Health Care: The Ticking Time Bomb

Nurses General Nursing

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    by Joe V
    Specializes in Programming / Strategist for allnurses.

You are reading page 4 of Health Care: The Ticking Time Bomb

  1. Would you support a public health care option?

    • 1527
      Yes, I support a "public option"
    • 1139
      No, it's a bad idea
    • 2180
      It depends on how it's structured

4,846 members have participated

ShayRN

1,046 Posts

Specializes in Corrections, Cardiac, Hospice.

I do not consider myself a liberal or conservative, but very much agree with a public OPTION for health-care. My mom, who worked 35 years for GM as a salary employee was just told in Feb. that as of April her insurance would no longer be covered by the company in any capacity. She went from paying 130.00 a month to 850.00 a month, for herself. Luckily, my stepfather is eligible for medicare. She is now being told that her pension is going to be cut by 30-70%. This is someone who worked 60+ hours a week her whole life, payed into the system and now she is at risk to lose everything. At 62 years old, where is she going to work? Why shouldn't people like her have the option to pay into a public health policy that is AFFORDABLE.

By the way, as a moderate I have some advice for those conservatives who will listen. When you spout about "liberal" agenda I understand that you have a "conservative" agenda. When you sneer about President Obama's plan for change on EVERYTHING, it makes your argument less compelling. I understand that no matter what you wouldn't agree with a thing he says or does. I have not agreed with every policy he has put into place, but understand that I will not. However, I think that he is doing a heck of a job and am very proud to have him as my President.

Specializes in M/S, MICU, CVICU, SICU, ER, Trauma, NICU.

I want choices. Period.

I am not against a public option, but I can tell you what will happen---especially with the mediocrity of government and red tape galore. They don't do a good job. Medicare is almost bankrupt and now they tell us that if a patient gets a bedsore in the hospital, they don't pay.

Or if they get a UTI from a foley in the hospital they don't pay--doesn't matter that the patient is 700 pounds, uncontrolled diabetic...we have to PROVE that they had it prior to coming in for their elective surgery.

The ONUS is on the hospital, the staff, the doctor, ALL OF US--but not the smoker, who is doing drugs. WE have to prove it is THEIR problem PRIOR to coming to the hospital. Sheesh. And what about tort reform? Nothing?

There will come a time when these rules overwhelm the system and SOMEONE, SOMEDAY will say ENOUGH. Maybe not the hospitals, but the GOOD docs....the GOOD nurses...

I see it happening in many places. All I can say is if THAT is the reality that comes with the public option, I want to OPT OUT if that is the case. I will choose who I will go to and when I want to...not when they can find a spot in 6 months....NO WAY.

stripbubbles

5 Posts

Read the constitution, first. There you will find a section describing how your government is structured and what its responsibilities are. Then you will see that you are the government. Did your pocket constitution say anything about fire departments. law enforcement, the FDA, the EPA, the public education system? I could go on but basically the people, you and me, decide what kind of a society we want to live in. I believe that healthcare for all is a moral right, not a legal right.

K98

453 Posts

Specializes in He who hesitates is probably right....
Read the constitution, first. There you will find a section describing how your government is structured and what its responsibilities are. Then you will see that you are the government. Did your pocket constitution say anything about fire departments. law enforcement, the FDA, the EPA, the public education system? I could go on but basically the people, you and me, decide what kind of a society we want to live in. I believe that healthcare for all is a moral right, not a legal right.

Government is charged with maintaining law and order, hence civilian law enforcement (police/sheriff). Our fire departments are volunteer, and do a fine job. If you choose to live in a large urban area, you can pay for YOUR fire department. The EPA? They protect nothing but their jobs. They actually believe in the junk science that claims that emissions from the US are warming the globe, but will let China and India pollute with impunity. Public education? Please. We throw more and more money at our kids, the NEA pockets it, and our kids continue to regress academically.

