Major venting about some CNA's - page 13
First, let me say that I am not venting against all CNA's or even most...I've been one myself. I know how hard they work. I applaude the good ones. My problem is the majority of the ones at... Read More
Dec 21, '02Occupation: Enterprise Application Systems Analyst Specialty: 27 year(s) of experience in Everything except surgery ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 5,601; Likes: 174Originally posted by mattsmom81
I have found myself very frustrated when facilities decide to assign tasks to CNA's. Personally I prefer doing my own BSG's and vitals as part of my asessment....and prefer to delegate the physical care to CNA's as that is where their primary skills lie.
Some CNA's (many now are called PCT's) get all puffed up about their tasks and prioritize with them...and then refuse to answer lights, help patients, etc. They do their 'tasks' then want to sit/hide in rooms, etc....and get all their breaks and leave on time while the nurse is breakless and OT. I don't tolerate this when I see it in a facility...
If the nurse is clear from the getgo about WHAT is delegated it does a lot to prevent bad attitudes from developing. I try to be VERY clear as to the expectation....if it isn't met I counsel...go to my supervisors...if it still can't be resolved and I'm not supported I must then vote with my feet ... life's too short to waste time in this kind of setting, IMO.
I agree we have a duty to our patients and wise supervision and delegation is part of that duty.
Nurses should not be afraid to make their own rules about what we will delegate...it IS our license after all.
Mattsmom, remember the CNA I posted about who wanted to run things, and tell nurses what to do? Well she is gone now, and now we room our own pts., and I don't have to put up with her attitude, her actions or her mouth! And guess what?? We are handling things just fine without her!
This is not to say I don't agree that many aides have impossible tasks, and are expected to do the impossible. But so are nurses! And if there is a choice between dealing with a CNA who feels I should kiss their behinds for doing their jobs, and or feel they are running things, I would prefer to work by myself!
If I'm working on a unit and the CNA is busy, or even it's another nurse's pt. then I'm going to go and answer that light. Not only because it's the way any team should work, but because there is a person on the other end of the light or call bell, who needs help!
For those nurse's who feels it's the CNA's job to wipe behinds, I seriously question their reasons for being a nurse. I have wiped many behinds, even with the CNA standing right there at the bedside! It makes me NO difference who does the wiping, as long as it gets done! But everytime I get up to assist, that just puts me further behind in taking care of my duties, which are just as important to pt care. If there is only one CNA do to the work of three, then I wouldn't be the CNA working in such a situation.
Unfortuantely I have worked where CNAs who felt I should help them, while they go take a break, or hide out in pts rooms or in the break room. Even had one CNA at the beginning of a shift attempt to lay down on the couch, because all the pts were in bed right in front of me!!!
Another took off his shoes and was hiding out in the telephone booth on the unit!!! This same CNA was sitting with his shoes off, when I walked down the hall trying to discover where the smell was coming from! I located the smell and it was in a room where the CNA had supposedly just did rounds on. I asked him whey the pt.had not been cleaned. His response was that the pt. was ASLEEP!! I instructed him to clean the pt up. He stated ..."While he is asleep??" YESSSSSSSS!!!
Another time we had alarms going off, meaning a pt with a bed alarm had tripped the alarm. I'm running around trying to find out where it's coming from, and the CNA is just sitting there! I asked the CNA if they had heard the alarm. The response was...."Yes...but that is not my problem"!!!!!!!
But I have also worked with CNAs who have my admiration for the jobs they do, and the way they do them! I have encouraged many CNAs to continue their education. I have been impressed by the caring of these CNAs, and their knowledge level, or their desire to learn, and give the best care possible! But I have no patient or feelings for those who feel it's my job to assist them so they can sit on their behinds, or who feel I need to kiss their behinds to get the job done!
To the CNA who feels that nurses should win her respect before doing what she is instructed or delegated to do. If you don't want to take directions, you should find another form of work, where you can be your own boss! Being directed by a licensed nurse is part of your job! That nurse shouldn't have to give you directions with sugar and syrup on top! You're there to assist her...and to take directions. No one should disrespect anyone, but giving directions, and taking them, is part of any job...no matter where you are!
