I am from... to help...

Itzallgood · Jun 23, 2009

And that's the problem: for some reason, you just don't get it.
Canada is not part of the United States. Canada is a different country.
When people go to Canada--and use it as a "stepping stone" to the US--it is insulting to the people of Canada.
Very, very insulting.
So, if you want to work in another country while you are waiting to go to the US, you should pick a country where the people won't be so offended by your behavior.

If someone immigrates to USA and then wants to move to another country to work, I have no issuses with that.

It's someone trying to do better for themselves. They are not indentured servants.

Nurse!Nurse!Hello? · Jun 23, 2009

If someone immigrates to USA and then wants to move to another country to work, I have no issuses with that.
It's someone trying to do better for themselves. They are not indentured servants.

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree, I guess.

Apparently you don't "find fault" or "have issues" with anything anyone does as long as what they are doing is legal. You prefer to not consider the socio-cultural implications of their actions, though--the bad feelings it causes in Canada when using their beautiful country as a mere stepping-stone.

Maybe it's a cultural difference between your country and Western countries. Maybe in your country it is entirely acceptable to do whatever you can to get ahead, to trample on the feelings and customs of others as long as YOU get what YOU want! However, in Western countries that type of attitiude is considered selfish. Maybe that's why you appear as though you do not understand what others are saying--because it's a cultural difference. Maybe one of the reasons for the bad feelings directed at foreign nurses is this difference in perspective.

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Jun 23, 2009

If someone immigrates to USA and then wants to move to another country to work, I have no issuses with that.
It's someone trying to do better for themselves. They are not indentured servants.

Then the nurses should apply for a working visa not an immigration visa, there are thousands waiting for the immigration visa.No one wants or expects anyone to be an indentured servant, I think it is a privilege and an honor to be allow to move into one's country. Working and moving on to another country is not making the country their new home.

Itzallgood · Jun 27, 2009

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree, I guess.
Apparently you don't "find fault" or "have issues" with anything anyone does as long as what they are doing is legal. You prefer to not consider the socio-cultural implications of their actions, though--the bad feelings it causes in Canada when using their beautiful country as a mere stepping-stone.
Maybe it's a cultural difference between your country and Western countries. Maybe in your country it is entirely acceptable to do whatever you can to get ahead, to trample on the feelings and customs of others as long as YOU get what YOU want! However, in Western countries that type of attitiude is considered selfish. Maybe that's why you appear as though you do not understand what others are saying--because it's a cultural difference. Maybe one of the reasons for the bad feelings directed at foreign nurses is this difference in perspective.

Americans don't have issues with with people using it as a stepping stone, If someone wants to come to USA and work and then go onto another country and work I am quite sure the majority of Americas would be "Good" with that, and not have issues.

Maybe the main reason is everyone wants to come to USA, and uses others countries as their Plan "B".

Western Culture especially USA it is business practice to do whatever it takes to get ahead, I see it day in and day out.

5cats · Jun 27, 2009

I think the main reason people get annoyed is when people are not honest about their intentions plus the amount of effort it takes to get them into the workforce and when people are not staying for a decent time to "pay back". That goes for every country and employer.

If you invest a load of money and work getting people into the country and into the workforce you want them to stay for a certain period of time to make it worth it.

That's the reason quite a few recruiters in the States have those unbelievable high penalties in place, if you leave earlier. Because people abused the system too often. So no, not everybody in the States is happy when they are used as a stepping stone, people got the greencard and left the emloyer that sponsored them, you don't think that employer is happy, eh?

I won't be surprised if the canadian healthregions will have those penalties in place in the future.

5cats

Itzallgood · Jun 28, 2009

So no, not everybody in the States is happy when they are used as a stepping stone, people got the greencard and left the emloyer that sponsored them, you don't think that employer is happy, eh?

It's part of the game of owning and operating a business.

It why the employeers take the lions share of the money in the business realtionship between employee and employer.

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Jun 28, 2009

It's part of the game of owning and operating a business.
It why the employeers take the lions share of the money in the business realtionship between employee and employer.

My understanding that the Canadian Health System is a government entity not a business, so when these nurses leave to go to the USA they are really hurting every Canadian citizen, not a large for profit health organization. Also when they apply to work in Canada ( I believe this is true please correct me though) the nurse is apply for permanent residency and enjoys all the rights and responsibilities).

Perhaps Canadians should treat foreign nurses who have no plans on immigrating like Middle Eastern Countries, put them in a compound and limit their rights, and then when their contract is up they can leave, no hard feelings on anybody's part.

5cats · Jun 28, 2009

The visa varies Alex, the guys who came as a group came and come with a TWP, if they don't pass CRNE or the employer is otherwise unhappy they have to leave the country after the visa expires (normally 1 year). But the goal obviously is that they stay longer then that either with an extended TWP or then as a permanent resident.

If too many of them should decide that Canada is not their country, recruiting practise will probably reviewed.

Itzallgood: About the "game", problem is, is does hit back to the employees or future employees, why do you think tourist visas are getting more and more denied, and cancelation fees are creeping up. Those people might not hurt themselves but the others that follow. And in Canada Alex is absolutely right, it's tax money that was spent.

So when 4 out of 5 like in Fionas example leave before the contract is even over, that leaves bad feelings and make it very hard for the people that follow.

5cats

Itzallgood · Jun 28, 2009

I am talking about USA.

I really have no interest or concern regarding Canada. Canada is just a dot on the map as far as World events, Sorry if I offend but it is what it is.

Nurse!Nurse!Hello? · Jun 29, 2009

americans don't have issues with with people using it as a stepping stone, if someone wants to come to usa and work and then go onto another country and work i am quite sure the majority of americas would be "good" with that, and not have issues. maybe the main reason is everyone wants to come to usa, and uses others countries as their plan "b". western culture especially usa it is business practice to do whatever it takes to get ahead, i see it day in and day out.

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originally posted by 5cats so no, not everybody in the states is happy when they are used as a stepping stone, people got the greencard and left the emloyer that sponsored them, you don't think that employer is happy, eh? (and then the following reponse... )

it's part of the game of owning and operating a business. it why the employeers take the lions share of the money in the business realtionship between employee and employer.

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i am talking about usa. i really have no interest or concern regarding canada. canada is just a dot on the map as far as world events, sorry if i offend but it is what it is.

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wow! who haven't you offended?? :nono:

for someone with as much cynicism and disdain for western culture as you apparently have, i am surprised that you would move here, or encourage others to move here.

if you can't stand the host, don't go to the party...

Silverdragon102, BSN · Jun 29, 2009

I am talking about USA.
I really have no interest or concern regarding Canada. Canada is just a dot on the map as far as World events, Sorry if I offend but it is what it is.

You have offended many and there was no reason for it.

I really do not see why you think it is OK to abuse another country and use it as a stepping stone for the US.

Silverdragon102, BSN · Jun 29, 2009

Alex there are a couple of routes that nurses can take into Canada and this link should explain it, most come on Temp Work Permit and then apply for permanent residency but even then they can not apply for TN visa as you need to be a citizen to meet that criteria

CIC work temporarily in Canada

CIC immigrate to Canada