If you can't say anything nice...

teeituptom, BSN, RN · Sep 20, 2005

well personally as I am an avid golfer I like your name.

Whats your handicap

tamm1 · Sep 21, 2005

i have had the same experiences (are we in the same school???) and posted a thread about the same issue yesterday about needing advice from current crna's...so feel free to read it!

and yes, even a current crna told me not to tell a/o since they won't want to train you for your icu experience that you need if they know that you'll go on to get your masters so soon after....

wallyballie_golf · Sep 21, 2005

i have had the same experiences (are we in the same school???) and posted a thread about the same issue yesterday about needing advice from current crna's...so feel free to read it!
and yes, even a current crna told me not to tell a/o since they won't want to train you for your icu experience that you need if they know that you'll go on to get your masters so soon after....

I have read the replies to your thread, i found that "heartICU" was most helpful. As you said that they won't teach you certain aspects and will be, in so many words, less helpful, I just could not believe that this was actually going on.

I even had a friend that told his/her peers and teachers that he/she was pursueing another path just to make sure he/she was not going to be discrimInated against while getting an BSN.

Focker, CRNA · Sep 21, 2005

i have had the same experiences (are we in the same school???) and posted a thread about the same issue yesterday about needing advice from current crna's...so feel free to read it!
and yes, even a current crna told me not to tell a/o since they won't want to train you for your icu experience that you need if they know that you'll go on to get your masters so soon after....

I somewhat disagree, I think it is a good idea to be totally upfront about your goals in your career. A manager interviewing you would want to know that you are a motivated nurse anyway. Any unit that would turn you away because they resent the fact that you will be pursuing an advancement in your career is not a unit where you want to work anyway. That said, if you plan to work there less than a year, that would discourage someone from hiring you, as it would cost more money to train you than the work output you would provide them.

fungirl · Sep 21, 2005

I am currently in a BSN program and was wondering if it is visable to state that i am want to pursue a career as a CRNA. The reason for asking is that i have heard of professors, RNs, etc. ridicual against students pursueing this profession. I do not understand why they would, since an NA still provides the person-centered care that nursing is all about.
So if you have any recommendation, pass experiences, ect please share.
Thanks, :)

Hi, wallyballie, I too am attempting the crna path, it has always been a goal, even before nursing school. I have been a RN for 4 yrs now, and I still won't tell anyone what I am planning. Mostly because I hear some very adverse type of reactions from the very seasoned rn's when the subject of a young person attempting crna school comes up. Some of it may be that it is a waste of time to train someone, but that is true in many other cases as well. But, I feel that some of it may stem from jealousy, or regret that they too did not choose this path prior to marriage and kids and the like. So, my final recommendation, keep it to yourself....

livefree · Sep 21, 2005

i have had the same experiences (are we in the same school???) and posted a thread about the same issue yesterday about needing advice from current crna's...so feel free to read it!
and yes, even a current crna told me not to tell a/o since they won't want to train you for your icu experience that you need if they know that you'll go on to get your masters so soon after....

Just my personal advice: DO NOT tell your manager when interviewing in an ICU that you plan on applying to to CRNA school.

I am a firm believer in being very direct and up front with your goals and plans for a future in nursing. I am a very straightforward person, sometimes too much so. However, this has caused me trouble in the past.

The first time I interviewed to be cross trained in the SICU at my hospital, I told the SICU manager my plans for CRNA school. She was very hesitant to hire me because of this, but she took a chance on me anyway. I think they happened to be very short staffed at the time.

I wound up leaving that hospital for about a year and returned. I decided to reinterview in the same SICU that I had already worked, but there was a very new and young manager. I once again was very upfront about my goals and why I wanted to return to the SICU. She stated that she was "very hesitant" to hire me because I would be leaving in 1.5 to 2 years. I asked her how many of her new nurses left after only one year, and most of them were new grads. She didn't answer my question.

It seemed as if she was also upset at the fact that I did not want to be an ICU nurse just for the sheer pleasure in it! I basically told her that I wanted to get back into the SICU just to get more recent SICU experience in order to apply to school.

I couldn't believe it, because I had great references from charge nurses in that same SICU, and I had already been working in that hospital, so I knew all the paperwork, nurses, support staff, docs, had my BLS, PALS, ACLS, critical care course, and had 2 years of ICU experience. Their financial and time investment in me would have been minimal.

It seemed like they did not want to hire me because I was upfront about my goals and leaving in 1.5 to 2 years to pursue my CRNA schooling. Even more ironic, is that this was a Level I Teaching hospital! After this interview, I decided that I would rather not work for someone like that. She told me to call her a few days later to find out what she decided. I never called her to find out and I never heard from her.

So, I just recently started in another teaching hospital SICU. On this interview, I was not as up front about my goals. I did not come straight out and lie about my goals, but I made a more general statement about pursing a Master's Degree. They did not ask what specific kind and I did not offer it up. I did ask them if they would support me if I chose to pursue a Master's Degree, and they of course said yes.

I planted the idea of pursuing higher nursing education without being specific. I hated to do it, but I couldn't afford to not get the job and the recent ICU experience prior to apply to CRNA school. At least this way, in 6 months, when I asked for 5 or 6 references from my manager and/or educator, they won't be surprised that I am applying to school. If they do say something negative, I can always say that I did mention pursuing a master's degree in my initial job interview, and that they said they would support me in my pursuit.

So, basically, just CYA when interviewing. Especially if you are from a smaller area where there aren't many options in applying to different hospitals.