Dec 22, '02Occupation: CNA Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 485; Likes: 15You know, maybe it is just instinct to defend my own, but today I was SO pissed at the CNAS. I was running around like a maniac answering everybody's lights while the other 3 CNAS just stood there doing nothing. One light was going off and no one was moving so I answered it and the poor lady was puking everywhere. It even got on her roomate.I cleaned her up twice and they were still just standing there. I was so pissed. Also, I noticed this:the shifts are 7-3:30, 3-11:30, etc to make up for our lunch. Well, the 7-3 aids stop working at 3 and the 3-11 aids won't start till 3:30. Who ultimately suffers? The patient.
Dec 22, '02Occupation: CNA Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 485; Likes: 15Brownsm...did she get fired? I hope so!
Dec 22, '02Occupation: Enterprise Application Systems Analyst Specialty: 27 year(s) of experience in Everything except surgery ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 5,601; Likes: 174Unfortuantely no! The hospital is still stuck with her, trying to keep her off work comp. They have tried to use her in several areas, but she has a complaint about everywhere they have put her. As a sitter she can't sit because the pt. might get out of bed, and she can't help them because of her bad back... Tried working her as a unit secretary, but she can't sit for long periods...etc, etc.
I think she is bucking for disability, but she walks around just fine putting her two cents into everything!
Who ultimately suffers? The patient.
Dec 22, '02Occupation: Level II Nursery RN Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 265; Likes: 3[QUOTE]Originally posted by michelle95
[I told a CNA that was going to get my blood sugars at 5:30, to wait until at least 6:00 because I didn't feel comfortable giving insulin at 7:00 on a 5:30 accucheck. I had originally told her 6:30, but, after she explained to me that she couldn't at that time, I told her I would compromise and make it 6:00. (Sometimes our patients don't get their breakfast trays until almost 8:00 and 11-7 is responsible for the insulin at 7:00) She flat out refused.
We don't give insulin untill the tray is on the floor.
If I needed something done at a specific time and the CNA couldn't/wouldn't do it, I would do it myself out of concern for the patient. Patient care is more important than a pi$$ing contest.
Dec 23, '02Joined: Jan '02; Posts: 5,673; Likes: 159BB, that is fine if the CNA can't do it...(she is legitimately busy elsewhere) but not if she just WON'T do it... *some* CNA's will take advantage of your easygoing nature...and will use it against you to get out of doing work.
If you cave to to this type's refusal to be team players, they will likely be the types who will be trying to run the NURSES soon.
A good nurse and a good CNA will problem solve together for the good of the patient, and will take staffing into consideration for fair and appropriate distribution of duties.
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Level II Nursery RN Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 265; Likes: 3Your right, Mattsmom, some do take advantage of my easy going nature. But the type that we are talking about are very difficult to problem solve with. I just do the task myself and right a letter of concern if it happens regularly.
I wish it was easier, but arguing with the CNA usually takes longer than doing the task myself. The letter of concern explains to the manager why I might have overtime.
