I quit my job and am seriously considering quitting nursing

DA314 · Nov 25, 2008

I think that you should do whatever makes you happy., but please keep in mind that petty games and high stress levels are a part of any work environment. I work at a law firm and I get extremely stressed out sometimes, and the clique-i-ness and backstabbing that goes on is unbelievable.

Accountants have a very high-stress job. They are working with people's finances, and when money is involved, people get highly emotional. One mistake and they are taking lots of heat. There is a guy in some of my classes who is switching from Being an accountant (he's been working as one for several years) to nursing becuase he can't take accounting anymore. Talk to any accountant around tax time and see how much abuse they take.

Architect- another high-stress job. It isn't just drawing buildings. It involves very complex mathematical equations to determine if the structure you are designing is strong enough to hold itself up, but flexible enough to withstand wind force and earth movement.

Secretary - not typically stressful, but can be at times. Although, with 7-8 fewer dollars per hour, you're talking a major reduction in lifestyle, which in and of itself can be hard to deal with.

Gov. Job- they typically don't pay all that well, but they do have great benefits. Depending on what you do for the gov., you may or may not be in a high stress situation.

Nursing- if you truly love nursing, then I encourage you to find work somewhere else, where there is less stress. Maybe look for a doctor's office or UTC setting? Hospital and LTC nursing are not for everyone.

Good Luck to you, I hope you find something that makes you happy.

Annieh1315 · Nov 25, 2008

We all have our moments and need to vent - that's what this site is for! Based on what I have read from your post, it sounds like you have kept a bad job for too long. No job should prevent you from taking care of yourself! Those in caring professions tend to be even more susceptible to that. As the cliche goes, you can't take care of others if you can't take care of yourself.

With that being said, it seems to me that you still like nursing. The actual profession of nursing. My thought is that you need a new job, not a new career. Be careful of broad generalizations and thoughts of "greener grass on the other side." There are backstabbing wrenches in any profession. Those never go away. Take this as an opportunity to evaluate the situation. How it happened, how it escalated, what your reaction was, what it could have been, etc. Then, next time you are dealing with a toxic person like that, create a different plan to deal with them.

Maybe you really do want to leave nursing, but don't do it because you hate your job. Find a job where everything is "perfect" and if you still want to leave, you know it's nursing you don't like and not the job. Make sense?

Hugs and support to you as you go through a challenging time!

nursemike, ASN, RN · Nov 25, 2008

She didn't say all nurses were "COWS" just the ones that bullied newer nurses.

While I'm willing to make some allowance that the OP was very upset, what she said was "fat cows," and while she did, indeed, only intend to apply the epithet to some, I find that equivalent to saying one didn't mean to apply some other epithet to all black people, just the ones who stole my car. It was a careless remark, and offensive. I'm not saying it was unforgiveable, but it was wrong.

Then, too, while it is true that real cows take the heirarchy within their herds pretty seriously, I don't believe they would ever stoop to the sort of behavior the OP described. I suppose one could say they bully the younger cows a bit, but cows never lie, or talk behind each others' backs.

leosasha · Nov 25, 2008

Good for you for taking a stand! I noticed that you are "thinking" about quitting nursing. Thinking is good. We need thinkers. It will be easier to think away from the mess. The kinds of behaviors you describe are innappropriate and unnacceptable in a nursing environment. There are more and more tales of it everyday. I feel compelled to appologize for my fellow colleagues. It is quite sad really. Nursing morale is not currently at it's highest peak. Is the grass greaner somewhere else? If I am reading you correctly, it could only get better. I am currently working in such a described environment. It's a 3 month contract through agency (Thank God). Having traveled I can surely say that I know that there is better than this. But..... how much better. The state of nursing has declined significantly over the past 10 years. It continues to decline. Am hoping that we don't have to reach "rock bottom" before eyes begin to open in large numbers. We are still very plugged to the system. I have left contracts in the past due to attrocious environment. I am attempting to stay due to the fact that I feel a particular calling to this environment. It remains to be seen as to whether I finish. I am truly needed where I currently am. I too am considering leaving nursing. The decision will be make soon I think. If I stay, am considering organizing a march on Washington. Any interest?

