Illegal Drugs At Work?

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Thought i'd see what you guys think about this....

I was in class today and some of the girls were talking about their CNA jobs....one gal brought up drug testing and how if they implemented drug tests in her LTCF then they would lose half the staff!! She goes on to say that not only do atleast half the staff use cocaine, heroin and marajiuana they do it on their breaks at work! If that isn't enough the LTCF she is talking about is the one my grandmother lived in for awhile before she died (she lived there about 10 yrs ago). I don't understand how these people get away with this! How do their managers not know, especially if they are doing it on their break at work??? Also arent drug tests mandatory at all health care facilities?? Years ago when my grandmother was cared for there the nursing staff seemed great...i was there atleast 2ce a week and my mom atleast 3-4 I never noticed this...we live in a great neighborhood and have never encountered anything like this before...what do you guys think I should do? I haven't seen this directly, just heard from the girl in my class. I would hate for anyone to get hurt (patients) if it is true though....

Specializes in Telemetry, ICU, Resource Pool, Dialysis.
I guess im most amazed that IF this is really happening and there are employees using heroin at work, im suprised NO ONE has noticed, i mean I would think it would be obvious if an employee were strung out...i havent seen to many functional heroin and cocaine addicts...

Could be that people DO notice odd behavior or moods. Maybe if they are otherwise good CNAs, people are unwilling to turn them in for fear of staffing crunches. Maybe they figure a "weird" CNA is better than none. A scary thought, because if these people ever become nurses, they will be the ones diverting medication away from people who need it without a second thought.

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That is my understanding, too. But people can be tested anytime if there is an accusation, or witness of drug use. I worked with a guy once who had a patient accuse him of smelling like alcohol. The house sup had him urine tested on the spot. Turned out negative - he had just used the ALCOHOL hand cleaner inside the room. I'll have to dig out my good old employee handbook and check our policy on random drug screens.

A urine alcohol test is not valid in a Federal Court. That's why most agencies (including the Dept. of Transportation) use Breathylizer testing. Too many factors (IDDM, kidney problems, etc.) can influence a urine alcohol test. :)

Tina, MSN,RN,APRN-BC

Occupational Nurse Practitioner

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Specializes in PICU, Nurse Educator, Clinical Research.
A urine alcohol test is not valid in a Federal Court. That's why most agencies (including the Dept. of Transportation) use Breathylizer testing. Too many factors (IDDM, kidney problems, etc.) can influence a urine alcohol test. :)

Tina, MSN,RN,APRN-BC

Occupational Nurse Practitioner

To the OP:

I think you made the right decision. Whether or not the LTCF chooses to investigate is out of your hands now, but you did what you could do.

Regarding casual vs. habitual use of substances:

I'm all for the decriminalization of marijuana...I don't see any difference between someone smoking the occasional joint and drinking a beer now and then. Nor is being stoned out of your mind terribly different from being falling-down drunk. However, at this time, alcohol is legal, pot isn't...and those are the parameters in which we work today. Same thing with narcotic analgesics; test positive with an rx, and you're fine, as was the case when I started my CNA position, but without one, it keeps you from getting hired.

Some people feel that no healthcare worker should even take prescribed narcotics while (or even within 24 hours of) working. I had an instructor say he refused to take narcotics for *anything* because he had vicodin once and didn't like the way it made him 'feel'. Another instructor, in a different conversation, said she thought it was more dangerous for a nurse to work while in uncontrolled, severe pain than it was to work using narcotics as prescribed.

I think that someone shooting up heroin at work has a major problem- not only is the facility at risk, the employee needs help. Hopefully, if these claims are true and the facility confronts the worker(s) in question, those with substance abuse problems can get treatment. Two of my friends ended up in detox programs after becoming dependent on narcotics following major MVA's.

In terms of pre-employment screening, my hospital does the whole urine pan-screen, as well as a breathylizer (sp?) test for ETOH. When I did mine, I asked the tester if they ever had positive results- I couldn't imagine coming to that appointment after drinking! She said it was common, and pointed out that many alcoholics can't function normally *without* drinking.

Just my $0.02 worth. :)

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I'm not talking past history of the nurse...I'm talking once in a blue moon. Nor am I talking alcoholics. They're hiding it. Watching out for pts is a big prority yes but I can't become Inspector Gadget and put my pts at risk becuase i'm too busy watching another nurse all the time in case they might be impaired. Signs yes. I would let someone know that I will be watching but I won't immediatly go to management for a measly joint when I know they hardly touch it.

