helping a friend

Mukfay · Aug 20, 2011

It's a great question (not a dumb one). I had the same question as a volunteer, and never really received a satisfactory answer.

xtxrn, ASN, RN · Aug 20, 2011

I wouldn't. Friendship is all well and good until someone gets p*88ed off..... jmho

applewhitern, BSN, RN · Aug 20, 2011

When my son was placed on hospice (died of cancer) the hospice nurse's took care of everything. Even tho I was an RN, I did not have to do anything medical. They put him on a dilaudid pump that was locked, and they came every day. Personally, I wouldn't get too involved by giving meds if I were you. There should be no need to. Just volunteer to sit with him if the wife needs to leave the house. You can give comfort measures, like helping her turn him, or keeping his oxygen in place, but I would leave the medications to the hospice team.

missLissRn · Aug 20, 2011

Thanks so much for the imput!

i talked to her today, and hospice will only be there about 4 hours a day. she knows she going to need help, since she needs to work (she has already taken a lot of leave due to long hospital stays), and sleep. and generally can't do it alone, his children live to far away to help and she has none. He was dx with stage 4 cancer, a 2 months ago. the doctors didn't even know where it started untill about a month ago.

sad story: they were both divorced, been together about 15 years, last year finally got engaged! he started having back pain. he went to the doc, after many tests, wrong dx's 8 months later, stage 4 cancer. they told him he had about 9 months to a year, with chemo and radiation. they got married right away! on the same day i graduated, i remember this clearly since my mom was suppose to be the maid of honor, (since the wedding had been pushed up because of the dx, my mom attended my graduation instead). then about a 2 weeks ago things got bad.

he had spent the last week in the hosital, and will be coming home on hospice this week. he is confused (to the point he no longer knows who his wife is), and very fidgety, and from what the wife says, keeps trying to get out of bed.

i guess i'm concerned, that the what if she goes to work, or goes to sleep, and he needs one of his meds, am i allowed to give it?

i feel so bad for them, and want to help, but at the same time, i don't want to jepordize mylicense in any way!

Kyrshamarks, BSN, RN · Aug 20, 2011

I am going to say this again. If you feel comfortable helping your mom's friend then do it. I personally would have no fear giving him his meds. It is not like you are prescribing them or getting them from the pharmacy. All you are doing is helping a freind take his pills or liquids. There is no liablilty in doing this, You are not acting out of your scope of practice since technically he is NOT your patient. He is a friend and you are helping him, there is no pay for services being provided to you so you are not acting in the role of a nurse. You were not engaged to do specific acts or specific care other than to sit with him and provide what he needs. There comes a point when we have to say as HUMANS that we have the skills to help this person so let me put aside the petty fears and my own insecuritires and step up to the plate and help this person out.

I know that many will flame me for this but I have been practising nursing now for 25 years and have helped many of my parent's friends and even neighbors and my own friends with the care for loved ones. Never have I feared for my license.

Munch · Aug 20, 2011

This is a tricky question. My father died of pancreatic cancer when I was seventeen(so I barely had a job, let alone working in hospital). We took him home from the hospital on hospice(who are angels by the way but they couldn't be in the house 24/7, but they did set up things he needed like meds, oxygen and other things I can't remember, it was a LONG time ago) One of his MANY medications had to be measured and put into a syringe and the hospice nurse wasn't around and no one else knew how to do it. One of our neighbors was and still is a clinical nurse and we called her to see if she could help. She was at our house in a new york minute, measuring the medication, put it in the syringe and gave the shot to him(and she would come over a few other times to help ) I am not sure if what she did was ethical, but it did make my dad feel better, no one was hurt and my neighbor never lost her job or even got in trouble(of course no one the hospital she was helping us) But I don't even think it would have been a problem if someone did find out, it's not like she was taking the medication from the hospital she was working a anyway and she will never know how much she helped us during those times.