FireStarterRN, BSN, RN · Nov 25, 2008

It's all nice and good to say things like "stand up for yourself" and "be confident in yourself" and the like... but when you're new you simply do not know if the person criticizing you is being accurate in their assessment of you. For all the newbie knows, they just did something really stupid and that's why their preceptor was more sharp than one might expect initially. It takes time to learn that Meanie Melanie or Bully Brenda will find anything to criticize and not to take their criticisms too seriously most of the time. To the newbie, most every piece of feedback carries the same weight - that is, it might be VERY IMPORTANT so you'd better listen well! - because the newbie has no basis from which to judge the validity of the criticism. So if the precepting nurse tells the newbie nurse "you did that all wrong" or "this is what you should do" - the newbie doesn't have much choice but to take it at face value until they have more experience to work from.
My experience is that the degree of difficulty faced by newbies in nursing in many environments is more pronounced than in many other settings. Maybe because a newbie nurse is VERY dependent up on their colleagues starting out. If I'm starting out in a new accounting job and my colleague looks over my work and tells me (or implies) that I'm terrible accountant and I should do my work differently, I have the luxury of time to consider their feedback, to review an accounting resource, to re-do the work and fix any problems if need be, etc. But as a newbie nurse, if my colleague looks at my work and tells me (or implies) that I'm a terrible nurse and that I did this or that all wrong, how do I know whether or not they are correct? Sure, I can look things up when I get the chance and I can talk with a trusted nurse friend to get their opinion, but it may be awhile before I can do those things and meanwhile, I have patients with pressing needs and I have to trust my colleagues to guide me until I have enough experience to work more independently.

This whole post crystallizes the problem in nursing. I bolded some parts that really boil it down, but the whole post is so right on!

The nurse bullies take advantage of the newbies' weaknesses for their own perverse psycho-social needs. They are similar to child molestors who seek a jobs working with children. The bully nurse gets a new crop of victims every year. They stay on a unit for years and years, getting their sick jollies by browbeating newbies, driving them off, then getting new ones to fill their place.

Not all units are like this, but in some this type of nurse becomes entrenched, creating a toxic culture that is hard to uproot. Any manager that comes in and tries to fix it is also driven off.

sandlewood_nurse · Nov 25, 2008

While I'm willing to make some allowance that the OP was very upset, what she said was "fat cows," and while she did, indeed, only intend to apply the epithet to some, I find that equivalent to saying one didn't mean to apply some other epithet to all black people, just the ones who stole my car. It was a careless remark, and offensive. I'm not saying it was unforgiveable, but it was wrong.
Then, too, while it is true that real cows take the heirarchy within their herds pretty seriously, I don't believe they would ever stoop to the sort of behavior the OP described. I suppose one could say they bully the younger cows a bit, but cows never lie, or talk behind each others' backs.

Thank you all for your support. It means a lot. Thank you for your HOENSTY. If people were more honest, and less willing to put up with abuse perhaps nursing wouldn't have environments where people feel they have to leave nursing.

ALSO LET ME CLARIFY, I MEANT WHAT I SAID. Yes nurses Who BULLY OTHER NURSES AND CREATE TOXIC WORKPLACES are fat cows. They feed off other nurses, regardless of how good they really are or not. I am not saying I was great at my job, but I was good, and I was set up not once but several times by my preceptor and a couple other nurses.

Tell me how many times has this happened to you Mike? How many times have you had to go home, like I did yesterday, and explain to my family who depends on this paycheck, that I'm sorry, but they started lying about me, and indirectly threatening me physically so I can no longer work there. Do you have kids? I don't but I have an elderly mother, and a kid brother who is still in school, who depend on me to help out with the mortgage and school fees right now.

So I am not allowed to call these bullies and nurses that eat their young (not all nurses just the ones who participate in the eating), Fat Cows, yet they can walk all over me, threaten my job, threaten my life and physical well being, lie about me and get away with it? I had to quit my job because of this woman, because nobody could stop her and my manager refused to do anything about it. Because of her, I can't help my family out financially, and these are tough times.

Yes I love being a nurse, I love nursing. Perhaps I could find another placement, but I've worked in other areas. I've worked in THE OR where I've put up with my fair share of lateral violence and stuck around!! After a year I was told congratulations we didn't know you had it in you, you are very thick skinned. Yeah, that's all fine and dandy, but do I really need to put up with it? I paid a lot of dues in nursing school, in the OR and even in this job. I put up with a lot, and I was a model student. I took everything she said and I CORRECTED EACH MISTAKE. So she would simply set me up for more failures. When I was being abused by a patient she sat in a chair and smirked and later told me if the patient had hit me I would have deserved it. Btw I was very calm, respectful with the patient and was attempting to de esculate. The patient has a history of being like this with various staff, but she is afraid of this preceptor so she won't do it to her. That does not make me a bad nurse, that does not mean I deserve to be hit, it means she intimidates the patients too!!

