Ivory tower: myth or fiction

Joan Z · Jul 17, 2008

As far as I could tell, the faculty who were also practicing while teaching generally had very limited practices, only a day a week, scheduling an hour for each patient. Plus they were at university-affiliated centers. One did medical missions a couple of times a year.

The amount of tuition and fees going to faculty is far less than the amount paid by the student. An increase in tuition will go to program and administrative costs. There are two universities in my area which have both instituted large increases in tuition annually the past few years, several to ten percent yearly. In contrast, salaries for instructors have gone up MAYBE 1-2%

To start a new program requires a tremendous investment in infrastructure; yes, schools could build on existing programs but a DNP would require new/more instructors and more/different paperwork. Plus a DNP would take longer than a traditional Masters-level program. All this adds up to more $ required.

As for why someone would rather practice than teach, just because a given profession makes more money doesn't mean that's what everyone will head towards... otherwise we'd all be CRNAs, or investment brokers.

Advanced Practice Columnist / Guide · Jul 17, 2008

Clinical faculty in most universities that I know of still do work a number of professional practice hours as a nurse practitioner. Many do this in order to maintain a certain amount of practice hours to meet the recertification requirements of national certification boards. I would suppose many also do so to show a degree of credibility in teaching in their respective clinical areas of expertise.

I don't exactly know what most are referring to when they invoke the word "ivory tower". True enough, there is a business or revenue-generating side to how universities are run and this definitely translates to adding popular programs that would attract students who matriculate. However, there is a host of other attributes universities try to achieve such as prestige or reputation and diversity. A balance of all these attributes, I would suppose, is what most universities aim for.

And as already mentioned, revenues generated by schools don't all go to faculty salaries. In addition, there is a distinct caste system (if you will) among faculty members in universities. Deans and full professors definitely get the highest salaries as most are recruited because of their accomplishments and name recognition. Junior faculty such as associate and assistant professors as well as the lowly master's prepared clinical instructor start out at the lower end of salary.

Establishing DNP programs, I agree, cost money. This would mean adding more faculty and utilizing more university resources such as classrooms that run on electricity and are climate controlled. Even on-line courses require technology that has a cost attached to it. Given the current economic situation, many schools are actually struggling to keep quality programs up. I live in the same state as Joan Z. Much of the issues faced by state universities in Michigan is declining funding from the state government. Many have raised tuition and have eliminated programs that do not attract a lot of students.

You can also count me as one of those NP's who feel that teaching is not an option for me at this point because I would take a pay cut if you factor in my current professional degree. However, I am not totally opposed to considering it in the future even with a pay cut but I would make sure I have the qualifications to at least be considered for a tenure-track position.

Joan Z · Jul 17, 2008

from wikipedia:

from the 19th century it has been, originally ironically, used to designate a world or atmosphere where intellectuals engage in pursuits that are disconnected from the practical concerns of everyday life. as such, it usually has a pejorativeconnotation, denoting a willful disconnect from the everyday world; esoteric, over-specialized, or even useless research; and academic elitism, if not outright condescension by those inhabiting the ivory tower.

how many of us, when first practicing, heard "i don't care what you learned in school, this is how it is in the real world"?

i will never denigrate the value of education. however, for me the most valuable training i had during my np education was in the clinic--after getting a very basic overview in the classroom. when i look at the course requirements for a dnp i may think that they would be interesting, nice to know, but i would give anything for more time in the practice setting. i learned enough about research interpretation to figure out what the nejm article on diet said today. i did not learn suturing, i didn't learn tips for finding someone's cervix or how to examine a screaming toddler. if i go back to school i'd like more practical tips, not more theory. i don't see that as happening with the current dnp programs.

i taught for many years in chemistry and frequently had to answer "ivory tower" type questions from the engineers and pre-meds. i think with any field if you love the field you think everyone else will be just as enamored if only they learned a little more...

prairienp · Jul 17, 2008

as far as i could tell, the faculty who were also practicing while teaching generally had very limited practices, only a day a week, scheduling an hour for each patient. plus they were at university-affiliated centers. one did medical missions a couple of times a year.

