Helping patients kill themselves

[Cwoods]

Colorado is now the 5th state to adopt a form of physician-assisted suicide.

O' wait, I said that the wrong way... "Death with dignity" or "Right to die"

What do you think about the law?

Will it, at some point in the future, fall into NPs hands?

Apparently, insurance companies in California feel great about denying a terminally ill mother costly chemo tx and offering to subsidize a life-ending treatment for $1.20.

Can you imagine? I could potentially extend my life, again for my children, for a few months but bankrupt my family or I could end it all for the cost of a cheeseburger...

Assisted-suicide law prompts insurance company to deny coverage to terminally ill California woman - Washington Times

[BCgradnurse, MSN, RN, NP]

I fully support allowing terminally ill patients to choose the time of their death. I am a firm believer in quality over quantity of life. There are many circumstances in which cessation of treatment does not equal cessation of suffering, and pain cannot be relieved adequately. I don't believe there is value to suffering. I think it dehumanizes people and takes a horrible toll on body, mind, and spirit. I would have no issues with helping a patient who is of sound mind, or has expressed and documented their wishes, to end their life. I would consider it a privilege to honor their wishes.

[offlabel]

What's the "European model"? The United Kingdom, France, Spain, Italy, Portugal, Greece, Ireland, Andorra, San Marino, Liechtenstein, Monaco, The Vatican City, Luxembourg, Switzerland, The Netherlands, Belgium, Austria, Croatia, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Montenegro, Kosovo, The Czech Republic, Moldova, Bulgaria, Malta, Hungary, Romania, Poland, The Ukraine, Russia, Belarus, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland and Iceland hardly share a common model.

OP, I too find your title inflammatory. How about "advocating for and supporting patients who no longer wish to suffer excruciating and pointless physical and spiritual/existential agony and who express the desire to make an autonomous choice to put an end to their suffering"?

.

The European model of Euthanasia/assisted suicide is being defined primarily in the Netherlands, Switzerland and Belgium. There are others, but these are the big three, I think. There are provisions in the works for individuals with no medical problems whatsoever to receive assistance from doctors to end their lives. Moreover, patients, even children, have been euthanized there without their consent or knowledge.

No one that isn't a sociopath wants to see anyone suffer, ever. Even some sociopaths don't care one way or the other. That isn't the question, especially given the advances in acute and chronic pain control.

The problem is moving a restorative, healing entity that is medicine to an area where intentionally and deliberately ending lives is normalized and institutionalized.

This is not a small deal however well intentioned it is. It is not medicine and it is not nursing. It is wholly something other.

[Purrsx2]

Moreover, patients, even children, have been euthanized there without their consent or knowledge.

I would be very interested to see your source of this information.

Thanks in advance.

[SentinelTruth]

Ladies and Gentleman, I think this is a sticky topic... as a future nurse with only few weeks time left in my schooling, I think people need to be cognizant of the fact that some people have issues due to their religious background. If I were a NP, PA, or Physician, I couldn't write the prescription and If active, full-on euthanasia were ever allowed in this country, I would not do it. I stand before God first. If a person wants to end it, they need to find a means outside of the health system. Or providers that are willing. God help us if the Government ever mandates us to do this.

Yes, I'm all for autonomy... within reason. I'm not about to hand the patient their pills to end their life.

[Buyer beware, BSN]

Please "kill" me so I can die in peace and not be subjected to being exploited as some kind of inanimate, putrid political football.

Stay out of my end of life decisions or any other deeply personal decisions.

They don't affect you and they're none of anyone's meddling business.

I'm not asking anyone to pay a dime towards the "death" drugs either or assist in squat.

I've seem to many people covered in decubiti with all the rest rotting away all so some slug family member could continue to cash the SS check.

You know the type "I want everything done or else!"

[offlabel]

I would be very interested to see your source of this information.

Thanks in advance.

Glad to oblige...took about 4 seconds in a google search...you'll note that these are mainstream media outlets, not some obscure fanatic religious web site. Pretty easy to find actually.