In Canada we look at pot in a different light so maybe this explains my attitude towards it.

Z

PS: Believe it or not I don't smoke pot since I hate the effects and yes..I do frown upon those who spark up a doobie every 2 hours like cigarettes. :)

I think we got way off topic. Sorry OP.

I agree with you about not being a nursing narc partrol member.... lol heck who would have the time??? lol I was referring to the OP's situation.

Some substances are just too dangerous to have weekend and day off playtime with. Heroine and Cocaine wold be two that immediately come to mind. I have to agree with you on the doobie smoking. I know people who have a little every blue moon or so.... without apparent long term effects. But the habitual smokers that I've seen are shy a few brain cells.

Me..... I'll settle for a beer every once in awhile.... I like to relax but not get anywhere near drunk . Tho I have to admit that last year I did have 3 beers and sang kareoke..... will my sins ever end???:chuckle

MaryRose

Hugs to ya Z!

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I agree with you about not being a nursing narc partrol member.... lol heck who would have the time??? lol I was referring to the OP's situation.

Some substances are just too dangerous to have weekend and day off playtime with. Heroine and Cocaine wold be two that immediately come to mind. I have to agree with you on the doobie smoking. I know people who have a little every blue moon or so.... without apparent long term effects. But the habitual smokers that I've seen are shy a few brain cells.

Me..... I'll settle for a beer every once in awhile.... I like to relax but not get anywhere near drunk . Tho I have to admit that last year I did have 3 beers and sang kareoke..... will my sins ever end???:chuckle

MaryRose

Hugs to ya Z!

Thanks for the hugs Maryrose!

Cheers ! :beer:

Z

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Well there's going to be someone coming along here who's going to point out that this student could have hurt the pt and what would have happened if you werent there but I totally would have dealt with it the same as you.

Except I think I would have spoke to him when I found out about his smoking up prior to clinicals. Glad he was dealt with.

Smoking marijuana to me is no better or worse than ETOH. Too many times I've seen our nurses in the bar totally wasted but then they have 3 days off. Just because you're a nurse it doesn't mean the "sinful" things in life should be totally off limits. (speaking mostly of etoh) Pot smoking ALL the time..well no of course not. Once in a while...once in a blue moon? Who freaking cares. HEROIN? Woah.

As for the OPs qusetion..rumors are rampid in a hospital....I'm a firm believer in approaching the accused first.

And why would you offend anyone? It's your opinion. :)

Z

i definately talked to him, as did others, about this. It didn't seem to make a difference. He said what he did on his time was his own business, except what he failed to realize is that 2 hrs before clinicals IS NOT his own time. Not to me anyway. He's preparing to take care of others. He was allowed to come back the following year to repeat that semester with frequent drug screens, only this time it was drinking. No one had to rat him out this time. He couldn't seem to get his care plans done before clinicals and was forgetting them when he did. He flunked himself out of clinicals that time. It's really sad when you see someone who has the potential to do great things with their life only to throw it all away like that.

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And why would you offend anyone? It's your opinion. :)

Z

i just didn't want it to sound as if i was on my high horse or anything..lol..i tend to get opinionated without realizing i may offend someone. Noone likes a snitch, but I just feel that sometimes there's no other option than to be one...for the safety of myself and others.

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i definately talked to him, as did others, about this. It didn't seem to make a difference. He said what he did on his time was his own business, except what he failed to realize is that 2 hrs before clinicals IS NOT his own time. Not to me anyway. He's preparing to take care of others. He was allowed to come back the following year to repeat that semester with frequent drug screens, only this time it was drinking. No one had to rat him out this time. He couldn't seem to get his care plans done before clinicals and was forgetting them when he did. He flunked himself out of clinicals that time. It's really sad when you see someone who has the potential to do great things with their life only to throw it all away like that.

Well he definately didn't belong in the program. Good for you for trying to talk to him. Maybe some kind of 12 step program would be more up his alley.

As for the sadness that follows watching someone throw their life away..I expect I'll see a lot of that when I graduate.

