If you are drunk, don't drive!

jimthorp · Feb 11, 2007

What specifically is a field sobriety test?

Tweety, BSN, RN · Feb 11, 2007

What specifically is a field sobriety test?

I don't really know precisely. From what I've seen on TV and such, they make you walk a straight line, have you close your eyes and spread your arms out and make you touch your finger to your nose, and stuff like that. It's a way to check your coordination and check for impairment.

My internet connection is slow and I'm trying to Google it, so I'll edit in a minute if I find something interesting.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Feb 11, 2007

Here's a link. Obviously it's not an exact science and there are some problems with it. Used correctly it can be important I'm sure.

http://www.nj-dwi.com/sobriety-1.htm

caliotter3 · Feb 11, 2007

Pretty much what Tweety described is what a field sobriety test is as I was taught many yrs ago when I went thru basic police tng in the military. I never got a chance to put my tng into everyday practice as I took the tng for different reasons. Perhaps somebody who has a law enforcement spouse or has been a cop themselves can be more specific and up to date.

allnurses Guide · Feb 11, 2007

Pretty much what Tweety described is what a field sobriety test is as I was taught many yrs ago when I went thru basic police tng in the military. I never got a chance to put my tng into everyday practice as I took the tng for different reasons. Perhaps somebody who has a law enforcement spouse or has been a cop themselves can be more specific and up to date.

I'll call my nephew in the morning - I do know they are trained in this area.

steph

Ann RN · Feb 11, 2007

What specifically is a field sobriety test?

Jim, I assume you are from PA (your name). As I have stated before, there is an Implied Consent Law in PA. Just by being licensed to drive in PA, you have consented to just such a test. If you are arrested for DUI and refuse, your license will be taken away for a minimum of one year.

As for my godson's accident - his BAC was 0.11. He is 5' 8" and a little on the thinner side. There were 2 charges. One was DUI and the other was vehicular homicide. This charge for a beautiful boy who, after having to shoot his first person in Iraq, called his father and asked, "Daddy, why did I have to kill that man?" So the accident does not have to be your fault, but you can still be held responsible. That is why I do not understand that when you say "2 pints affect me the same way" that you also say "the only time I drink and drive is when I have a beer or two with dinner".

What do you think nurses can do to make the "gray areas" more clear? I respect your right to have the opinion you do, but I would like to hear your solutions.

shaneRN · Feb 11, 2007

I am an RN who once was arrested for DUI. My violation occured over 11 years ago. I was going through a divorce (not an excuse) and my life was an utter mess. I made a horrible choice that night and I thank God everday that I didn't injur or kill a fellow human being. At the time the legal limit here in Idaho was .10. I blew a .05 and .07 on serial intoxilizer tests but was charged because I failed the Feild Sobriety Test. Also affecting my impairment was the fact that I was taking prescription anxiolytic medication. I pled guilty, weaned myself off the medication under the direction of my PCP and vowed to never drink alcohol again. In fact the last time I consumed alcohol was December 20, 1995. Of course, I didn't become a nurse until 8 years later but I have to answer yes to application questions that ask if I have ever been convicted of a misdemeanor, or have ever illegally used substances. To date, it has not caused me any trouble in getting licensure (perhaps because my record is clear in all other aspects and it occured in the past). I guess my point is that people (nurses included) make horrible choices at times. The hope is that we learn from these mistakes and it helps us to grow. I feel that the counseling that I entered following my conviction contributes significantly to the Nurse that I am today. I think it would be an aweful day when a conviction for DUI resulted in an automatic lifetime denial of licensure. If a nurse consistantly makes dangerous decisions at work or in there personal life the argument takes on a new light. Thank god I got to learn that one without injuring or killing someone else.

Agnus · Feb 11, 2007

I read much talk here about "poor judgement" and weather that poor judgement is carried over into one's work. I am also reading here that one does not intend to comit bodily harm when they exercise the "poor judgement" of drinking and driving.

Consider this as this is the whole point of such laws. But I didn't mean to kill your child, wife, mother, sister, fiance, family, etc. I was only exercising poor judgement" Reguardless of the intent they or she/he are dead, and I am responsible.

Now consider this senerio. "I didn't intend to kill or harm the patient I was only exercising poor judgement." I don't mean this as an introduction of, if one then the other. Of course one does not necesiairly follow the other. We know though that an offender of malpractice for example is more often than not a repeat offender. He may not have been caught each time or sued each time. Yet in deposition and court it tends to show up that a given case is not the first time.

Those who exercise poor judgement with the knowledge that the results could be extreemly tragic tend to repeat this behavior. How many DUIs does it take to kill some one. (I read here that it should be after the 3rd conviction that one should be penialized.) Honestly it taks only once. We were simply lucky that the drived did no harm this time. Why press luck, when it means human life?

We also know from studies that those who tend to use poor judgement in one area of life do so in others. If you have so poor reguard for human life that you are willing to gamble that you will not kill someone if you get behind the wheel while under the influence today then what business do have being isn a professions where we could potentially gamble this way multiple times a day with the same people? (patients)

"Poor judgement" is a polite term used to make something serious seem less so. Consequently it is a rationalization for disreguard of human life.

