I've been sick with pneumonia x 12 days and through this illness my left ear has plugged up, loud roaring noise and definately don't hear as well on the left side.
I went to the ENT today and have fluid behind the ear drum and had a hearing test which showed a significant hearing loss due to damage to the auditory nerve which Dr. ENT says was caused by the virus which caused the pneumonia. We don't know what caused the pneumonia, but whatever. I do trust him.
He suggested a shot of depo-medrol. I said "do you have a licensed person who can give me that shot?" His eyes got big and serious and said "Why?". I said "because I prefer a licensed person draw up my meds and give me the injection". He said "well I can give it to you but I haven't given one in years and my best MA gives shots every single day, we give alot of depo-medrol in this office. I said "Ok". He did not like me asking that question and was kinda flippant saying she gives shots every single day.
MA comes in the room and I asked her what her experience was and she said she had been in the Army as a medic x 12 years and had alot of experience and understood my concern. I told her "well you know alot of MA's think they are nurses, say they are nurses and they are not. I went to school for 4 years to be able to say I'm a nurse and I really have a problem with MA's who don't understand their scope of practice". She didn't say too much other than so you are a nurse? and she added I won't let an MA draw my blood so I know how you feel.
She gave a good shot, I didn't even feel it. I felt justified in asking the doctor for a licensed person even though he didn't appreciate it. If for nothing else so he knows that some people do object to unlicensed persons giving them injections.
I told her "well you know alot of MA's think they are nurses, say they are nurses and they are not. I went to school for 4 years to be able to say I'm a nurse and I really have a problem with MA's who don't understand their scope of practice".
There's a difference between looking out for yourself and being downright arrogant and condescending. I have worked with plenty of motivated idiots who somehow make it through nursing school and pass the NCLEX, too. It wouldn't surprise me if that MA was making that stuff up just to play along and make you feel better about the shot.
MAs don't necessarily get 12 months of school, at least not where I am. The reason why experience can be downplayed is because it is a subjective thing. Someone can have 12 years experience in a job and be a flipping moron. Experience doesn't guarantee competence either. It just means in some cases that you managed to fly under the radar enough so you don't get fired.
Now, me personally, I wouldn't have even felt the need to justify my opinion to the doc or the MA..Just would have said, "Doctor, I want a licensed person to give me my shot" gotten my injection and left. If the doc didn't like it, too freakin' bad.
I don't feel in the least unprofessional asking for a licensed person to give me an injection. I believe that's my right to do so. I am no fan of MA's who insist on impersonating nurses but this thread is not about MA's. It's about my rights to ask for a licensed nurse....
I have to agree with you there Dutch, as a patient you are not obligated to be a professional.
I have had some issues with MAs; calling themselves nurses for example. But I have had some darned good, painless injections and blood draws done by MAs too. If they do a lot of them, they tend to get very proficient at it.
In all fairness I have to say that I have never been harmed by an MA. Insulted maybe, but not harmed. I have however been harmed by an RN. That license is no guarantee as to competency or character.
When the wife and I were doing the invitro thing, I had to give her a whole bunch of shots. And I have had zero training on how to do it. I just read the pamphlet they gave us. One of our neighbors was a nurse and she offered to do it. After one time my wife came back to me and said I did them better (read painless) than the nurse did. Imagine that, a cop giving better injections than a nurse! (just kidding)
So even with my misgivings about MAs, getting injections from them is not something I would worry about.
But it's your health and peace of mind, and you are the one paying the bill. You have every right to make your health concerns known. I'm glad you had the nerve to speak up about it.
It sounds to me like if you were satisfied with the MA's explanation of her experience, you may well have stopped there. The onslaught of accusation about MA's who portray themselves as nurses was unnecessary for your purposes.
I would be very upset if I walked into a patient's room and their first words to me were a questioning of my education, licensing, and experience, followed up by a long spouting about how some nurses think they're doctors, and really we all just need to pay more attention to our scope of practice and know our place.
It was ok to ask but not socially acceptable or wise, I'd say, to do so. You were ill, not at your best.
I do understand where you are coming from on the issue, though. We worked so hard for our licenses and it is not only illegal but also rubs us very much the wrong way when someone says she is a nurse but is really not.
It's ironic how most of us here, probably, feel the same way you do but don't have the courage to speak up. Weeping again.