Belgium Approves Euthanasia For Children

Belgium euthanasia: First child dies - CNN.com

The right to die in Belgium: An inside look at the world's most liberal euthanasia law | PBS NewsHour

[offlabel]

And as for you having to participate in someone else's choice - if you know that's something you're probably going to have to do in your job (and there are very, very, very few nurses that will be involved in supporting medical assistance in dying, so you would know), then you're in the wrong place and should probably move on.

You've proved my point perfectly, thanks. But I was here before all of this was a "thing". What if I don't want to move on and just want to do the part of my job that doesn't involve intentionally bringing about the death of someone that is ill?

The patient gets to choose to end their life but I don't get to choose anything but to leave?

[Jules A, MSN]

What if I don't want to move on and just want to do the part of my job that doesn't involve intentionally bringing about the death of someone that is ill?

The patient gets to choose to end their life but I don't get to choose anything but to leave?

Yes if that is the change that is approved and now considered part of your job as with any other new policy that might come about uninvited. Unfortunately there are times when we have to leave a job we once enjoyed for a multitude of reasons or we can stay for decades as so many nurses seem to do and make everyone we come in contact with miserable.

[offlabel]

Yes if that is the change that is approved and now considered part of your job as with any other new policy that might come about uninvited. Unfortunately there are times when we have to leave a job we once enjoyed for a multitude of reasons or we can stay for decades as so many nurses seem to do and make everyone we come in contact with miserable.

So the whole "don't force your morality on me" argument only works one way? Just asking, because if this is the road we're going to go down, the prevailing morality is subject to change with whomever is in charge and the folks currently saying "sorry, you need to go now", may one day be the ones being asked to leave their livelihood behind.

The irony is that they will have been the ones responsible for the mindset that if you disagree with current conventional wisdom, you leave.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

Allowing to die and bringing about death are very different things. As to the "don't impose your values" canard on those that have an ethical objection to euthanasia and abortion, I'd ask the same of those that don't.

The delusional denial of the inevitable fall back position of "euthanasia is cheaper than treatment" is demonstrably false in "right to die" states. It's cheaper to die and insurance companies EOB's demonstrate that and implicitly encourage it.

If the European model is any indication, and there is no reason to think it won't become conventional wisdom here, participation in abortion and euthanasia will become compulsory for providers in certain specialty areas. It is already that way in many parts of the US with regard to abortion.

So much for "choice".

Are you saying providers are now forced to do abortions and/or terminate life for patients who choose to die because they are very and irreversibly ill - like with severe neuro illnesses, horrendous pain, and the like?

I was not aware that anyone was forced to do abortions or prescribe suicide or forced to actively end a patient's life.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

Please "kill" me so I can die in peace and not be subjected to being exploited as some kind of inanimate, putrid political football.

Stay out of my end of life decisions or any other deeply personal decisions.

They don't affect you and they're none of anyone's meddling business.

I'm not asking anyone to pay a dime towards the "death" drugs either or assist in squat.

I've seem to many people covered in decubiti with all the rest rotting away all so some slug family member could continue to cash the SS check.

You know the type "I want everything done or else!"

All humanity is affected by such decisions.

That's not to say I haven't seen scenarios such as you describe. Don't let the cash cow die scenarios. There are others, of course, where the sick person is truly loved.

Very tough, these matters.

[Jules A, MSN]

So the whole "don't force your morality on me" argument only works one way? Just asking, because if this is the road we're going to go down, the prevailing morality is subject to change with whomever is in charge and the folks currently saying "sorry, you need to go now", may one day be the ones being asked to leave their livelihood behind.

The irony is that they will have been the ones responsible for the mindset that if you disagree with current conventional wisdom, you leave.

I'm all for you exerting your right to protest, attempt to institute change or whatever especially in the matters of ethical issues however the bottom line is, at least in my state, we are employed at will. I've had employers institute all kinds of policies I didn't appreciate and in the rare instances they were things I considered deal breakers I left. No hard feelings just agreed to disagree and I showed my displeasure with my feet.