I am well aware of the constitutional structure of our government. It was not set up to be a nanny state. That would be known as Europe.

lamazeteacher

2,170 Posts

Specializes in OB, HH, ADMIN, IC, ED, QI.
You are idealistic, not realistic.

You "punish" people because they have extremely rare skills by touting them as "greedy". Give me a break. :bugeyes:

You're right, I am an idealist. I can't stand seeing poor standards of care by any HCP. The greed of doctors in most big cities in the USA is apparent in the parking lots of hospitals and office buildings. They protect each other, won't call anyone on poor performance that kills patients; and have less and less hours in their offices. If it was any other business they were in they'd be out of business. The latest addition of "hospitalists who are family practitioners has occurred because interuptions in their private lives aren't welcome. That's realistic!

I don't "punish" anyone. I "calls 'em like I sees 'em" (said by a marvelous long gone comedian, Red Skelton - you may be too young to have known his knack for satire). Certainly I'm not the one to set standards for doctors' incomes! I know of no doctors whose skills are rare. What do you see as rare skills? I do see doctors who have chips on their shoulders for the time they spent studying; and loans for their education they have to pay back; and malpractise insurance premiums that are sky high......

I do know some doctors who take more responsibility for their patients than other doctors do; and as nurses we sure notice patient neglect; and physician incompetence, when we see them. Please don't tell me you haven't

seen any (unless you haven't finished your schooling yet). If you have physicians in your family or friends, that could cloud your perception. Stating "give me a break" makes me think you have........:uhoh3:

lamazeteacher

2,170 Posts

Specializes in OB, HH, ADMIN, IC, ED, QI.

ShayRN:

Your mom went from a discounted healthcare premium, to a retail one. Companies can negotiate premiums with insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies; and watch average peoples' finances go down the drain like Rome burning while they fiddled with fate. Having one's employer responsible for payment of premiums for healthcare jeopardises job security!

It is abominable that insurance companies have access to your medical records (through the signing of a paper that is presented as one that preserves privacy!!???!!). Then (believe me) they share your "private" information with your employer. Many a job is lost, due to that. I have been an Employee Health Nurse, and I know what is done.

Our government will be subsidising your contribution to healthcare costs, so that the amount you will pay is affordable. Priorities for financing healthcare will be the equal provision of it for everyone, so the expensive furnishings in hospitals and doctors' offices currently paid from their high profits, will have to be sacrificed.

Equipment that is underutilized due to excessive numbers of the expensive items (that soon become obsolete) in communities which need only few, will be shared by hospitals that don't have to compete for their business by having the same equipment as all the others.

K98 and JOPACURN:

Your reactionary display of quickly and inaccurately drawn conclusions mirror what you think of our government! You need to become responsible voters, listening carefully to what candidates say, just as all of us need to do. You have hit on some of the problems that make politicians look ridiculous, but who elected them?

I saw a cartoon the other day that begged the question about what the difference is between a Republican official who has an extramarital affair, and a Democrat who does that. The answer given, was that a Republican statesperson gives a talk about "family values", first. That parodies human weakness, and the ease with which people believe what they want to hear!

European countries are much older than ours, so they've worked out some of their problems with health care there as best they could, knowing the results of not having programs that keep everyone as healthy as possible. Volunteer fire fighters have many more injuries, and property loss than fire departments with all paid (therefore more highly trained), focused workers.

If the people of the USA wanted nannies to spoonfeed all that is needed for our wellbeing, those poor caregivers would be dead from overwork, psychotic from lack of respect and regard; and desolate about human nature carved from savages that hasn't gotten much better or wiser. Satisfaction is elusive here, because disagreement exists about everything that would make it possible.

When credible scientific studies demonstrating reasons for what is before our very eyes, (higher water levels) is dismissed as "junk"; and conclusions are drawn without facts to back them, one wonders how educators live with themselves, knowing that some adult society members wield words proving they have insufficient information and a lack of fortitude to look at the possibility that they may be (gasp!) wrong. When you have read and examined thoroughly the studies that brought about theories with which you disagree, you may voice such opinions. Until then, please keep your views to yourselves, they make you appear unintelligent. I hate to see that exhibited by fellow nurses!

