Is it true that a BSN will be mandatory soon?

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An instructor of mine (I'm in another state) stated that she recently went to a national educators conference and that they were saying that within the next several years in NY it would be mandatory to have your BSN. Does anyone know anything about this? Thanks

Saying RN's learn more "critical thinking" is vague and largely unquantifiable. And you must have knowledge to which to apply critical thinking as well. With a difference of just one year, RNs apparently not only LEARN a whole bunch more about nursing, pathophys, etc but they also become masters of critical thinking. RNs often do have more ultimate responsibility than LPNs, but does their training better prepare them for that? And if there's a such a large gap between LPN training and RN training, why are they allowed to take on such levels of responsibility in so many settings?

PS I realize many RN programs actually pan out to be three years long, but there are still some out there that can (theoretically) be done in two years.

Heck, accelerated programs cram all the nursing content into a year!

Good stuff. I know that critical thinking is something they want you to learn in pretty much any nursing program, but I would argue that some of us 2nd or 3rd career folks come to nursing with critical thinking in place, just lacking knowledge of the nursing field. I have a business job that requires me to constantly be looking out for multiple problems at the same time and analyzing a LOT of data, every minute of every day. I don't think any educational program can make you a master at critical thinking - it has to be part of your job every day. School can get you started, but real world experience is going to get you there.

Also, I'm in a three year part time ADN program. There's the traditional 4 year BSN program. Many take a 2 year ADN full time program. Some take a 1 year diploma program. And then there's the Accelerated BSN which is a 1 year program if you have another bachelor's.

The 1 year accelerated BSN is equivalent to 3-4 semesters, 4 semesters being a 2-yr ADN full time program. I'm taking 6 semesters part time - we probably spend more time on psych, maternal/child and peds than the accelerated BSN. Why doesn't my ADN program measure up to the accelerated BSN? (I also have a BA, the ADN will not be my only degree.) Why doesn't the ADN full time program measure up to the accelerated BSN - because they didn't get a BA in liberal arts or English? I heard someone say diploma grads get more clinical hours, spending more time on the floor - shouldn't that count for something?

Once graduated, doesn't everyone start out on the same level? :uhoh21:

Maybe the nursing educational system is causing lot of the confusion.

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what do you do? are you a floor nurse?

i work contract (not through an agency.. direct seasonal contract. no benefits). i do med surge/oncology/tele. i work the 7p to 7a. when i get off in the morning, i call staffing and say "do you need a nurse tonight?". once you hook up with whoever does the staffing and they learn to rely on you, you're in like flynn. however, you've got to be rock solid reliable, with NO drama. technically speaking, i am nothing special as a nurse. work ethic wise, i will grind anyone into the floor.

if you can carry the hours, there is good money in this, but it's not something i'm going to do for more than a couple more years. i look at it like this: people are lucky if they save 10k per year. if i work as much as i do, i can save 60k without a problem. a couple more years of this, and i am set. 2 homes, no debt, etc.

the point here is that anyone can do what i do if they're determined. this is a great field with wide open opportunity for those really willing to work. there are lots of business opportunities as well.

do i plan to get a bsn? never! it's worthless to me, financially as well as professionally. i've already got a bachelors in another discipline, and that's enough for me. what i have gandered at in terms of bsn programs, content, etc... in my opinion, this is one of the most detached from reality and utterly worthless fluff degrees i've seen. however, that's just my opinion. if you want to get a bsn, then by all means, i say go for it. however, don't talk about requiring me to do this in order to do what i do.

in terms of patient care, this will inflict a lot of grief on people who need nursing services by cutting the supply dramatically.

healthcare should be about the patient... not about whether the nurse feels respected enough.

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I have to say that this weird obsession some have about being "respected" seems odd. Who are we talking about here? Who isn't giving the respect some think they deserve? If you are not getting respect, perhaps its because you are not demanding it. Taking some intro to french literature classes and reading some nursing theories from the 1800's will not motivate anyone to respect you.

