I just finished a CNA course at a public technical college.
On our last day of class we had a small graduation ceremony with the students and a few residents of the nursing home where we did clinicals.
Our instructor invited a guest speaker from a religious group she belongs to. The guest speaker preached about her religion and put down everyone who doesn't practice the same religion.
We had to go up one by one to receive a certificate from our teacher and a New Testament book from the guest speaker.
The school is not a private school and has no religious affiliation. This is a state approved program. The program had no religion component, discussions, or learning material. We were never asked if we felt comfortable with this before we were blindsided with it.
THIS ALL TOOK PLACE BEFORE OUR FINAL REVIEW WITH THE TEACHER FOR THE CLASS!
Is this legal?
What would you do?
How would you feel if you felt forced to participate in something like this outside of your own religious beliefs?
Specializes in no specialty! (have to graduate first!).
You should've politely declined the book she was trying to give you. And then brought it up to the appropriate people at your school. Suing would be a waste of time and valuable money. And even if you did sue, you wouldn't win millions of dollars. I guarantee it. As a matter of fact, you probably wouldn't win much money at all, if any at all.
Just let it be known you did not appreciate it and try to get school administrators to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Wow! This makes my heart sad. I am praying for each and everyone of you that you will find guidance and understanding. What does it matter if they did not have the same preferance of faith. One of the responsibilites as a Christian is to witness to others and bring them to Christ. Maybe the speaker went about it wrong, and maybe the school should have brought it to the attention of the students that the speaker was a Christian before the ceremony took place. But all in all, what does it really matter. What makes you more mad, having your toes stepped on or hearing about a God that forgives.
By the way, doesn't anyone else remember receiving a Gideon Bible on the school campus? I do! They hand them out every year.
Pray away. Just don't do it at an event funded with MY tax dollars where Jews and Muslims and Buddhists - who I will guarantee have already heard of Jesus, the alleged savior - will have this nonsense foist upon them.
Organize a prayer service at which attendance is not compulsory. Please do not infect events I MUST attend in order to celebrate an education obtained with PUBLIC money with fairy tales of your vindictive deity who only forgives those who grant him worship.
Atheism has nothing to do with tolerance for coerced proselytization.
What she did was quite likely not legal. "Get over it" isn't a valid or rational response.
What if it were about race and not religion? A white supremacist giving a lecture about how all non-whites are inferior and handing out copies of "Mein Kampf" with your diploma? Does your atheism make you tolerant to that? Mine doesn't. Is this situation legal? I'm going to guess no.
1) Sure it does. My lack of allegience to your diety or her diety makes "coerced proselytization" a non issue. Though I do feel coerced is far too strong a word in this instance.
2) It was legal.
3) Why is "get over it" invalid and irrational? It is a fantasticly simple solution to what the OP is trying to make into a larger problem.
4) Please dont start the "what if" stuff. It is such a silly way to try and prove a point. And again, it is legal, you are going to have to deal with that fact.
1) Sure it does. My lack of allegience to your diety or her diety makes "coerced proselytization" a non issue. Though I do feel coerced is far too strong a word in this instance.
Atheism is simply a position on belief of gods. It has no prescriptive functions that make proselytization a non-issue. It's not a non-issue for me. Atheism doesn't equal apathy.
2) It was legal.
Highly debatable.
3) Why is "get over it" invalid and irrational? It is a fantasticly simple solution to what the OP is trying to make into a larger problem.
It's denying the emotions of the OP. It doesn't bother you, okay. Fine. It clearly bothered the OP, and that's why "get over it" isn't valid.
4) Please dont start the "what if" stuff. It is such a silly way to try and prove a point. And again, it is legal, you are going to have to deal with that fact.
It's a reductio ad absurdum, and it's a legit way to prove my point. If you're not okay with a white supremacist spouting their views and giving out copies of Mein Kampf at such an event, you shouldn't be okay with any such soapboxes whether or not you agree with or are apatheic to their message.
