I had some trouble with a CNA...should I talk to the manager?

Nurses General Nursing

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At the hospital I work at, everyone on the nursing staff is on probation for the first 90 days of employment. Then, there are peer evaluations done by the RNs. If the employee shows that they work hard and do well, then they'll be considered permanent employees after 90 days. If they perform poorly, they'll be given another 45 days of probation to "shape up or ship out". Then it's either permanent employment or dismissal.

I work with a CNA, hired for a different ward, but who floats over to ours occasionally, who recieved a lackluster evaluation after her first 90 days of employment. She's currently going through her 45 days. I became aware of all this when a nurse from this CNA's home ward asked me how she was doing over my ward, I gave her a briefing on her performance. She thanked me, saying that the nurses have to finish up the peer evaluations on her and any input is helpful.

Not too long ago, when the CNA worked with us, I brought some photos of a party that the people on our unit had a month or so ago. The CNA came up behind me to look at the pictures and said, "I'd like to look, because I didn't go to the party." At that point, I said, sarcastically, "Oh, well, that's because you weren't invited." Then I started chuckling a little bit, turned away from her, back to look at the pictures and said, "Oh, I'm just kidding, everyone in the hospital was welcome to-OW! Did you just punch me?!" After I turned back to look at the pictures again, she had decided to hit me on my back with her fist, right over my scapula. I said, "Why did you do that? Please don't hit me. That really, really hurt. It's always been a little sore since hurting it playing sports in high school" At that point she said, "Oh, I didn't know you had a bad shoulder" and apologized.

Now, yes, I admit, I probably shouldn't have been sarcastic. But, I know that right before she hit me, I was telling her that I was joking around and that she was welcome to go. I believe that she knew I was kidding around with her, and she just thought it would be funny to hit me for some reason. But isn't making jokes to someone, like I did, a little less offensive than hitting someone, like she did to me? It may just be the way I think, but I was raised to understand that there is no reason and no good excuse to hit anyone, and that there's certainly no reason to just sit there and take it. Having this mindset about people hitting others makes me feel like it's necessary for me to go to my manager, and tell her about the incident.

But, I don't know if I should. I understand she's had her probabtion extended for not performing well, so going to the manager with this could play a big part in her being fired. Part of me thinks that I'm partly at fault, because of my sarcasm right before her hitting me. The other part stands by the thought that she really had no right to hit me, and that the way she reacted was completely out of line. I do know that if I was the manager, I'd want to hear about someone who's working on my unit who reacts in such a way. I guess what I'm requesting from all of you who read through this long post is if I should just go to the manager and tell her what happened or, just leave it be since the CNA is aware that I won't tolerate being hit anymore, and not say anything at all.

Now, I'm just flabbergasted because I never thought, being a nurse working in a hospital with other health-care professionals, that I'd feel the need to write a post to request opinions and advice about a co-worker smacking me. The entire situation makes me feel like I'm in middle school all over again.

Specializes in Rodeo Nursing (Neuro).
Ok. that's it. This was more than a playful punch everyone. You need to notify the supervisor or your manager and make out a report of an injury on the job and be seen by whatever doctor the hospital uses for workman's comp (your manager will direct you). This is serious and I am appalled that there are not many others that are not understanding that. You were injured, no matter how small you, or other people who are posting to this thread, think that injury was. If you end up having a more serious problem with your back or shoulder from this the hospital will do nothing to help you because you didn't follow the proper procedure to report it. I'm speaking as an experienced nursing manager. You cannot just ignore this incident. If I were a manager at your place of employment and heard about this through the gossip grapevine, I would have you in my office in a heartbeat to find out your version of the story, start an investigation, get you seen by a workman's comp physician, and notify the manager of this CNA as well as the director of nursing!

In response to the postA big part of civilization is to act civilized and respectful, not like a bunch of cavemen. There is no acceptable place for violence in an organized, civilized society except perhaps on a football field or a boxing ring. Our constitution gives us the right to speak our peace. There's nothing in there that allows the listener to pummel the speaker. Even in the 18th century, the learned men who approved the Bill of Rights understood that.

Just to clarify, I don't mean it's okay to "take it to the next level," just that one shouldn't be surprised. To get a little pedantic, there is under law the concept of "fighting words," that are so provocative that physical retaliation is to some extent tolerated.

Clearly, the social contract falls apart if every offense is met with an escalating retaliation. If the OP had turned around and belted her attacker in the jaw, then the CNA pulled a knife, then the nurse shot her...well, we're bordering on mayhem, aren't we?

Still, I think the initial offender has a greater responsibility to de-escalate the situation. I would feel cowardly and churlish to go running to the authorities over a situation I had instigated. Also, it very much sounds as though these two could work out their differences without great harm to anyone.

Finally, just for the record, freedom of speech isn't absolute. Let's consider, for a moment, what the CNA should have done. Hitting was wrong, but there is no earthly reason she should have had to just tolerate the rudeness. Had she complained to management, she would have been well within her rights, and the OP would have been subject to disciplinary action.

P.S. I don't mean to say the OP's remarks were "fighting words." Rude and ill-considered, yes, but clearly the OP didn't intend to be vicious.

