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Here is an idea for you

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Q.

Specializes in LDRP; Education. Has 7 years experience.

Chili

I am desperately trying to stay on topic here but I have to ask this question again.

You are telling me that because you know some police officers who are content with their pay, that nurses should be? Can you please explain to me how that MAKES ANY SENSE?????

Let's find some parallels here to show you how ridiculous your argument is.

Kristina (Kday) wants to have children - therefore, I should also.

My husband enjoys his line of work - therefore, I should also.

A friend of mine lives with an abusive boyfriend - well because I also live in an abusive relationship, I think she has NOTHING to complain about because my situation is just as bad. (this is hypothetical)

Do you see what I mean? Like I said, there are more issues than just pay. Nurses are fighting for better working conditions as well, and for recruitment. Nursing is losing it's workforce and one way to attract new people is with adequate compensation, especially for working harder and longer.

Again, I beg you that until you've walked a mile in our shoes, I would just not say another word about this for fear that you may get bashed.

Originally posted by mustangsheba:

Re: Nurses buying hospitals. The Sisters of Providence have done fairly well. I'm not sure what the actual hierarchy is, but they are still Catholic based hospitals with nuns in administrative positions. One other thing that would save us a ton of money is to have our own medical insurance. There are approximately 2.5 million nurses in the U.S. Seems like we should have our own insurance and retirement that would follow us wherever we go, which would mean we wouldn't have to use these at the bargaining table. I know there must be a nurse out there with a head for business that knows about insurance. What do you think?

Great Idea !!! on that insurance and retirement concept. Where is the ANA and our local state associations on this?

I somewhat think the employer supplying insurance and retirement lessens our individual responsiblities and accountability.

In addition, it becomes a barginning chip used in negotiations. This divides the nurses within an association and lessens the unity. Some want more money, heck with the insurance and retirement, others demand better insurance and retirement. Thus we remain divided and our message is mixed.

Not sure the hospitals and health systems would give either up. It would cause the nurses to be more united and that's not good. Also,

the retirement accounts have a dual purpose for the health system. Increasing their finacial picture and worth on paper.

the insurance would cause difficulty by reducing the insurance pool in purchasing employee insurance. This would cause the adminstration to pay more for their insurance. I doubt they would support "that" concept.

Great idea, count me in !

Where's an insurance agent when you need one?? wink.gif

Originally posted by Susy K:

Navy Nurse,

You echo my husband's thoughts. He always said, with how numerous our profession is (something in the millions nationwide) - if every nurse gave 5 dollars, we would have money to start buying out hospital after hospital after hospital......

There is an organization similar to that concept in Milwaukee. A large clinic conglomerate is owned and operated entirely by physicians. It allows them the control they want and need - not to mention these are the happiest group of physicians I have ever worked with.

Susy, I work in a physician owned surgery center and I can tell you are docs are very happy. I know of one that received a 90k bonus at Christmas time. The pay scale here sucks, sucks, sucks...

Originally posted by mustangsheba:

Re: Nurses buying hospitals. The Sisters of Providence have done fairly well. I'm not sure what the actual hierarchy is, but they are still Catholic based hospitals with nuns in administrative positions. One other thing that would save us a ton of money is to have our own medical insurance. There are approximately 2.5 million nurses in the U.S. Seems like we should have our own insurance and retirement that would follow us wherever we go, which would mean we wouldn't have to use these at the bargaining table. I know there must be a nurse out there with a head for business that knows about insurance. What do you think?

Hi mustangsheba. I've only got a little time before retiring for the night, but I felt your post was well worth responding to. Like the previous poster indicated, you offer a great solution for those of us who tend to tie ourselves to a particular employer because of the need for good health and medical insurance. I will write that I have received different offers in the mail to sign up for portable commercial medical insurance.

What has stopped me from signing up directly with these commercial insurers is that I don't feel they offer the type of discounts and coverage I have become accustomed to under employer sponsored insurance such as discounts for the use of certain facilities, services, and providers and dental and vision coverage. Also, I'm not sure how much coverage I would get with pharmaceuticals.

I admit I've had fairly good experiences with health insurance through my employers over the years. I've purchased other types of insurance directly from a commercial carrier such as life and Liability Insurance in the past that I felt met my needs.

We need to find a commercial carrier that would be willing to work with nurses as a group and provide us comprehensive insurance including coverage for wellness at rates and benefits we helped design.

