Is Health Care a Right?

Gromit · Mar 11, 2003

"Guess where they ended up? And guess who is paying their bill???? "

won't do you any good to say that. our country says THAT for far more people than any other in the world.

there are a lot of canadians that come here and their insurance (government) does not pay a dime to our health care system.

Sally_ICURN · Mar 11, 2003

So Gromit, did you sign the proclamation that's available in the Cover the Uninsured Week thread?

https://allnurses.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32670

I think this week should be a week of non-complaining and action to help make a change for the better.

Gromit · Mar 11, 2003

Sign a proclamation? never heard of it. Guess I've been too busy trying to work enough hours to cover school and living expenses (house payment, auto ins. -thank God the bike is paid for!), and (yes, its true!) taxes.

However, I'm curious. What action should we take? If it does NOT involve the government taking over another 7% of our economy/lives (that means healthcare), but some other action that may alleviate the problem, and if it does NOT involve dipping into my pocket for yet more money to pay to others, then please go on! I'm all ears! You can count me in!

IF, however, its just more rhetoric, then no thanks! I've had my fill this year Tax man cometh in 1 month and 4 days.

Gromit · Mar 11, 2003

Ok. I read the proclamation. Far as I can tell, it doesn't actually say anything, and is way too open and broad a statement to put my voice to.

Its illogical to think that anyone in our country wishes to see anyone go without. I certainly don't. And it should go without saying that the legislators know that the people are fed-up with the convoluted mess that we call a healthcare system. I just don't want to pay for yet more of the same.

If it gets a bit more defined, I'll put my hancock to it, provided I agree to the terms, of course.

Sally_ICURN · Mar 11, 2003

All I can say Gromit is read the links posted in that thread that also has a link to the proclamation. There is a wealth of information there.

What the proclamation says, plain and simple, is that you support the efforts of Cover the Uninsured Week. It does not support any one method of fixing anything, all it does is acknowledge that something must be done, and will bring this most important issue to the forefront. Like NRSKarenRN stated in that thread, 1+1+1+1+1+1+1 has the potential to = millions. Our government may ignore the protest of millions of it's citizens when it comes to foreign policy, but it cannot ignore millions of Americans when it comes to domestic issues that personally affect so many, especially when those millions of Americans are joined by Congress itself.

JMP · Mar 12, 2003

Gromit

Rest assured that if Canadian's go to the US for care, THEY pay THEIR own money. No insurance here will cover them. (Unless they are travelling and then they will be airlifted back home ASAP)

Why would they do that? Perhaps they feel that there are specialists or special treatments not available to them in Canada, which may or may not be true.

The US does not pay for them. They pay their own way.

When I posted about US citizens -UNINSURED- coming here, it was to make a point, to address an earlier post you made, if you recall.

Gromit, take the time to be informed. The US is good and great, BUT THEY CAN STILL learn from others. Especially when it comes to social programs and health care for all citizens.

Jayne LPN · Mar 12, 2003

I FEEL THAT HEALTHCARE IS THE RIGHT OF EVERY AMERICAN PERSON........THERE WAS A TIME WHEN I FIRST MOVED HERE FROM THE UK...AND BEFORE I HAD HEALTH INSURANCE THAT IT WAS CHEAPER FOR ME TO FLY HOME TO SEE MY M.D. AND GET MY MOM TO FILL MY RX AND MAIL IT OUT TO ME....HEY YOU GOTTA DO WHAT YOU GOTTA DO RIGHT? NOW THANK GOODNESS I HAVE GREAT HELATH INSURANCE, BUT MANY PEOPLE ARE NOT SO FORTUNATE....ANY GO WITHOUT...........

JUST MY 2 CENTS

Gromit · Mar 12, 2003

JMP, having worked in EMS for far too many years, I must assure you that they do not always tend to "pay their own way". Insurance or not, if they appear in the ER, they will get care. Anyone here knows this.

Take the time to be informed.

You do so as well.

Nobody ever said that the US could not learn, nor did they say its the best route to go. However, socializing yet another part of our lives is NOT always the best answer. It works in Canada (for some, at least. Others (vocal minority?) have written otherwise.

The conditions are quite different as well, though. Our government does not tax us nearly at the rate that most other countries live under (I remember fuel(gasoline) in Spain, for instance, running at $3 per gallon (converted from liters), that was in the mid '70s. Lord knows what they pay now). From what I've read or seen, many other things are taxed higher as well, on a per-capita basis, we don't have it so bad. Are US Citizens willing to pay a substantial increase in taxes to fund a 'one-size-fits-all' healthcare system? I think not. I certainly am not. You said way-back that it needn't cost more taxes (never seen a government do it for less, not more, but just for the sake of argument...) perhaps you are right, -and I believe we could. IF we quit 'donating' so much money to other countries, and scaled back on other programs (like Defense), we would have more than enough. I'd be OK with that. I think putting so much 'aid' money to so many other countries (who don't like us anyway) is a true waste.

There, problem solved! Plenty of dough.

Y

Social programs have many pitfalls as well. In a capitalistic society, the big incentive to improve is the almighty dollar (or whatever denomination). The government taking over and setting the limits, well, that kind of removes the incentives, and you have stagnation. I mean, if 'the government and others' are going to foot the bill, why should I bother?

'free' appeals to all, and people who do not shell-out the bread, look at it as a boon to them. Want proof? Offer up anything for free, you will have takers, and supply will certainly be exceeded by demand.

sixes · Mar 12, 2003

Suzy K

I'm not saying that more money has to come out of your pocket. And perhaps Canada is not perfect.

I am greatful to Have the mighty USA on our side of the world and I am also very thankful that you have a great powerful defence system that helps to protect our failing Armed Force.

The US also gives away billions of dollars annually to country's that no longer like the US and also do not appreciate the generosity of the US citizens who optimal foot the bill.

Would your tax dollars not be better used to allow everyone in the states proper healthcare???

Yes we pay higher cost for gasoline, food, taxes, But does it amount to the cost of a 1 week stay in your hospital after a triple bypass or a lengthy stay for a transplant? I think not, but correct me if I'm wrong.

With 5 children I am still glad to be a CANADIAN. My husband is on disability for thoracic outlet syndrome which developed after years of working as a diamond driller. He will eventually need surgery, if this was to occur in the US would I still be able to feed my family, pay the mortgage, or perhaps save a little money to help my children when they go off to college???

I would probable lose everything I ever worked for.

I just don't think it is fair that the hard working people in the US don't have proper coverage and that an illness could ruin you financially never mind what it must do to those kind people emotional.

Again I'm sorry if I struck a nerve

Have a nice day and good health to everyone

:kiss

fergus51 · Mar 12, 2003

Sixes, although we pay more in taxes here in Canada, I actually take home a little more percentage wise than when I live in the US and take US taxes and health care insurance out of my paycheck.

It really doesn't matter though. Health care in Canada has reached the status of a national religion, and I can't imagine a majority ever favoring getting rid of universal access. At the same time, anything that can be labelled "socialist" in the US will always be reviled and never accepted as a part of daily life, even IF it were fabulous. The US needs an American solution, not the Canadian one.

semstr · Mar 12, 2003

Tracy, you are one wise woman!

Gromit · Mar 13, 2003

Fergus, I've never seen it put that way, but I'm very impressed. You hit it right on the head. Wish I'd thought of it!

I'd say youre completely right.

I do believe we will solve our problem (one way or the other we will have to -if not before, then certainly after it collapses entirely.). I just hope we do a good job.

Well, back to the books.

sigh.