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in all honesty, the respect issue seems to be a need voiced by women, especially those with advanced nursing degrees. this is only my own observation, but i do believe it is true. i feel i've got all the respect i need, and if someone treats me disrespectfully, it doesn't bother me in the least. it is all part and parcel of providing care. you're seeing people at their worst when they're sick.

what about doctors respecting me? it's a two way street. i don't respect a lot of doctors. i don't hear them crying about respect.... so why should i?

and yes, it is nothing short of bizarre that people with the "lack of respect" complaint see requiring a bsn as a solution. of course, these are people with masters degrees and phd's. so i suppose for them to feel respected means they must have control of the profession's licensing requirements.

thankfully, the universities are only represented on the state boards... they don't run them. so they are doomed to whine impotently... it is a form of inintentional satire.. which is indeed the very best kind :).

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I have to say that this weird obsession some have about being "respected" seems odd. Who are we talking about here? Who isn't giving the respect some think they deserve? If you are not getting respect, perhaps its because you are not demanding it. Taking some intro to french literature classes and reading some nursing theories from the 1800's will not motivate anyone to respect you.

Thank you! You are someone that is making an excellent point and observation. We need more people like you! Have a great day. -Pantheon-:up:

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Taking some intro to french literature classes and reading some nursing theories from the 1800's will not motivate anyone to respect you.

While personal respect must be earned, many people (and hiring personnel) DO respect a person's educational acheivements. I think the question of "respect" for nurses might be more about respect for one's nursing education.

Many people assume nursing school can't be THAT difficult since it isn't a bachelor's level course of study. They assume nursing school can't be THAT difficult since the minimum requirements are generally intro level courses (lower division, non-major level coursework) and doesn't include courses like physics, calculus, or organic chemistry with lab.

A person who has taken all those courses may not deserve more respect as a person or as a professional, but I would respect that they were willing and able to take and pass that rigorous coursework.

Those of us who have been through nursing school know that it's an accomplishment to pass. But it's not because the CONTENT is so difficult. It's because the workload is so crazy (thousand page books, prepwork for clinicals, extended case studies, etc). It's because you're figuring it out as you go (eg. many schools don't give much instruction on how to develop a care plan or how to prioritize patient care - they want you to 'figure it out'). It's because you never know exactly what you will be tested on. It's because test questions rarely reflect the material as it was presented to you.

So most nurses get respect for their work experience (and they deserve it!) but it's difficult for non-nurses to appreciate (and respect) nursing education. And nursing academia doesn't do much to help that by emphasizing nursing theory & critical thinking so much while de-emphasizing practical skills in one's basic education. Teaching nursing theory and critical thinking are pointless without practical nursing application.

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if it's such a great concern to the public, why out of the thousands of patients i've cared for...has no one has ever asked me what degree i have.? people don't even care if you're an rn or lpn! you are just their nurse.

bottom line is it is the job you're doing. bedside nursing. and requiring a doctorate wouldn't change things one iota. people will still want what they want instantly, whether it is a cup of ice or a dose of morphine. families will still be unrealistic. and you'll still get stuck cleaning up poop! :).

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if it's such a great concern to the public, why out of the thousands of patients i've cared for...has no one has ever asked me what degree i have.? people don't even care if you're an rn or lpn!

Do you ask your doctor where they went to school? Lawyer? Children's teachers? Nursery school workers. No. You assume that because they are working in that job that they have been appropriately trained & are qualified to do that job.

So people still might assume that nursing school isn't difficult and that nurses don't need to know much. People can most certainly respect your abilities as a nurse and still not respect your education. They might even think that your amazing abilities and talents are an exception in the field since nurses "don't even need a colllege degree" (and you don't NEED a college degree to be a nurse).

I'm not saying everyone thinks that, or that I think that, but there ARE people out there who DO think that. Quite a few of them. Doesn't mean we need to cater to them, but it is a reality. And MDs, who nurses work with A LOT, generally respect the nurses for their EXPERIENCE not for their education... perhaps in spite of their education? How many people see a smart nurse and immediately think "Why didn't they go to med school?"

