Gets up on one knee - page 2

It's been a little over a month since my drop from nursing year. Since I work with great people, everyone is supportive of me to be an RN. Thats what makes it so hard to accept failing over... Read More

  1. by   mark_LD_RN
    few may realize it is harder for male students and nurses very often. I had the displeasure of having an instructor that thought men should not be nurses and she did everything possible to harrass and fail male students. the only mistake she made was trying it with me. I had witnesses to some of her comments and was personal friends with the dean of the nursing program. this lead to her being fired and replaced. the other sad thing is male will run in to it in the work enviroment also. they just need to tough it out and make it work or find a more excepting enviroment. I find things are getting better for males in nursing slowly but it still has a long way to go. nursing as a whole has a long way to go to be realized as a real profession. we need to all start working together and supporting each other.don't you all agree?
  2. by   researchrabbit
    One of my friends who failed first semester d/t paperwork (but was fantastic at patient care), enrolled as an LPN and later bridged to RN. This may be a good route for you as well.
  3. by   Brownms46
    You know I saw the same thing when I went to school for LPN. We had about 7 men in the class, and only 3 made it. Two had wives who were RNs, and one had been a medic. There was one guy she felt was gay, and she had to take some leave time. She told him...not in front of others though, that having a sub wasn't going to help him! He didn't make it, and she tried to get his friend, but he was much too smart. Bad thing was we were almost in our last quarter when he got cut!

    So now you know what to watch out for Mario. And I agee...about not going back to the same program...unless you're ready to walk a thin tightrope with that instructor. You have got to be totally prepared...and on point at all times!

    But I haven't across any problems working with men, and I have worked with a lot of them along the way.
  4. by   nightingale
    Originally posted by mario_ragucci

    I still think there should be more support for male students who need help about what to do or how to act to women in all women environments that are unfamiliar.

    That goes for any student where they can be eaten, which is everywhere other non-students are. You can say "Wel, just do everything right and you'll be fine." As a student, I can be ignored by an instructor until I make a mistake, in front of other RN's. The way an instructor interacts one on one with any student is a factor.
    Mario... you really need to seek counseling regarding this issue of feeling male students need special counseling. I agree with what Jen said regarding special counseling or accomodation then for every sub group of nursing students. YOu should also have counseling for your depression.

    I think you still have a chip on your shoulder with expressing blame rather then owning up to your part in your lack of turning assignments in on time. I would think most insutrctors would have attitude about that.

    Nursing school teaches "ivory tower nursing" and YES, you are expected to be perfect with the few patients you get.

    I am glad to see you bounce back but let's be real.... for that is what you seem to need.... learn from this experience and move on... with the truth and your renewed dedication.

    I saw students picked on, kicked out, put on suspension etc... Nursing school is tough... Yes, I have my own horror stories... but the best part for me is it is over and I passed the NCLEX and knew what I needed to get me through that very challenging first year.

    Good luck to you Mario... and keep learning.... and growing and seeking the truth...
    Last edit by nightingale on Mar 17, '03
  5. by   debRNo1
    Originally posted by mario_ragucci
    Help me if you can with some way to be an RN, or LPN on line.
    I have researched this subject over the years and more recently while looking into obtaining my BSN online. To the best of my knowledge there are no programs online that will allow a CNA to become a NURSE.

    I was an LPN for many years as I worked on my RN degree. I chose EXCELSIOR because it suited my needs and allowed me to work at my own pace. The program is open to LPN's and EMT's but not CNA's as they do not have the background and training needed to perform and succeed in this independant type program. The program concludes with a clinical performance test that many seasoned nurses are not able to pass.

    The LPN program that I attended in NY was 10 months long and quite intense. I remember the classroom being so very crowded the first few weeks and some students didnt make it out to the first clinical rotation due to test grades. YES students are dropped for a point or two and PAPERWORK !! The class size dwindled down as we went as many more students were dropped during clinicals. In the end I like to think it was the cream of the crop left to graduate, take the boards and have the PRIVILAGE to practice nursing.

    I have the utmost respect for the instructors who must decide to drop a student who has been found to be clinically unsafe as this could save a patients life someday. I say a student and dont mention the "gender thing" because a GOOD instructor will look at your skills, competance, test grades, and perhaps attitude too and not see gender, race, color or age when making a very hard decision to drop you from a program.

    Many RN programs offer an accelerated option for those who are already LPN's. You MUST understand your scope as a CNA, student, LPN or RN and never ever cross that line. You must act in the role you are in and even if you get a nursing license you must STILL remember that there is so much still to learn. There is no way that after 10 months of prep or 2-4 yrs in a nursing program that you are prepared to be a nurse. I have been a nurse for 10 years and pride myself on learning every shift I work.

    Know-it-all nurses/CNA's/students scare the crap out of me

    I had an instructor in my LPN program who I could compare to a drill sargeant. She was about 4 feet tall but a powerful/intelligent woman and an excellent nurse. She was tough and I respected her for it. She was known for dropping students and everyone dreaded having her for clinicals. I happen to REQUEST her on my final rotation because I felt like I would get a good clinical experience with her and boy oh boy I did !!!!! However I did see her drop a load of students so very close to the end on that final rotation but with good reason and I still repect her all these years later for what I saw and the decisions she made.

    Finally- the dreaded paperwork as a nurse it is a tedious and time consuming part of our responsibilities but as a CNA you should fully understand that it is ESSENTIAL in relaying the care you have given and proper DOCUMENTATION will CYA and is the key to KEEPING your nursing license after you work so very hard to get it.

    Good luck-keep your mind open and your nose in a book and forget the personality clashes because unfortunately that is a LARGE part of the wonderful world of nursing. :imbar
    Ive been chewed up and spit out as a nurse more times then I'd like to say, guess it comes with the territory but life goes on and tomorrow is another day.