Z

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Specializes in Telemetry, ICU, Resource Pool, Dialysis.
i just didn't want it to sound as if i was on my high horse or anything..lol..i tend to get opinionated without realizing i may offend someone. Noone likes a snitch, but I just feel that sometimes there's no other option than to be one...for the safety of myself and others.

In our profession it's not being a snitch to report someone like that guy!! Imagine if you never told, he graduated, and ended up taking care of one of your loved ones!! If people are going to do things like that in clinicals, at school or in the workplace, they should be prepared to be turned in by someone with a backbone - like you!!

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i just didn't want it to sound as if i was on my high horse or anything..lol..i tend to get opinionated without realizing i may offend someone. Noone likes a snitch, but I just feel that sometimes there's no other option than to be one...for the safety of myself and others.

I'm with you too when it comes to watching out for pt safety and your own as well. :)

Z

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That is my understanding, too. But people can be tested anytime if there is an accusation, or witness of drug use. I worked with a guy once who had a patient accuse him of smelling like alcohol. The house sup had him urine tested on the spot. Turned out negative - he had just used the ALCOHOL hand cleaner inside the room. I'll have to dig out my good old employee handbook and check our policy on random drug screens.

This reminds me of one time that I almost got busted for alcohol. I was working at a baptist maternity home and I was giving a house parent a ride in my car. I was in the car before she got in and I had noticed a smell and thought nothing of it, but it did smell like alcohol. Keep in mind that even though this house parent was in her 50's she was very naive (she told the teenage pg residents that if they gave birth to a baby girl then they would be in double trouble because "if you have frequent sex before getting pregnant, the baby will be a girl and if it's a one time encounter than the baby will be a boy" Yeah, my jaw dropped on that one too).

Anyhow, I thought nothing of it until I was called in by my supe a few hours later and was questioned about the alcohol in my car. "What alcohol?" I said.

Supe: Well, the house parent noticed a strong smell of alcohol in your car. We need to keep in mind the girls' safety you know. I need to inspect your car.

Found out later that a can of aerosol can of hairspray had deployed for a little more than a few seconds when I had adjusted the seat (it was under the seat). I was definitely cleared.

What really gets me is that this woman was so naive. She couldn't tell the difference from the smell of alcohol in hairspray vs. the smell of consumed alcohol from a person's breath. Or rather, the smell of an open container in the car. She really wasn't very bright...

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Specializes in Neuro, Critical Care.
This reminds me of one time that I almost got busted for alcohol. I was working at a baptist maternity home and I was giving a house parent a ride in my car. I was in the car before she got in and I had noticed a smell and thought nothing of it, but it did smell like alcohol. Keep in mind that even though this house parent was in her 50's she was very naive (she told the teenage pg residents that if they gave birth to a baby girl then they would be in double trouble because "if you have frequent sex before getting pregnant, the baby will be a girl and if it's a one time encounter than the baby will be a boy" Yeah, my jaw dropped on that one too).

Anyhow, I thought nothing of it until I was called in by my supe a few hours later and was questioned about the alcohol in my car. "What alcohol?" I said.

Supe: Well, the house parent noticed a strong smell of alcohol in your car. We need to keep in mind the girls' safety you know. I need to inspect your car.

Found out later that a can of aerosol can of hairspray had deployed for a little more than a few seconds when I had adjusted the seat (it was under the seat). I was definitely cleared.

What really gets me is that this woman was so naive. She couldn't tell the difference from the smell of alcohol in hairspray vs. the smell of consumed alcohol from a person's breath. Or rather, the smell of an open container in the car. She really wasn't very bright...

oh my and she counsels at risk teens...sigh...lol when she made the comment about the baby thing did you ask her if she had any children herself, it wouldve been funny if she had like 3 girls....

anyway kcrow...i wouldve done the same thing!! what business did he have coming to a clinical HIGH??!? dont feel bad if i had a problem like that id be thankful you turned me before i did something stupid (ie kill someone while high) and made a mess out of my life and my career...i dont understand people, i mean he had to have worked hard to get to that point, going through all the clincals classes just to throw it away?? dont get it...

it is sad about the CNA's..if they really are high on cocaine and heroin then i cant even imagine what kind of care their patients are getting.....

by the way what does ETOH stand for, ive never heard of this test...i assume its an alcohol brethalizer? ive never heard of anyone giving that?

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