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Medical Assistant-Student Nurse Joined: Feb '02; Posts: 23I DID NOT MEAN TO COME ACROSS AS MEAN ABOUT LVN'S HAVING AUTHORITY OVER CNA'S. YES I UNDERSTAND THAT WE AS CNA'S ARE THERE TO ASSIST THE NURSE IN PATIENT CARE. BUT IN MY POSITION, I WAS INSTRUCTED TO TAKE THE PATIENTS TO SMOKE...........I DON'T SMOKE, SO WHEN I SAID NO I'M NOT DOING IT B/C I DON'T SMOKE.........I WAS NOT WRONG ABOUT THAT, WHY SHOULD I HAVE TO RISK MY LUNGS GETTING CANCER BECAUSE SHES TOO LAZY TO GO OUT THERE AND INTERUPT HER DAY FOR IT. ABOUT THE RESPECT ISSUE, I DIDN'T MEAN THAT AN LVN SHOULD HAVE TO EARN MY RESPECT. I GIVE EVERYONE RESPECT AS A HUMAN BEING, BUT ONCE YOU ORDER ME TO DO ANYTHING, I LOSE ALL RESPECT WETHER YOUR THE DON OR THE LVN OR MY FELLOW CNA. I THINK IF YOU THINK YOUR TOO GOOD TO HAVE TO EARN ANYONES RESPECT, WETHER ITS A CNA'S OR A FELLOW LVN'S THEN YOU SHOULD MAYBE GET A MIRROR AND LOOK IN IT AND ASK YOURSELF WHAT KIND OF NURSE YOUR PATIENTS REALLY HAVE TAKING CARE OF THEM. REMEMBER OUTSIDE OF THAT NURSES UNIFORM, WE ARE ALL THE SAME, RESPECT COMES IN ALL DIFFERENT SHAPES AND SIZES.
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Proud and Educated Licensed Vocation Nurse Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 1,286; Likes: 27Originally posted by KellieRN
BUT ONCE YOU ORDER ME TO DO ANYTHING, I LOSE ALL RESPECT WHETHER YOUR THE DON OR THE LVN OR MY FELLOW CNA. -KELLIE
Yes, this is a sarcastic post. See how ridiculous it sounds?
Leads me to believe some CNA's (and other staff too, though nurses can't get away with it a easy) have a "I ain't takin' nothing from nobody" attitude. Dayum.
Let's face it, being a CNA is grunt work. Its respectable grunt work, but grunt work nevertheless. Being a LVN is a step up from entry level (CNA) grunting, RN a little better, NP getting better, Doctor...so-on, so-on. If anyone is waiting for gross amounts of warm and fuzzy's....WRONG FIELD. Rewarding at times, "It's all about the patient" most times.
If ANYONE doesn't like taking orders from someone you are in the wrong field. I tend to agree with BBNurse, I don't have the time nor energy to do pretty dances, light candles and incense to make a CNA feel warm and fuzzy about something I ask them to do. I do not bark orders, but I will ask you to do it. I agree with mattsmon81, "A good nurse and a good CNA will problem solve together for the good of the patient, and will take staffing into consideration for fair and appropriate distribution of duties." I only ask of a CNA what is within their job responsibilities, and will negotiate with if need be ( time management, breaks, helping other nurses, etc). I will help to get it done if need be. But if it is something real important that I have to argue, beg and pretty-please a CNA and ultimately delays patient care? I will ask the CNA if they are refusing to do what I asked. If they say no, then I'll ask when should I expect it done. If they say yes, I inform you that I will incident report this to our manager.
Plain and simple.Last edit by rebelwaclause on Dec 23, '02
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Periop Specialty: Geriatrics, DD, Peri-op ; Joined: Oct '02; Posts: 375; Likes: 10For the sake of not risking a coronary, I'll think I will refrain from posting any further. The original post was a vent. I was very angry that the CNA would blatantly refuse something I had asked her NICELY to do. I think someone above had a good point. If you are nice, then, you get run over....if you are mean, well, then no one wants to work with you. Just try to find a happy medium....that's what I'm gonna do.
And, Kelly....try to refuse when the doctor orders you to do something....I wish I could see that.
Dec 23, '02Occupation: RN Case Manager Joined: Apr '02; Posts: 4,945; Likes: 27Originally posted by rebelwaclause
...I don't have the time nor energy to do pretty dances, light candles and incense to make a CNA feel warm and fuzzy about something I ask them to do...
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Proud and Educated Licensed Vocation Nurse Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 1,286; Likes: 27Kinda like "Hippo's Swan Lake"...huh? (hahahahhaha)
Dec 23, '02Occupation: Patient Education Specialty: 7 year(s) of experience in LDRP; Education ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 7,470; Likes: 56I could too! Hell, if Rebel would do that for me, I'd do all her bedside cares!