Getting Along- The Union Debate

Fonenurse · Feb 21, 2006

I find the difference in people's feelings about unions really fascinating - here in the UK we have a lot of employment law to support us and legislation is often UK wide (although England often has its own, with Wales and Scotland having their own slightly different). The opinion of unions seems different in the USA and people seem far more polarised in the USA than they are in the UK.

What I don't understand is why they are so different - this may be a naive question because I have never been to the states.

I am a union rep in the UK and I guess things are slightly different because the union I belong to, the Royal College of Nursing is also the professional body for nursing in the UK as well as being a union.

Do you have any countrywide legislation, or does a lot of the legislation that affects nurses and nursing only have a state wide remit?

NurseKevin · Feb 22, 2006

It seems to me that this site is vehemently pro-union. If you state that you are against unions there will be a flurry of links to the union websites to support the union position.

One poster also asked about strike nursing agencies and where to find one, so I posted a link...and lo and behold, that thread is gone? Could it be....it was anti-union? There were no insults just straight out facts..

clee1 · Feb 23, 2006

Generally speaking, I am anti-union. When labor unions were established in theis Nation, they were founded out of genuine need, and they did a genuine service to their members.

In the last several decades, unions in general seem to be working for the best interests of its leadership; not it's rank and file. Also, unions have taken to overflexing their muscle, to the detriment of the company, all employees (union or not), and the Nation as a whole.

Having said all of THAT, I really feel that there is a need for wider union membership in the medical field. Many of the problems that exist in the field will only be solved when labor forces management to act; for they surely will not otherwise.

However, for our best long-term interests, we had better not let the monster get out from under control like the UAW and APA have.

allnurses Guide · Feb 23, 2006

I became a nurse at 40. I joined this website shortly thereafter. I had no experience at all in the medical field.

I had to talk with a mentor friend of mine who has been a nurse for 25 years or so after being on here for awhile. I said that I was surprised because my impression after being on here for awhile is that nurses are for the most part liberal, Democrats, pro-union.

She said that in her experience, this wasn't true. So, I dunno . . . maybe this site is just more interesting to liberal nurses.

I'm definitely not ever going to join a union.

steph

James Huffman · Feb 23, 2006

I am relatively new to this board but there seems to be a trend relative to Pro and Anti-Union posts and posters.
Union membership in nursing is on the rise. Still there are more nurses who choose not to orgainize than who do. Will the trend continue to rise to a point where unions hold the majority of nurses as members? Time will tell. If I used this board as a barometer, I would think we are headed down a divided, non-constructive path.
Threads on this board seem to get heated and then closed. Some members use the board to support, without exception, their hardline position about unions. Kinda looks like some have drunk the kool-aide to a point of no return. The first ammendment is a wonderful think but it says nothing about objectivity
As long as we hold the line in one camp- union vs. management, as a profession we remain captive and dependent. It's just not reasonable or rational to think that one or the other is always working for our best interests. We all know horror stories and we can all recite great gains won by unions and facilitated by an employer.
Don't drink the kool-aide. The purple mustache is a dead give-away.

You state that union membership in nursing is on the rise. Could you give a source for that information? I don't have a breakdown for nurses but the general trend is away from union membership: 20.1% of American workers were union members in 1983, while only 12.5% were members in 2005, a number which basically didn't change from 2004. In fact, the number of union members has basically remained flat: there are roughly the same number of union members now as in 1952, while the number of workers has doubled from 50 million to 121 million.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.nr0.htm

Jim Huffman, RN

weirdRN, RN · Feb 23, 2006

Union vs. non-union....

I am a nursing student. I am in my last semester before I go on for my license. I was recently asked in class to decide whether or not nursing is a profession according to an eight concept matrix devised by some nerd from Harvard.

My answer was ultimately that yes, I do believe nursing is a profession, Harvard Nerd assessment aside. However, the assessment did make me think about a lot of things, particularly how my profession is controlled.

So what are Nursing Unions for? and what am I saying by not joining one?

NurseKevin · Feb 24, 2006

Union vs. non-union....
I am a nursing student. I am in my last semester before I go on for my license. I was recently asked in class to decide whether or not nursing is a profession according to an eight concept matrix devised by some nerd from Harvard.
My answer was ultimately that yes, I do believe nursing is a profession, Harvard Nerd assessment aside. However, the assessment did make me think about a lot of things, particularly how my profession is controlled.
So what are Nursing Unions for? and what am I saying by not joining one?

You are merely saying that you do not wish to be a part of the collective, that you can think and negotiate for yourself, and do not need someone else to do it for you.

Nancy2 · Feb 26, 2006

I find the difference in people's feelings about unions really fascinating - here in the UK we have a lot of employment law to support us and legislation is often UK wide (although England often has its own, with Wales and Scotland having their own slightly different). The opinion of unions seems different in the USA and people seem far more polarised in the USA than they are in the UK.
What I don't understand is why they are so different - this may be a naive question because I have never been to the states.
I am a union rep in the UK and I guess things are slightly different because the union I belong to, the Royal College of Nursing is also the professional body for nursing in the UK as well as being a union.
Do you have any countrywide legislation, or does a lot of the legislation that affects nurses and nursing only have a state wide remit?

Here in the USA we are a republic. Our constitution protects the State's rights to Govern themselves. We are country that was founded on Freedom and As Little Government Interference in our lives as possible. The Supreme court will hear cases that it believes may need Federal intervention, but most often will decline to hear cases that it deems are "State Rights" issues. Congress also is supposed to uphold personal liberty for it's constituents while tempering that with laws that "protect the people" Sometimes it is a fine line. That's why it is so important for people to be involved in deciding who they send to "represent" them. If all the liberal, socialist people are involved and the conservative people are not, then we may someday have Socialist labor laws like the UK. In my opinion, I hope that NEVER Happens.

God Bless America!

SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN · Feb 26, 2006

If all the liberal, socialist people are involved and the conservative people are not, then we may someday have Socialist labor laws like the UK. In my opinion, I hope that NEVER Happens.
God Bless America!

Huh? What the heck is a "socialist labor law"?

I'd love to have that national health plan those socialists over there in the UK have, and enough money to get private care as well.

And if there is a God, bless everyone. I don't think a supreme deity has nationalistic tendencies. I sure hope not.

rjflyn, ASN, RN · Feb 26, 2006

One thing to remember if I recall correctlly Brian the owner of this board is in Minnesota. Minnesota is a highly unionized state. Even the clerk at the C-store or the burger flipper down the street probably is a member.

I'm sure I will be corrected if I am wrong. :chair:

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Feb 26, 2006

You are merely saying that you do not wish to be a part of the collective, that you can think and negotiate for yourself, and do not need someone else to do it for you.

This is why i won't ever join a union either. I do not want anyone else speaking for me.