, you can continue to treat others w/respect and simultaneously instill a zero tolerance policy with regards to prejudices aimed at you. keep your head up. for those that treat you poorly, be thankful you don't have their mentality. although you would love to get a job in the small town where you live, it doesn't seem it's going to be an immediate reality. again, you're dealing with very small minds. seek opportunities outside of your comfort zone. i detest racial indignence with a vengeance. i see the prejudice from white to black, and from black to white. when will the madness end? but it is important to acknowledge that the prejudice still exists. continue to be the excellent nurse you are; focus on blooming into everything you can be. do not let these subcultures drag you down. yes it sucks. but i don't want to fight a bunch of people with atrophied brains. i don't want any of them in my life, period. just go and shine where others will appreciate your brilliance. and realize that everyone is not like this.
People want to say that because New Orleans was mostly black the govt. left them to themselves. However, the Mississippi Gulf Coast is 80% white and these folks were left to themselves as well. Was the abandoment of the Gulf Coast an act against white Southners? Anybody can holler descrimination. And please forgive me if I sound irritated, but I am. I grew up as a white male in central Mississippi and let me tell you, you are not the only one who can gripe about the "other ones" being mean to you. I cant even drive through my old neighborhood in Jackson (which is now mostly black) without being hollered at by black men to get out. As far as your black patients being so kind to you, I glad to hear that. Maybe we can trade because mine generally cop an attitude the second I walk into the room. Of course, the moderater will say I am inflammatory for saying this but the original poster can get by with saying that the black pts. are nicer than the white ones and it' all good.
Exactly. I live in Biloxi, MS, so I know firsthand what a wonderful response we received. I don't believe the lack of response was due to race, though. It could have just been our government's usual swift response to anything, whether it's passing laws or helping in a disaster. If anything, it could be a class issue. Let's face it. A lot of us southerners aren't exactly in the upper class. Like Josifek said above, New Orleans is 80% black and we're 80% white, but believe me, we were suffering just the same. There may have been an isolated incident here or there where maybe some aid made it into MS a little earlier than New Orleans, and then some @$$hole decided to report it in order to inspire anger and resentment. But, on the whole, we were just as ignored as New Orleans.
As for not being able to get hired, I really feel for you. I haven't had it happen often, but when it does, I'm not happy. I remember applying at several different auto parts stores for a part-time job and the guys giving me this look like "You're a girl, why are you even trying?" Needless to say, I wasn't hired at any of them. I had the qualifications by the way. Anyway, I did not like that feeling at all, so it really makes me sad that black people go through this type of thing their entire lives. I couldn't deal with that type of treatment.
OliveVinesRN
100 Posts
Hello, Tweety, and thank you for responding. Thank you for your kind words as well. What part of the country do you reside? Is your town or city more diverse in the makeup of your population. I would love to live where everyone mixes together easily and gets along. I feel that we are stuck in a time warp around here. The rest of the country is moving on and our race relations are so stagnant. It's time for people to accept one another and respect each others differences.
With the baby boomer generation coming into the healthcare system sicker and sicker, we need everyone who wants to make a difference to be able to do that. And everyone should have equal opportunity.