That is only if the OP is describing the situation accurately. Me thinks there is a little too much emotion involved. It just sounds slighty far fetched that someone speaking at a graduation was bashing everyone not a member of her religion.
By saying that "a person cannot walk into a room with a smile on their face without Christ in their lives" puts down everyone in every other religion. I do think that is a put down and obviously said by someone who doesn't know people of other religions.
This "graduation" was at a nursing home, not at our school. There were less than 20 people in the room. It wasn't a big huge graduation. It was just our class and a few other people.
One of my main points in my original post, this took place BEFORE the final evaluation. If I had refused to participate, is there a chance I would have not received the A I worked hard for during the class?
People have different perspectives on things. If you were on the side of NO religion in public schools, you might "hear" someone saying everyone but Christians are going to hell.
Last night at my daughter's public school Spring Concert, the choir and the band played some well-known hymns. Beautiful music - no big deal to me.
I don't think this is a case where a lawsuit needs to be done. But I agree with Jolie - make your complaint known in that last review session. And leave it at that.
Focus on graduation, all the hard work you accomplished and go out and be a great nurse and patient advocate.
Suing would be a waste of time and valuable money. And even if you did sue, you wouldn't win millions of dollars. I guarantee it. As a matter of fact, you probably wouldn't win much money at all, if any at all.
I'm not threatening to sue. I just don't think this should have happened at a public school with no religious affiliation.
One of the responsibilites as a Christian is to witness to others and bring them to Christ. Maybe the speaker went about it wrong, and maybe the school should have brought it to the attention of the students that the speaker was a Christian before the ceremony took place.
There is a time and place for everything.
Public educational institutions serve multi- cultural, ethnic and religious individuals. The OP indicated that the college does not have a Christian orientation so the graduating students probably represent a rainbow of beliefs and backgrounds. As I expressed in my previous post, I would want my grad speaker to address the accomplishments and future pathways of myself and other students, topics common to all the graduating students.
The speaker could have chosen a more relevant speech topic...or perhaps the school might have chosen a different speaker.
Well . . . that is untrue so I can see your point. hmmmm . .
Still, not something to go to court about (not saying YOU said this). It can be handled in other ways.
I don't see how not participating would change your grade.
But how would you know ahead of time?
steph
I would assume it wouldn't change my grade. However attendance the last day of class was mandatory. I assumed while there my participation in the ceremony was also mandatory. I did not want to be rude or disrespectful towards the instructor and didn't want to cause an issue or scene. This was a required class to get into the nursing program. My goal is to become a nurse. I tried to laugh it off, but it bothered me. I got home and it still bothered me. It continues to bother me. I posted on here to see what others thoughts were. I still want to go to school there, but if this is what I will end up going through in future classes I think I will have to look for another school.
I have contacted the Dean of Students and my message was passed on to another person. I have not heard back from that person. I hope they will apologize and have a talk with the instructor so this type of thing no longer happens in the classes at the school.
Just for a moment, let's reverse the situation and imagine an individual climbing the pulpit of your local church during Sunday service. The congregation has just listened to a Biblical reading from one of the Gospels and is looking forward to hearing a riveting sermon. The speaker is a guest, a retired nurse perhaps...and starts to talk about all the lives she helped to save, the first IV she ever started and the most memorable psychiatric patient she ever cared for. She wishes everyone in the pews good luck in their future endeavours and hopes that they will have rewarding careers.
I suspect the congregation members would not be pleased, and some might even be offended.
JettaDP
268 Posts
You should've politely declined the book she was trying to give you. And then brought it up to the appropriate people at your school. Suing would be a waste of time and valuable money. And even if you did sue, you wouldn't win millions of dollars. I guarantee it. As a matter of fact, you probably wouldn't win much money at all, if any at all.
Just let it be known you did not appreciate it and try to get school administrators to make sure it doesn't happen again.