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i work contract (not through an agency.. direct seasonal contract. no benefits). i do med surge/oncology/tele. i work the 7p to 7a. when i get off in the morning, i call staffing and say "do you need a nurse tonight?". once you hook up with whoever does the staffing and they learn to rely on you, you're in like flynn. however, you've got to be rock solid reliable, with NO drama. technically speaking, i am nothing special as a nurse. work ethic wise, i will grind anyone into the floor.

if you can carry the hours, there is good money in this, but it's not something i'm going to do for more than a couple more years. i look at it like this: people are lucky if they save 10k per year. if i work as much as i do, i can save 60k without a problem. a couple more years of this, and i am set. 2 homes, no debt, etc.

the point here is that anyone can do what i do if they're determined. this is a great field with wide open opportunity for those really willing to work. there are lots of business opportunities as well.

do i plan to get a bsn? never! it's worthless to me, financially as well as professionally. i've already got a bachelors in another discipline, and that's enough for me. what i have gandered at in terms of bsn programs, content, etc... in my opinion, this is one of the most detached from reality and utterly worthless fluff degrees i've seen. however, that's just my opinion. if you want to get a bsn, then by all means, i say go for it. however, don't talk about requiring me to do this in order to do what i do.

in terms of patient care, this will inflict a lot of grief on people who need nursing services by cutting the supply dramatically.

healthcare should be about the patient... not about whether the nurse feels respected enough.

Hello Traumahawk,

I totally see your point. I'm probably going a little off the BSN topic about what my only complaint is with "respect" as a Nurse.

My only complaint is that when I am sick and I go to the ER and they very well know I am a nurse in the hospital and make me wait for an extremely long time I get angry. I see the patients that arrived after me and they are being cared for right away. It's not very private you can hear their complaints "My baby is teething and I can't sleep I have such a migraine now" meanwhile My strep throat is so bad my pain level is a 10 and my throat feels like it's closing. But they make me wait.

Then when my fiance who is an M.D. walks in the ER it's "Oh, he's a doctor he said he feels like he's getting an URI, get him in right away" and they do! Every freaking time! Then when they find out we are together and remember my face the nurses apologize and tell me next time you will not have to wait Miss. I'm so sorry for the last time if I had only known!

Known what? That I am engaged to a doctor or that you treated me like crap the last time I was here? Who's the eyes and ears for the doctors? Nurses obviously, as well as anyone that works in the hospital that see's something wrong and then alerts the nurse.

My fiance doesn't think it's fair either and has made complaints on behalf of all nurses but nothing has happened.

So this is really the only time I feel disrespected as a Nurse. A friend of the family who is in pharmaceuticals, she's a chemist. She has a PH.D and when her mom is sick (CHF) she tells the ER nurses she is a doctor and they scramble to get her mom in right away. You can even hear the nurses saying she's a doctor get her mom in a room stat! She says with a smile it works!

That's my observation/experience and I don't think it's fair. How could I when I've been through it several times?:banghead:

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Do you ask your doctor where they went to school? Lawyer? Children's teachers? Nursery school workers. No. You assume that because they are working in that job that they have been appropriately trained & are qualified to do that job.

So people still might assume that nursing school isn't difficult and that nurses don't need to know much. People can most certainly respect your abilities as a nurse and still not respect your education. They might even think that your amazing abilities and talents are an exception in the field since nurses "don't even need a colllege degree" (and you don't NEED a college degree to be a nurse).

I'm not saying everyone thinks that, or that I think that, but there ARE people out there who DO think that. Quite a few of them. Doesn't mean we need to cater to them, but it is a reality. And MDs, who nurses work with A LOT, generally respect the nurses for their EXPERIENCE not for their education... perhaps in spite of their education? How many people see a smart nurse and immediately think "Why didn't they go to med school?"

No offense, but I think you are overthinking this issue of respect. Why are you so concerned that someone respect your education? Who has told you they think that nursing education is easy and why would you care? In reality your patients are in the hospital because they are ill and are focused on more pressing concerns than where you , one of their many nurses, went to school.

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No offense, but I think you are overthinking this issue of respect. Why are you so concerned that someone respect your education? Who has told you they think that nursing education is easy and why would you care? In reality your patients are in the hospital because they are ill and are focused on more pressing concerns than where you , one of their many nurses, went to school.

When ever I point out to people how much work nursing is, and the comparitively low pay and compensation we receive, all I hear is, 'Just what do you 'girls' expect? You only went to school for two years!!" And you know, they are right. JMHO, and my NY $0.02.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN

Spokane, Washington

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Specializes in Community Health, Med-Surg, Home Health.

What I see is that eventually, this requirement (if it happens at all), will create a top-heavy situation where the BSN nurse will have more choices and leave the bedside where nurses are needed the most. I can respect and even advocate for the BSN to have more choices, however, I fail to see how it will really create better outcomes in patient care if the shortage still exists where it really counts.

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