Good luck.

wallyballie_golf · Sep 21, 2005

Thank you all for responding to the thread.

zoozoo · Sep 22, 2005

I completely agree with Livefree story! I applied at 4 hospitals for an ICU position right after school. At one hospital I worked as an aid during the senior year. They asked me where I see myself in 5 years and I told them about my plans to become a CRNA. I did not get the job in neither SICU, nor CCU or MICU! They had 3 open positions at that time! The ad was running in the local paper and was on bulletin board!!! I got denied because I did not "posses experience", but my college friend got hired right in and she never worked as an aid!!!Never had hospital experience!

Other 3 hospitals asked me the same question:where I see myself in 5 years.At that time I did not get an idea of not telling the truth. Anyway, I had to apply into one of the Michigan's hospitals (the drive for me is 45 min. now!) and during an interview just said that I would like to pursue a Master's degree in the future but had not decided yet which one.I DIDN'T TELL THEM ABOUT CRNA! I was hired during an interview...I was offered position right then!

Right now, only one person at my present job that I trust knows what my plans are. I still keep it as a secret. I would suggest-keep a SECRET...

ZASHAGALKA, RN · Sep 22, 2005

I agree with not revealing plans to leave a place from which you are seeking employment.

Put the shoe on the other foot. If you are a manager, and you are evaluated based on how well you retain your employees, and you know that, of 2 candidates, one is planning to work 2 yrs or less, who would you hire?

It costs over $75,000 to recruit and bring a critical care nurse up to independent practice. Would you spend that money if that candidate was up front with you that he/she intends to be a poor return on that investment?

You have your goals and that is admirable. But the manager has his/her goals, too. Interviewing is the art of convincing a manager that you are the candidate that fulfills his/her goals, not necessarily yours.

Take a cue from the Supreme Cabal. They tried for a week to get some idea of Roberts' intentions and failed. So, now he will be hired. You think if he had actually told the Senate his intentions on Roe v. Wade he would have gotten the job? If he had said "I will vote to overturn it" the Dems would have immediately filibustered. If he had said "I will vote to keep it" the Repubs would have been the ones voting against him. Instead, he spoke at length and said nothing. And will now get the job.

Good luck on your school. I don't think you have to keep your plans a 'secret', but I wouldn't advertise during the interview process, either.

As far as your current education endeavors, most people live in their own 'bubbles' - if you tell a BSN instructor that you want to be a CRNA, they might interpret that as meaning that you don't think the wonderful education that you are receiving from them is good enough for you. In reality, you only care about what they think in terms of getting the education that they can give you. So, best not to rock that boat.

Is that petty? Of course it is. So now the 20,000 dollar question: Do you want to challenge the pettiness of somebody that controls your grades, or do you want to go along to get along.

My very first college class, My Eng 101 prof gave me this sage advice. There are 2 rules of college. Rule #1 - The instructor is always right. Rule #2 - If you want to pass, see Rule #1.

~faith,

Timothy.

Kiwi, BSN, RN · Sep 22, 2005

I think it's ridiculous that nursing professors don't encourage their students who have ambitions to pursue adv prac nursing. Heck, a lot of med students know what specialty they want to go into, like, "I want to be a Pediatrician". I've had my share of unprogressive nursing instructors who don't seem to see beyond the role of a bedside nurse. While bedside nursing skills are a must-have, I want to have the knowledge to make more decisions for my pt. Be careful who you tell -- but, there are some professors who will be really proud of you and who will give you extra opportunities!

A lot of nurse managers will be hesitant to hire you if you'll leave after a year. They are taking a risk if you get accepted after 1 yr. It costs $40,000 to hire a new grad into critical care after all of the internships, critical care classes, and working for about 4mo with a preceptor. A nurse manager who be crazy to hire somebody and lose that much money. I got accepted into a critical care position because I was willing to compromise. I told my manager that I would work at least 1.5 yrs after being completely oriented to critical care nursing, that I would earn a CCRN, participate on hospital committees, and that I would be flexible i.e. taking on additional shifts, etc. It's so important to GET IN an ICU by any means possible. I was class president, graduated with honors, did research, got published, but it means NOTHING if you don't have any experience in the ICU. From reading so many of these threads around here, it comes down to your experience and interview when getting into a school.

rn29306 · Sep 22, 2005

I think it's ridiculous that nursing professors don't encourage their students who have ambitions to pursue adv prac nursing. Heck, a lot of med students know what specialty they want to go into, like, "I want to be a Pediatrician". I've had my share of unprogressive nursing instructors who don't seem to see beyond the role of a bedside nurse. While bedside nursing skills are a must-have, I want to have the knowledge to make more decisions for my pt. Be careful who you tell -- but, there are some professors who will be really proud of you and who will give you extra opportunities!
A lot of nurse managers will be hesitant to hire you if you'll leave after a year. They are taking a risk if you get accepted after 1 yr. It costs $40,000 to hire a new grad into critical care after all of the internships, critical care classes, and working for about 4mo with a preceptor. A nurse manager who be crazy to hire somebody and lose that much money. I got accepted into a critical care position because I was willing to compromise. I told my manager that I would work at least 1.5 yrs after being completely oriented to critical care nursing, that I would earn a CCRN, participate on hospital committees, and that I would be flexible i.e. taking on additional shifts, etc. It's so important to GET IN an ICU by any means possible. I was class president, graduated with honors, did research, got published, but it means NOTHING if you don't have any experience in the ICU. From reading so many of these threads around here, it comes down to your experience and interview when getting into a school.

Said more eloquently than I could have. Due to the cost of training a new grad and time involved with classes and preceptor, most ICUs and smart nurse managers will require signing a contract. Mine was for 2 years and I was comfortable with that. I was quoted as 30K being the amount to train someone when I applied, this was the year 2001, so I def believe the 40K now. Do what you have to do to get into a unit. Play the game...