K98

453 Posts

Specializes in He who hesitates is probably right....

Lamazeteacher,

Odd how you liberals always view your position as the correct one, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Even better, when anyone disagrees with you, they are characterized as unintelligent.

Overland1, RN

465 Posts

The term "single payer" is somewhat of a misnomer. Sure the single payer is the government, but exactly who is the government? It is the representatives we elect, the myriad departments (and ever-growing number of "czars" - does anybody recall the real, original meaning of that term?), and ultimately the citizens of the United States. That "single" payer is actual several million hard-working taxpayers who elect those representatives and pay their salaries (and for the programs they mandate).

Have our legislators actually read any of the proposals being put forth (or will they???)? Will health care quality improve with socialized and/or a "public option" system? If so, why? If not, then why not? Will the number of providers and support staff increase or decrease? If so, then how (and how well) will they be paid for their work? Will that affect the quality of their work? Will such a "system" be able to support the extended care (i.e., on a ventilator) of everybody's Uncle Fred and Aunt Ethel for several months because the family wants that care extended (for whatever reason), or will the elderly be eventually treated as a commodity that is cheaper when dead?

Forget what the news media and blogs say about care in other places being far superior to that in the US; look directly at what goes on... talk with people who have "been there and done that". Look at the amount of government control that is exerted upon our health care already, and think "Postal Service, "Department of Agriculture", "Department of Education, etc.

Will handing the control of more than one-seventh (some are now saying it is more like one-fifth) of the national economy to the government be an improvement? GM and Chrysler thought that handing themselves over to the government would be a good thing - how will that actually play out?

As with anything that sounds/looks good because of what it is called, the devil is in the details; the taxpayers are not being provided with the necessary details.

txsw

1 Post

"Why do people equate government sponsored insurance with limited access and choice? There isn't any evidence for this at all - it is a fear tactic being perpetuated by those who do not have all the facts."

Wrong. Tell me which docs are willing to "jump" through government hoops (and I mean the ones that are seriously good and seriously busy practices--who TURN AWAY patients). I know those docs are already saying, "I don't have to participate, therefore I won't." THOSE are MY docs. I don't want someone who is going to see me as "#7370303000403020030403--you can go in now." I DON'T THINK SO.

I will not--and I mean WILL NOT--be on anyone's waiting list.

My fave ortho surgeon has his PICK of patients--he's that damn good and I know two IM docs who don't take ANY insurance. AT ALL.

They have minimal overhead and explain to their patients that they are responsible for paying out of pocket. These two docs make house calls too.

Yes, I admit I live in a region where this exists.

But I tell you again, I am NOT going to wait because I've never had to and I'm not starting now.

You sound like a bratty 3 year old! The world isn't just about you and your healthcare options. The Obama administration isn't talking about a single pay option anyway and is advocating for private insurance to continue. The government will just use an insurance plan to try and regulate costs and spending by the private insurance companies. If you are going to argue, argue about that. Don't whine because you think your doctor is the best and you don't want to pay 100% of his fee.

lamazeteacher

2,170 Posts

Specializes in OB, HH, ADMIN, IC, ED, QI.
Lamazeteacher,

Odd how you liberals always view your position as the correct one, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Even better, when anyone disagrees with you, they are characterized as unintelligent.

I don't want to banter with you. It's more important to convey information on this crucial topic in an adult way, without taking pot shots. Site sources of information if you want credibility, or don't make suppositions.

K98

453 Posts

Specializes in He who hesitates is probably right....
I don't want to banter with you. It's more important to convey information on this crucial topic in an adult way, without taking pot shots. Site sources of information if you want credibility, or don't make suppositions.

No suppositions here. The left wing never could tolerate an opposing viewpoint.

kugalde

10 Posts

Wow! Watch much X-Files? You obviously did not vote for Obama, and that's no big deal but really, the conspiracy theory stuff is going a little far.....

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