As for the OP who came up with negatives on all the different occupations, well I have friends in those occupations, and yes if you don't know what you're doing you are in deep do do, but that was not the case here. Also when I explained some of the things that happened, like for instance I was told I would have deserved to be hit according to the other nurse, my friends said they have never experienced something like that. Yes stress is in EVERY JOB. I DON'T MIND STRESS!! I LIKE HARD WORK!! I AM A HARD WORKER!! MY BOSSES IN ALL MY NON NURSES JOBS LOVED ME AND WISHED ME TO STAY BUT I HAD TO END EMPLOYMENT BECUASE OF NURSING SCHOOL!! So please don't tell me all professions are this bad, and I'm weak or I'm lacking, because that is clearly not the case here. It's the nursing culture, lets just get it out in the open and admit it. I slowly started realizing how I was set up. how I was given unfair workloads and then told I couldn't handle it, NOBODY ELSE ON THE FLOOR HAD MORE WORK THAN I yet, I a new person could not handle it. Loll, I noticed that when experienced nurses had a load like mine they were nervous and they got help from me and other nurses too. So why weren't they told they couldn't handle it? Then I let it slide because I wanted to work and thought the nurse was grooming me for the worst.

I would never have left as long as she didn't lie about me, and threaten my physical safety. That's where I draw the line. Can't rely on my coworkers to be there for me as a team in a crises (I work in a place where emergenies do break out), and if tomorrow someone makes and error and I could get blamed and potentially fired for it, why should I stick around?

Maybe I will consider my options, but today I'm applying for bank jobs, a nice goverment job that pays only 3 buxz less than what I'm making right now and has better benefits, and secretarial positions. Once I have some income again I will think very long and hard about going back to nursing, I will only go back prn basis, until I find something I do like, and if they give me bs about no experience in this area, then so be it I won't come back and they've lost a nurse for good.

As for SOME PEOPLE NOT MEANT TO BE NURSES that is wrong!! :nono: I've handled patients, families, doctors, but when you can't depend on your own to be there, that does not mean you don't deserve or are not meant to be a nurse. I think those nurses who create toxic workplaces should not be nurses, because they create a hostile work environment that makes it harder to provide for efficient and safe patient care and THEY ARE THE ONES WHO ARE NOT MEANT TO BE NURSES.

DA314 · Nov 25, 2008

Sandlewood- I never called you weak or lacking. All I did was point out that the careers you mentioned all have their negatives. Every career does. And I never said you weren't cut out to be a nurse. You come off very defensive when nobody attacked you.

As for people indirectly threatening you physically, and threatening your life, I'm not sure what you mean by that, but if you feel threatened in any way, you should tell your supervisor. And possibly the police if you truly feel threatened.

Nobody forced you to quit your job that your family depended on. You quit because you didn't like the environment.

Coming on here and asking for advice, then getting angry at the advice you receive, is not a good way to go through life.

leosasha · Nov 25, 2008

I think your probably "meant" to be a nurse. Your description of yourself fits the picture to me. I testified before a state legislative commitee this year. Why not Washington? I would truly appreciate the folks up there doing their job and look at the state of morale in nursing. Of course, a wait for the next administration is involved. Gives one time to organize. I believe that waiting around for our nursing leadership has become an exercise in futility We'll have some fun I promise. Your perfect for it. Bright and articulate can get on my bus any day.

