HHA working as a LPN

[hha77]

Hi.

Question for you nurses out there: Can a HHA fill in for a LPN?

I work in a Class F facility (assisted living/memory care) in Minnesota, and we have been shown how to pass meds. I'm comfortable with that. I have no license or education. was trained on the job. Anyways... Just recently I was asked to fill in the LPN shift. I said I didn't feel comfortable and the executive director of the building-not the RN said to me, "Well you have been trained to pass meds" my response was that I didn't feel comfortable with the other responsibilities of the Lpn, and I don't know the tenants' normal blood pressures, how to fax the dr., order meds..etc. She continued to tell me that this time i was excused but from now on it is mandated that the HHA'S fill in for LPN'S when needed. and also sence we are a class f facility that no staff is allowed to practice their license and must always call 911. well I would hate to call 911 if not neccesary. I'm assuming all would be ok because of the new adult vunalbility act-that the Rn must be on call at all times-but there's those certain occasions she doesn't answer. if i was trained in to be the LPn i would feel more comfortable-but then why even hire LPN's???? Is this right? I chked the rules on the board of nursing website and a RN can train unlicensed hha to pass self administered meds-but to be a lpn?? and not get the wage of an lpn.

input would be greatly appreciated!!

[SaraO'Hara]

Run away. You may have been taught to pass meds, but you weren't trained to assess patients. You might end up toast if anything goes wrong.

[cjcsoon2bnp, MSN, RN, NP]

Hi.

Question for you nurses out there: Can a HHA fill in for a LPN?

I work in a Class F facility (assisted living/memory care) in Minnesota, and we have been shown how to pass meds. I'm comfortable with that. I have no license or education. was trained on the job. Anyways... Just recently I was asked to fill in the LPN shift. I said I didn't feel comfortable and the executive director of the building-not the RN said to me, "Well you have been trained to pass meds" my response was that I didn't feel comfortable with the other responsibilities of the Lpn, and I don't know the tenants' normal blood pressures, how to fax the dr., order meds..etc. She continued to tell me that this time i was excused but from now on it is mandated that the HHA'S fill in for LPN'S when needed. and also sence we are a class f facility that no staff is allowed to practice their license and must always call 911. well I would hate to call 911 if not neccesary. I'm assuming all would be ok because of the new adult vunalbility act-that the Rn must be on call at all times-but there's those certain occasions she doesn't answer. if i was trained in to be the LPn i would feel more comfortable-but then why even hire LPN's???? Is this right? I chked the rules on the board of nursing website and a RN can train unlicensed hha to pass self administered meds-but to be a lpn?? and not get the wage of an lpn.

input would be greatly appreciated!!

Run run as fast as you can... you can't catch me I'm the ....

Wait, wrong rhyme... Well anyway, what they are asking you to do is not only dangerous but illegal. If you ever hope to become an LPN/LVN or an RN someday (or you just don't want to get sued or end up in jail) then you should leave this facility as soon as possible and don't look back.

!Chris

[Moogie]

I agree with others---this is putting an unfair responsibility onto you, leaving you liable and, if you would act in this role, you would be in violation of the Minnesota Nurse Practice Act.

I also think a call to MN Department of Human Services might be in order. You need to report this facility for trying to make you work beyond the scope of your training.

[caliotter3]

There is a famous saying about licensed nurses and CNA/HHAs: (From the standpoint of the RN/LPN: "I can do your job, but you can't do mine!" You are just as capable of being charged with practicing without a license as anyone else. Run, don't walk, away from there. And report that place to the authorities. Good luck.

[luvmy2angels]

I couldn't agree more with the posts above!! Not only do you need to get out, but you need to report the facility!! They are putting their residents AND workers at risk!! Good luck !!

[classicdame, MSN, EdD]

Against the law in my state for anyone to do the duties of a licensed nurse without being licensed. I would report them.

[nyhoneydew]

In some states they do have what is called a Med Tech which you do all the same things as a nurse but you still have to be trained and certified to do so. I know of a few facilities who offer jobs like these but being asked to work as an LPN without being an LPN in not OK anything could happen and of course the place you work for would cover their butts before covering yours. Be careful with these types of situations. I was once fired from a job because of the same situation but I was working as a cna in an Assisted living situation I was only on orientation when the DON asked me to take a complete unit to myself and administer meds umm don't think so. In the end even though I got fired for pointing out that it was against the law they were eventually closed down because family members found out what was going on and reported it. And you know what happend to the nurses....not good. So if you are intending on furthering your education don't get caught up with things that could destroy that.

[VivaLasViejas, ASN, RN]

I don't know what the laws are in the state where the OP lives, but I'm reasonably certain that no state permits unlicensed assistive personnel to "fill in" for an LPN or RN.

I'm the DNS for a 90-unit ALF, and a good part of my job is to train medication assistants and delegate certain nursing tasks to them, even giving sub-q injections and performing trach care. There's a world of difference in our designations, however, and NEVER would an unlicensed person be allowed---let alone expected!---to practice outside his or her scope. Not only could s/he be charged with practicing nursing without a license, which is a CRIME, but likely would never be allowed to obtain a license, even if s/he wanted to do so at some point in life.

I agree with the others who have posted here: The OP needs to RUN, not walk, away from that facility and make a report to the State authority which licenses elder care residences. This is unbelievably dangerous for all concerned, and that building needs to be closed down and the residents moved to safer communities. Shame on those who would exploit elderly people and the workers who care for them......this sort of thing makes all facilities look bad, and makes our jobs that much harder because families have heard horror stories like this and are understandably afraid of something similar happening to their loved ones.

I wish the OP luck. She's going to need it.