the faculty i knew practiced one day a week during the academic year and more in the summer. they had the same patient load expectations as the other nps in the clinic

the amount of tuition and fees going to faculty is far less than the amount paid by the student. an increase in tuition will go to program and administrative costs. there are two universities in my area which have both instituted large increases in tuition annually the past few years, several to ten percent yearly. in contrast, salaries for instructors have gone up maybe 1-2%

clearly the problem, yet still unclear where the money really goes.

to start a new program requires a tremendous investment in infrastructure; yes, schools could build on existing programs but a dnp would require new/more instructors and more/different paperwork. plus a dnp would take longer than a traditional masters-level program. all this adds up to more $ required.

as for why someone would rather practice than teach, just because a given profession makes more money doesn't mean that's what everyone will head towards... otherwise we'd all be crnas, or investment brokers.

not sure i agree with your analogy. $$$ are important as is the role we select. when push comes to shove many of us will opt for the $$$ in order to provide for our families. in fact, i often wonder if i should have been a crna, by best friend in my bsn program has been making $250,000+ a year for the past 15 years and seems very happy with his choice. of course i return to reality as i really do enjoy being a np

Joan Z · Jul 17, 2008

The comment about being a CRNA or a stockbroker was in response you the comment,

Wouldn't all NPs want to be faculty, sound like the best job for the NP. Yet I constantly hear from my NP peers that they are unwilling to take a pay cut to work at the university.

My point being, that there are are other reasons for being an NP other than money. Sorry if this was not clear.

globalRN · Jul 30, 2008

faculty pay is so low that most of my NP colleagues would not consider the academic route.

scribblerpnp · Jul 30, 2008

I am one of those faculty people. I took a major pay cut to teach. This cut my work week from 60 hours to 20, add another 20 hours a week working as an NP and I now have 40 hours. This does not include working at home grading papers.

I took the cut because it would allow me to spend more time with my family, time off at Christmas (about 1 month) and summers off (three 1/2 months). It also allows me to teach people to become the kind of nurse/NP I want to work with or take care of my family

My starting salary (in this past decade) as a faculty member in a BSN-MSN program at a major state university???

A big whopping 37,000 per year.

Trauma Columnist · Jul 30, 2008

Thanks for teaching.

JDCitizen · Jul 30, 2008

I am one of those faculty people. I took a major pay cut to teach. This cut my work week from 60 hours to 20, add another 20 hours a week working as an NP and I now have 40 hours. This does not include working at home grading papers.
I took the cut because it would allow me to spend more time with my family, time off at Christmas (about 1 month) and summers off (three 1/2 months). It also allows me to teach people to become the kind of nurse/NP I want to work with or take care of my family
My starting salary (in this past decade) as a faculty member in a BSN-MSN program at a major state university???
A big whopping 37,000 per year.

WOW:eek:

My dad was a professor (not nursing)... He asked me after I graduated with my MSN about teaching.. My answer: The only person who seems to be at the office/clinicals before and after regular hours is the

professor.. I don't think so.

The schedule you mention looks like what my dad had...........

Best wishes!

scribblerpnp · Jul 30, 2008

Thank goodness NP's make decent money. That way I can actually do a job I like and eat too!

But I love both my jobs. I wouldn't want to teach 40 hours a week, and I wouldn't want to be an NP 40 hours a week (I have my bitter moments frequently enough as it is).

So it is a good fit for me. Sad thing is that working part time as an NP is about 60% of my total income.

Sadder thing is that the BSN students who graduated this spring started out making more than I make to teach them. Oh well. Money ain't everything!

And I do work in a state that is nationally known for paying teachers poorly, so it isn't this bad every where, I'm just unwilling to move.

Joan Z · Jul 30, 2008

One of my former NP preceptors teaches for an online school and the other is looking to teach on a part time basis locally. Both cite the schedule as a major benefit. Neither one wants to give up their clinical position. I could see moving back to teaching on a part-time basis at some point, but for now I want to get as much clinical experience as I can!