The SOLE reason that we enacted the laws that allow us to rehabilitate nurse who are drug and alcohol abusers was NOT to take pity on the poor nurse who just had "poor judgement" The reason was to stop nurses from covering up and hiding the fact that they or a collegue were guilt of this. When there is kowledge that you will or may be punished you tend to hide that you abuse or that a collegue abuses. After all punishment means loss of a professional license. The ability to earn an income in that profession. So you hide it. By taking away the punishment and offering rehabilitation nurses are more likely to report collegues and even themselves when they are a risk.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Feb 11, 2007

Thanks for sharing your story Shane. I'm glad you were given to opportunity to work as a nurse and you've "cleaned up your act". Kudos and congratulations!

You do illustrate a point that I implied in this thread. At the time of your DUI, your life was a mess, you were on other drugs, etc., and were not functioning optimally. If you were a licensed nurse at the time, you might have needed some intervention to keep that "mess" from spilling over into your practice. Not that it would have, but the potential was there. The DUI would have been a red flag.

Not that we licensed professionals don't get messy lives. We all do, that's life.

shaneRN · Feb 11, 2007

Thanks for sharing your story Shane. I'm glad you were given to opportunity to work as a nurse and you've "cleaned up your act". Kudos and congratulations!
You do illustrate a point that I implied in this thread. At the time of your DUI, your life was a mess, you were on other drugs, etc., and were not functioning optimally. If you were a licensed nurse at the time, you might have needed some intervention to keep that "mess" from spilling over into your practice. Not that it would have, but the potential was there. The DUI would have been a red flag.
Not that we licensed professionals don't get messy lives. We all do, that's life.

Absolutely true!! And important to note that just because at a given point in time someone is "messed up" does not imply that it's a permanent state. We are all human! We do make mistakes! and We hopefully get the chance to recover! That is what the board of nursing's "Recovering Nurse" programs address.

shaneRN · Feb 11, 2007

I read much talk here about "poor judgement" and weather that poor judgement is carried over into one's work. I am also reading here that one does not intend to comit bodily harm when they exercise the "poor judgement" of drinking and driving.
Consider this as this is the whole point of such laws. But I didn't mean to kill your child, wife, mother, sister, fiance, family, etc. I was only exercising poor judgement" Reguardless of the intent they or she/he are dead, and I am responsible.
Now consider this senerio. "I didn't intend to kill or harm the patient I was only exercising poor judgement." I don't mean this as an introduction of, if one then the other. Of course one does not necesiairly follow the other. We know though that an offender of malpractice for example is more often than not a repeat offender. He may not have been caught each time or sued each time. Yet in deposition and court it tends to show up that a given case is not the first time.
Those who exercise poor judgement with the knowledge that the results could be extreemly tragic tend to repeat this behavior. How many DUIs does it take to kill some one. (I read here that it should be after the 3rd conviction that one should be penialized.) Honestly it taks only once. We were simply lucky that the drived did no harm this time. Why press luck, when it means human life?
We also know from studies that those who tend to use poor judgement in one area of life do so in others. If you have so poor reguard for human life that you are willing to gamble that you will not kill someone if you get behind the wheel while under the influence today then what business do have being isn a professions where we could potentially gamble this way multiple times a day with the same people? (patients)
"Poor judgement" is a polite term used to make something serious seem less so. Consequently it is a rationalization for disreguard of human life.
The SOLE reason that we enacted the laws that allow us to rehabilitate nurse who are drug and alcohol abusers was NOT to take pity on the poor nurse who just had "poor judgement" The reason was to stop nurses from covering up and hiding the fact that they or a collegue were guilt of this. When there is kowledge that you will or may be punished you tend to hide that you abuse or that a collegue abuses. After all punishment means loss of a professional license. The ability to earn an income in that profession. So you hide it. By taking away the punishment and offering rehabilitation nurses are more likely to report collegues and even themselves when they are a risk.

I have to disagree! While programs that allow rehabilitation of substance abusing nurses play an important role in preventing "cover up" at least in some states this is not the stated reason for which the programs are enacted. Included in the purpose is the opportunity for the nurse to continue contributing to the profession while recovering from the substance abuse. Pity for has nothing to do with it nor do I feel that any reasonable person would argue it does!! The point you miss Agnus is that "poor judgement" does not damn you to a lifetime of mistakes. People can and do learn from their mistakes.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Feb 11, 2007

I understand that. Two beers with dinner is not enough to put me over the legal limit or near it. Part of the tradgedy is the young boy in jail.
Does the BON look at sticking their nose into my personal life as a deterent? Does the BON think that someone with a DUI is more likely to put patients at risk for harm? Does the BON think a nurse with a DUI casts a bad light onto the profession? I am a human, son, brother, uncle, husband, father, God fearing Christian, etc, and lastly a nurse.
I think people who take perscribed narcotic analgesics or any number of OTC's known to cause impairment and go to work are a far more common and a bigger threat to a patient than someone who has had a DUI off the job, yet you don't see near the commotion about this and it's legal. Much of the reason is the attention the media gives the issues.

The amount of alcohol does not matter. Drinking ANY alcohol and driving is wrong. Whether one beer or a quart of vodka straight. While the law only prosecutes those with a certain level, just stepping behind the wheel after ANY alcohol is wrong, and shows the intent to commit a crime.

What does being a "son, brother, uncle, husband, father, G-d fearing Christian" have to do with anything in this topic.

And BONs/ laws DO prosecute those that work or drive impaired by narcotics and OTCs, prescribed or otherwise. I believe that is why they come with warning labels.