Weeping.......I think enough threads have been done about how nurses feel when those that are not nurses call themselves nurses....the point here was this MA did NOT claim to be a nurse and I think that the MA was made to feel like she was less than nothing by the RN with the degree when the MA was doing nothing wrong.
Specializes in cardiac/critical care/ informatics.
It was ok to ask but not socially acceptable or wise, I'd say, to do so. You were ill, not at your best.
I do understand where you are coming from on the issue, though. We worked so hard for our licenses and it is not only illegal but also rubs us very much the wrong way when someone says she is a nurse but is really not.
It's ironic how most of us here, probably, feel the same way you do but don't have the courage to speak up. Weeping again.
I did ask an MA once if she was a nurse and her reply "I am Jack of all trades"
Weeping.......I think enough threads have been done about how nurses feel when those that are not nurses call themselves nurses....the point here was this MA did NOT claim to be a nurse and I think that the MA was made to feel like she was less than nothing by the RN with the degree when the MA was doing nothing wrong.
I second that WOW.
Poor MA, must be nice to know it all.
Dutch posted this for some feed back, but I don't think she deserve being bashed. So she didn't handle it well, and if you had read the thread you would have seen that she herself said that in hindsight that she could have handled it differently.
I agree it is frustrating as some MA's do protray themselves as a nurse, not right. But alas another thread.
No we don't. I just want feedback on asking the doctor for a licensed person to give me an injection? Would they? Wouldn't they? Do they think it inappropriate to ask? etc...
I stopped my doc's assistant from giving me what she thought was a vaccine I needed for my travel job. Only because I'm a nurse did I recognize the vial she brought in and was drawing up... it was B12. I told her she had the wrong vial, and she argued with me, telling me she gave these "all the time". I asked her to read the vial again. She again argued, then rolled her eyes and read the vial. Took off out of the room and returned with another vial. I asked to see it myself before she drew it up. That time she didn't argue.
I'm sorry, but I think you very unprofessional. I'm surprised you didn't ask the Doc if he was board certified.
Just my .02$
Aside from whether what she said to the MA and doc was tactful (sorry Dutchie, I think what was said to the MA was a bit much), there was no need for her to be "professional". She was the patient.
Aside from whether what she said to the MA and doc was tactful (sorry Dutchie, I think what was said to the MA was a bit much), there was no need for her to be "professional". She was the patient.
I disagree. If she had represented herself as a *patient* who was requesting an licensed practitioner, she would not have needed to be "professional." However, she took it further and represented herself as a *nurse*. Whenever someone does that, they should act in a professional manner, because to NOT do so makes all of us look bad.
My father will only see a doctor. Not the doc's PA, not his ARNP. Consequently, he waits weeks and weeks to see a doc for less than 5 minutes, and then he gripes about the short visit. My mother prefers to see the ARNP in that office; gets in pretty quickly, and doesn't feel rushed. If you get hung up on the letters behind the name, you run the risk of missing the forest for the trees, don't you?
I understand your hesitancy to accept an injection of a powerful medication from an unlicensed staff member whose qualifications were unknown to you. That is not meant to trash MA's in any way. I think we have all known excellent MAs and and lousy MDs, RNs and LPNs. Education and licensure do not guarantee comeptence, but they exist to protect the public by assuring that practicing professionals have met minimum standandards of education and knowledge.
The same can't be said (in most states) for MAs. Their education is not standardized and their practice is not regulated in most states. Some are educated in formal programs and certified by the state. Others are hired off the street and given on-the-job training only. One physician I know had his high-school drop-out daughter working in his office. I understand that MAs practice on the license of their employing physician. But a physician "taking responsibility" for his/her MAs practice does nothing to establish the knowledge base or educational preparation of the MA. It simply means that you have someone to sue if the MA makes a mistake. I also think that those of us who have spent the majority of our careers working in hospitals tend to question MAs providing care in a doctor's office that they would be deemed unqualified to perform across the street at the hospital.
I think it is perfectly appropriate for a patient to ask for information on the credentials of those providing care, and to request a substitute caregiver if those credentials are not satisfactory to the patient.
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tater.jake
136 Posts
There's a difference between looking out for yourself and being downright arrogant and condescending. I have worked with plenty of motivated idiots who somehow make it through nursing school and pass the NCLEX, too. It wouldn't surprise me if that MA was making that stuff up just to play along and make you feel better about the shot.