xtxrn, ASN, RN · Aug 20, 2011

I am going to say this again. If you feel comfortable helping your mom's friend then do it. I personally would have no fear giving him his meds. It is not like you are prescribing them or getting them from the pharmacy. All you are doing is helping a freind take his pills or liquids. There is no liablilty in doing this, You are not acting out of your scope of practice since technically he is NOT your patient. He is a friend and you are helping him, there is no pay for services being provided to you so you are not acting in the role of a nurse. You were not engaged to do specific acts or specific care other than to sit with him and provide what he needs. There comes a point when we have to say as HUMANS that we have the skills to help this person so let me put aside the petty fears and my own insecuritires and step up to the plate and help this person out.
I know that many will flame me for this but I have been practising nursing now for 25 years and have helped many of my parent's friends and even neighbors and my own friends with the care for loved ones. Never have I feared for my license.

Sometimes it's not about the loss of a license, but of a friendship....it's not always about nursing in this situation- that can be the problem...Not everything is a legal situation. :)

Kyrshamarks, BSN, RN · Aug 20, 2011

Freindship is not about being there when they are up, but rather being there when they are down and only you can help them. That is being a friend

rn/writer, RN · Aug 20, 2011

If you really don't want to do this, be honest and say that you don't. But if that's not the issue, then think this through logically. Also, be prepared to set whatever limits you feel comfortable with so that you are not the only one being depended upon to give every med he needs when hospice can't be there.

As far as the legalities, it's good to be protective of your license, but it's also good to have a sense of balance.

How about instead of thinking you're giving the meds, you reframe it as helping the gentleman take his meds.

You're not prescribing. You're not employed. You're his neighbor, not his nurse.

If you still feel ill at ease, ask your state BON (although it might take a while to get through to someone).

missLissRn · Aug 20, 2011

Thank you all again so much for your comments and advice!

Just 3 years ago my step-father passed away from cancer, and my mother and I were his care givers (by the end mom really couldn't do much of the "care" she was so emotionally drained all she could do was sit by his bedside and cry). After a very long sleepless week for me (juggling nursing school in the day, running home to see my kids for a few hours, then back to mom's to care for him, 2 weeks away from finals, so finishing up end of semester school work) we finally had hired an aid to come in at night to sit with him for a few hours so I could get some sleep. but the aid couldn't give his meds, so the first night the aid came, i was so happy i could finally go home and get a little sleep! I was preparing the meds for the night and labeling them (they had to be crushed and mixed with water in syringes, because he could no long swollow the pills) leaving my brother with instructions when to give them, and the aid came out of the room to tell me he passed.

I guess this "flash back" made me question the entire medication thing.

Thanks again for all your support!

rn/writer, RN · Aug 20, 2011

Wow! What a stressful and emotional time for you and your family. I can't imagine going to nursing school, caring for a family, and helping with a terminally ill loved one.

Of course, you're flashing back to that time in your life with a situation so similar before you. I'm glad you were able to express that.

It sounds like you made some kind of connection between your preparation of all the meds and his passing right at that very time. Your head may realize that one had nothing to do with the other, but your heart could still be reeling three years later.

Sounds like you need to talk to someone you trust, first to unburden yourself and have a good cry if you need to, and then to figure out what it is you have to offer. Be honest with yourself. Find out what is needed and what specifically you could help with vs. what others without any medical training can do. If your time is limited, they should save you for the parts a nurse would do best.

Even so, don't overextend yourself in a way you'll regret. Most of us can stretch beyond our normal limits for a little while. But you have other responsibilities. Not to mention that this situation has the potential to recall your stepfather's passing. That could be a good thing if it allows you to express feelings you've been holding in. I'm guessing that might have happened with everything else you had going on.

Once you have assessed what the needs are and what you're prepared to offer, you'll be better able to participate as a friend and neighbor. Be clear as well about anything you don't feel comfortable doing.

Attending a dying patient and his family can be seen as a privilege that few have the opportunity to experience.

I wish you the very best.