She was wrong to hit you and I think you should report it through the proper channels.

I also feel that your comment was rude and uncalled for. Some people are more sensitive than others, so what seemed a sarcastic jest to you may have seemed very hurtful to her. Comments like that could be hurtful to others, so please consider trying to be kinder to those around you in general, in the future.

Specializes in Nursing assistant.

If you said that to me, gosh, it would have hurt. And then, the fact that I am working a barely over minimun wage job. ouch. I got this kind of stuff alot as a nursing assistant, steady diet,,,,

NO one should ever hit anyone for any reason in the workplace. Yeah I have been hit too. What a world! CNAs get it all....

Specializes in Nursing assistant.

sorry about the post....just up to here with this stuff

Definitely report it. What happens when she hits again and is not on probation? Then it is next to imposssible of get rid of someone.

Luanne

Specializes in Med-Surg, Geriatric, Behavioral Health.

Well, many members have posted. I hope the feedback helped some in your decision. You were guilty of making a bad joke. She was guilty for physically retaliating in the manner in which she did. I would recommend a sit down with her with one neutral party to discuss it and how to work together. I don't condone violence at all in the workplace, nor disrespect. I think that this is a lesson for both of you. Sarcasm breeds only hurt feelings...which will only breed additional friction. I would watch your sarcasm. With regards to the CNA, I am a little concerned that a sarcastic remark can bring about such a physical response. You have control over your behavior, but what about a resident at the facility who doesn't? It bears watching. Regardless, the situation needs addressed by you both, in a face to face, and attempt to come to some understanding. With the issue of reporting it, that is for you to decide for yourself. What does your gut tell you? Have the discussion...then decide.

Specializes in med/surg, telemetry, IV therapy, mgmt.

To bth44. . .what has happened with this situation? Did you or anybody report it to the nurse manager? Has anything been done with this CNA?

Specializes in Orthosurgery, Rehab, Homecare.

I didn't read all of the replies, but wanted to chime in. We had a good employee, with over 15 yrs of good service, get fired over a scarily similar situation. She "playfully" tapped a seat RN on the head. The RN didn't feel it was very playful and out the door the tapper went. Violence is violence and should be reported.

~Jen

Any updates on whatever happened?

I would have fired her. I'm really surprised that so many people feel it was justified. I'm interested to see if she has done anything else of that nature. I fired a CNA who responded to a negative comment by an LPN by waiting for her to walk away and then announcing that the LPN was "lucky I didn't slap that cup of coffee into her face, won't be lucky if it happens again." Violence in the workplace is a zero tolerance issue.

Specializes in Obstetrics, M/S, Psych.
Any updates on whatever happened?

I would have fired her. I'm really surprised that so many people feel it was justified. I'm interested to see if she has done anything else of that nature. I fired a CNA who responded to a negative comment by an LPN by waiting for her to walk away and then announcing that the LPN was "lucky I didn't slap that cup of coffee into her face, won't be lucky if it happens again." Violence in the workplace is a zero tolerance issue.

The scenario you describe is totally different than the one the OP cited. The CNA you fired clearly threatened the nurse and meant to do her bodily harm, if she saw fit. That describes workplace violence.

In this case the CNA, though it was not an appropriate response, hit the nurse on the back in a knee jerk response after being clearly humiliated by that nurse. She needed to be spoken to for sure and the nurse should have apologized for her own tactless behavior, but this was not an example of workplace violence or a firing offense, IMO.

The scenario you describe is totally different than the one the OP cited. The CNA you fired clearly threatened the nurse and meant to do her bodily harm, if she saw fit. That describes workplace violence.

In this case the CNA, though it was not an appropriate response, hit the nurse on the back in a knee jerk response after being clearly humiliated by that nurse. She needed to be spoken to for sure and the nurse should have apologized for her own tactless behavior, but this was not an example of workplace violence or a firing offense, IMO.

This CNA didn't respond to an admittedly cruel remark by insulting the nurse. She didn't call her a b*tch or tell her off. SHE HIT HER WITH A CLOSED FIST HARD ENOUGH TO HURT FOR DAYS. If that isn't workplace violence, then how do you define it?

Specializes in Med onc, med, surg, now in ICU!.
... this was not an example of workplace violence or a firing offense, IMO.

It was violence in the workplace, ergo, it was workplace violence. Not on. I agree with the posters who suggested you speak with the CNA. I have a strong belief that if you have a problem with someone, talk to the person, not about them to everyone else. Not that I'm saying you're talking about her, I am just saying talk to her before you speak to your manager, and if you feel after the chat that you should report her, by all means do so. Don't accept being punched.

As far as your comment to her goes, I wouldn't be offended if you said that to me. I would probably tell you that I didn't need an invitation and I would invite myself to the next party. That's just me, I am pretty thick-skinned and sarcastic myself. I also make sure that I can reliably predict someone's reaction before I use that sort of humour, but you never know. Not everyone can handle people like you and me. The people who can think I am a funny person and like my sense of humour; the ones who don't, don't, and it doesn't take long to work out who likes me and who doesn't.

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