nursemike, ASN, RN · Nov 25, 2008

Thank you all for your support. It means a lot. Thank you for your HOENSTY. If people were more honest, and less willing to put up with abuse perhaps nursing wouldn't have environments where people feel they have to leave nursing.
ALSO LET ME CLARIFY, I MEANT WHAT I SAID. Yes nurses Who BULLY OTHER NURSES AND CREATE TOXIC WORKPLACES are fat cows. They feed off other nurses, regardless of how good they really are or not. I am not saying I was great at my job, but I was good, and I was set up not once but several times by my preceptor and a couple other nurses.
Tell me how many times has this happened to you Mike? How many times have you had to go home, like I did yesterday, and explain to my family who depends on this paycheck, that I'm sorry, but they started lying about me, and indirectly threatening me physically so I can no longer work there. Do you have kids? I don't but I have an elderly mother, and a kid brother who is still in school, who depend on me to help out with the mortgage and school fees right now.
So I am not allowed to call these bullies and nurses that eat their young (not all nurses just the ones who participate in the eating), Fat Cows, yet they can walk all over me, threaten my job, threaten my life and physical well being, lie about me and get away with it? I had to quit my job because of this woman, because nobody could stop her and my manager refused to do anything about it. Because of her, I can't help my family out financially, and these are tough times.
Yes I love being a nurse, I love nursing. Perhaps I could find another placement, but I've worked in other areas. I've worked in THE OR where I've put up with my fair share of lateral violence and stuck around!! After a year I was told congratulations we didn't know you had it in you, you are very thick skinned. Yeah, that's all fine and dandy, but do I really need to put up with it? I paid a lot of dues in nursing school, in the OR and even in this job. I put up with a lot, and I was a model student. I took everything she said and I CORRECTED EACH MISTAKE. So she would simply set me up for more failures. When I was being abused by a patient she sat in a chair and smirked and later told me if the patient had hit me I would have deserved it. Btw I was very calm, respectful with the patient and was attempting to de esculate. The patient has a history of being like this with various staff, but she is afraid of this preceptor so she won't do it to her. That does not make me a bad nurse, that does not mean I deserve to be hit, it means she intimidates the patients too!!
As for the OP who came up with negatives on all the different occupations, well I have friends in those occupations, and yes if you don't know what you're doing you are in deep do do, but that was not the case here. Also when I explained some of the things that happened, like for instance I was told I would have deserved to be hit according to the other nurse, my friends said they have never experienced something like that. Yes stress is in EVERY JOB. I DON'T MIND STRESS!! I LIKE HARD WORK!! I AM A HARD WORKER!! MY BOSSES IN ALL MY NON NURSES JOBS LOVED ME AND WISHED ME TO STAY BUT I HAD TO END EMPLOYMENT BECUASE OF NURSING SCHOOL!! So please don't tell me all professions are this bad, and I'm weak or I'm lacking, because that is clearly not the case here. It's the nursing culture, lets just get it out in the open and admit it. I slowly started realizing how I was set up. how I was given unfair workloads and then told I couldn't handle it, NOBODY ELSE ON THE FLOOR HAD MORE WORK THAN I yet, I a new person could not handle it. Loll, I noticed that when experienced nurses had a load like mine they were nervous and they got help from me and other nurses too. So why weren't they told they couldn't handle it? Then I let it slide because I wanted to work and thought the nurse was grooming me for the worst.
I would never have left as long as she didn't lie about me, and threaten my physical safety. That's where I draw the line. Can't rely on my coworkers to be there for me as a team in a crises (I work in a place where emergenies do break out), and if tomorrow someone makes and error and I could get blamed and potentially fired for it, why should I stick around?
Maybe I will consider my options, but today I'm applying for bank jobs, a nice goverment job that pays only 3 buxz less than what I'm making right now and has better benefits, and secretarial positions. Once I have some income again I will think very long and hard about going back to nursing, I will only go back prn basis, until I find something I do like, and if they give me bs about no experience in this area, then so be it I won't come back and they've lost a nurse for good.
As for SOME PEOPLE NOT MEANT TO BE NURSES that is wrong!! I've handled patients, families, doctors, but when you can't depend on your own to be there, that does not mean you don't deserve or are not meant to be a nurse. I think those nurses who create toxic workplaces should not be nurses, because they create a hostile work environment that makes it harder to provide for efficient and safe patient care and THEY ARE THE ONES WHO ARE NOT MEANT TO BE NURSES.

All nurses who bully are fat? All fat nurses bully? All female (cows)?

For my own experience, I freely admit I've been fortunate. I work on the unit where I worked as a UAP, and I can say with confidence that I don't believe any one of my coworkers has ever wanted to see me fail. Indeed, most have been very active in helping me succeed, and maybe a handful don't particularly care, either way. I'm sorry not everyone gets to enjoy such an environment. It truly is a problem we need to work on. In my opinion, that starts with our own conduct. I'll accept the notion that nurses need to be "thick-skinned," in the sense that feedback is not always positive, and there are occassions when action is fast and furious and some pleasantries get overlooked. It's never pleasant to be told you've messed up, no matter how civil or constructive the criticism. I've had, at times, to recognize that being told I'm doing great, while nice, doesn't teach me nearly as much as being told what I'm doing wrong. I don't hold a grudge if "pleases" and "thank-yous" get overlooked while a patient is crashing. But I do agree that we all have a right to expect to be treated with respect, and while I'll accept that honesty can be a bitter pill, at times, I agree that dishonesty is never acceptable. After the treatment described in the original post, anyone would have a right to be angry.

Still, some of the language in the original post was also disrespectful. To some extent--not a huge extent, but some--it's the very sort of behavior the OP objects to. Under the circumstances, it can be forgiven, but I don't really see how it can be defended.

Faeriewand, ASN, RN · Nov 25, 2008

Perhaps the term "cow" is cultural? I was speaking with someone from Australia who explained to me that the term "cow" meant the B word. It had nothing to do with body weight.

She said someone was a cow.

"oh she's fat?" (ready to blast her on the weight issue)

"no, she's a B!" :chuckle

leosasha · Nov 25, 2008

Must asknowledge that nursemike my be correct. I am not going to attempt to defend the, "acting out" statements but understand the space you are coming from. Anger can be a precurser to activism. I am more than willing to hear a little ranting if it gets you on board. Take some time to cool down. Mull it over. I would not be the least fearful having you as my nurse or riding the bus to Washington.

FireStarterRN, BSN, RN · Nov 25, 2008

I think the OP said 'fat cow' in a moment of passion and didn't mean to disparage the thousands of overweight nurses in America and beyond. I think she meant they were 'fat' in a figuative sense, from 'eating their young'. Didn't she apologize for having offended some?

I think continuing to ruminate over this slip of the keyboard is pointless.