Wonder what the effects would be if nurses, especially FT staff did not have to work year round as many teachers don't? Wonder if our employers where required to give us off one to three months of each year, and rotate these times among each nurse? Would there not be some long term economic benefits from this move in the long run? Maybe less call ins and injuries from the affected nurses? Less turnover? This action of course would be coupled with increased pay, reduced patient ratio, and improved work environment. Nurses you think we can run a hospital on this type of schedule?

Re: Nurses buying hospitals. The Sisters of Providence have done fairly well. I'm not sure what the actual hierarchy is, but they are still Catholic based hospitals with nuns in administrative positions. One other thing that would save us a ton of money is to have our own medical insurance. There are approximately 2.5 million nurses in the U.S. Seems like we should have our own insurance and retirement that would follow us wherever we go, which would mean we wouldn't have to use these at the bargaining table. I know there must be a nurse out there with a head for business that knows about insurance. What do you think?

Susy K,

I can assure you that a little bashing doesnt scare me. I posed a very simple question one that required a very simple answer.

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Nursing assistant

Navy Nurse-I agree with all your points. But I disagree about strikes-they can definitely accomplish long term changes, as is seen throughout the history of organized labor. Nursing strikes are still in their infancy, however, and it will take time to see lasting benefits, but i believe it will happen. The MNM was/is a great idea, but unfortunately I am reading of some irregularities, which is so sad. I really feel for those who worked so hard and were deceived as well. However, your idea of nurse owned and run hospitals is a great one. We would need an organized group with power to start the ball rolling-UAN comes to mind. The ANA might actually also be a possibility, as I see a very slight but definite shift to the plight of the staff nurse.

chili-will you please stop harping on this question of nurses'pay? RNs are paid better than CNAs because we are licensed, with all the inherent responsibilities that go with licensure, as well as educatedin nursing, with all the knowledge that is gained with that education. CNAs are neither-no matter if they hold degrees in another field!

As far as RNs complaining about their pay-when you are an RN then you have the right to comment because you will have full knowledge of what you are talking about. But until then, why do you persist in obscuring the stated topics with your nonsense?

Chile;

WE are well paid compared to other professionals? WHAT other professions are you referring to?

I'm an LPN in Minnesota and make just under $30G/year - 10 years experience. I'm working on my RN and can expect another $6G/year entry level and MN is one of the higher paying places that I've scouted out on the net. It's also a $#%^ expensive place to live, relatively. I don't get paid one penny extra for the fact that I've completed 2/3 of my RN degree and all that science, anat and phys has come in darn handy sometimes...

Sound like a lot? Go through a quarter of nursing school or a quarter of college to qualify - no guarantees you'll you'll make it. Pay for that yourself. No guarantees.

I realize that while you're lifting pts that are kicking and fighting you, the nurse's job, walking cooley down the hall with a hand full of pills or a BP cuff may look easy by comparison, but she/he didn't get there by by simply filling out an application and taking a 6 week course.

In truth, you have no idea of the responsibility that goes along with the title of 'Nurse'. I've never met one that thought they were paid commensurately with their responsibilites.

Of course NA's are important and I admire those that are good at their job and want to stay there. A good aide on the shift is worth her weight in gold but, but. They aren't nurses. Walk a mile....get there first.

I was trying to make the point that nurses work in the human services. Their work is helping other people. Most people who work in human services do it for more than just the money.

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Nursing assistant

Q.

Specializes in LDRP; Education. Has 7 years experience.

And most of us do Chili. But those moments that we crave or love are GONE. We cannot connect with our patients they way CNA's can at times. We have too many patients, too many support staff to watch over, too many orientees. Not enough nurses.

To attract more nureses, seeing as the altruism is GONE, we want a more fair compensation. Also one comensurate with experience.

chili-if your point is that people who work in human services do it for the patients and shouldn't complain about the money they are paid, then you should stop complaining about a nursing assistant's salary. After all, isn't there more to YOUR job than money?

Historically, hospitals obtained nursing services for free because student nurses did most of the work while graduate nurses were paid a pittance to supervise them. Few women continued to work once they had families, and men were virtually unknown in nursing. However, as Susy pointed out, times have changed. Women no longer work simply to "keep busy" until a man comes alomg to support them. Today, we support ourselves, our children, sometimes our husbands (or wives) and even need to help with elderly parents. Most families can no longert live on one salary. People don't want to become nurses for little compensation-especially after spending time and money on education.

I think you have amply "made your point", here as well as in several other posts. But now it is time to stop pointing out how much nurses make compared to nursing assistants. As someone else said, it's comparing apples to oranges.

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