    You live you learn, chalk it up to experience, put your issues to bed, knock the "chip off your shoulder" and move on. My only advice to you is to maybe have an alternate plan in place for career options if the nursing thing doesn't work. Just in case.

  6. by   SmilingBluEyes
    Mario I think I told you this before; You can go other routes to be an RN. Try a different program or school. I had a friend who was thrown out VERY unceremoniously from our RN program at my college. She sank into self-pity for about 3 months, licked her wounds and did what I suggested. Enrolled in the LPN program, graduated and became a nurse. NOW, she is in an LPN-BSN track in a new school and doing GREAT. For her NOT to have gone for it would have deprived us all of a wonderful nurse and her of a career of her dreams.

    One suggestion for seeing what various programs have to offer you: Visit: VERY helpful site that enabled me to find an online RN-BSN program that is fully accredited and doable for me.

    DO NOT GIVE UP MARIO. There are many ways to do it. If you want it, you can achieve it. I believe you can. Take care and plan your come-back carefully. Try to learn from mistakes of the past and move on. I wish you nothing but the best, Mario.
    Last edit by SmilingBluEyes on Mar 17, '03
  7. by   cargal
    Is there any specific incidents of gender bias that you could relate to us?
  8. by   JMP

    I am reading over your last post and once again I am not sure what yo are saying. Yes, I can understand you are disappointed. Welcome to life....... disappointment visits us all from time to time.

    If you do not turn your work in on time, expect to find negative outcomes waiting for you on the other end. Nursing is very task orientated, esp when you are a student.

    Assesment, planning, evaluation and interventions..... which are in constant motion. We are always doing one or the other, sometimes all of the above at the same time as we move thru our nursing days.

    In my own opinion, at this point, I think you should move on Mario. Understand that this failure is a point to turn, reflect ( which you have done) and now make a new plan and get on with it.

    Take ownership of what has happened. If you did not turn a paper in on time, own it. Why would you need special counselling?

    Work as a CNA, prepare for your next opportunity, plan, evaluate, intervene and then assess........ nursing is all about APIE.
  9. by   mario_ragucci
    Thank you very much, everybody, for helping me. I appreciate the feedback very much.

    Cargal asked for a specific incident with gender bias. Like, say you were assigned a RN, but the RN didn't want to work with you. It blows my mind, but some women get nervous around guys, I guess. Some men would do the same with women I'm sure. Perhaps I need to forget that stuff immediately, but part of me wants to not be done to like that. :-)

    In an all women environment, if your the only guy, and your non-combative, some women will act funny and talk to you as if leading you to embarrass yourself. Non-verbals, which I am aware of, indicate a person is off. It's hard to ignore anyone when your accute.

    The paperwork is murder! Honestly, I spend serious time with it, but matching and figuring out new data fields is super time consuming, and if you want to be right and remember it the next time, it takes a bit more time, the first time. In other words, I had alot more questions about how/where to locate data on a PT in the chart and computer.

    Lol, women and men can all work together just fine. We're just talking about it here, and I ain't making no slant against any gender. By talking about it, it helps me to put it behind me, and understand. I don't think I need counceling. For example, if there is another student, or anyone, who could have given me advanced intelligence about this scenario, I would have been all right. Or, if someone could have coached me about all the places to get all the data and spoke to me with a flowing example of how PT record is built.

    Thank you for the web address sleeplyeyes! I would love to get into an LPN program, but am having a hard time finding them here in Portland. Are LPN schools more private? Let me check the website you gave me.

    I don't want anyone treated special in nursing school or health care. Shy, passive-aggressive, congenial, reclusive, pleasant, helpful, interesting....there are many people out there.

    Thank you again for your help and i am not mad at anyone or feeling so shot down. I am not depressed, as someone mentioned. Depression is a serious illness, and I am just in the dumps. Again, i wish there was some way to measure my seratonin and dopamine during the last month. What processes keep a person from lossing their mind when awful stuff happens, I am interested and am rightfully pathed.
  10. by   baseline
    Originally posted by JMP:
    "Take ownership of what has happened. If you did not turn a paper in on time, own it. Why would you need special counselling? "

  11. by   Sleepyeyes
    Hi Mario,
    I did a quick Google search and didn't find much there, so I thought you'd probably have better luck with your local yellow pages.

    Here in FL, my daughter has a choice of 3 nursing schools to choose from, all within 100 miles of home. I had to drive 50 minutes one way to school (if I left early; otherwise it was 1 1/2 hours, for some weird reason.)

    Anyhow, glad you're back! and Good luck with your search!
  12. by   dadrn
    Is there any specific incidents of gender bias that you could relate to us?
    Mario, hang in there. to answer your question, many male nurses could probably give you several examples of incidents. We just can't let it stop us. Where I work we get students from one scholl that has split the group into males and females. We get the females on one day and the males on the next. Any staff nurse working both days could easily site examples that the students don't even notice. Is that what we can expect as the norm? No, Ive' only been doing this about six years and know this is not the norm. What can we do about it? It'll probably just keep changing until the profession won't be recognized by one gender base.

    Have I experienced any discrimination based on gender since becoming a nurse? You bet, but I'm still here. But I don't need to go into that in this open mail.

    Just hang tough. I knew that I woulld have a hard time in school so I took the option of LPN first. In our school, you had the choice of tow pathways, LPN (taking classes during normal school breaks) or RN (based on a regular school schedule). If you choose RN and failed a single subject, you were boarded out, regardless of gender. To get back in, You went back on a waiting list, that contined over 900 names. If you took the LPN route and passed, you could test and get licensed. But if you failed, you were only boarded out of LPN and not RN. I used that track to lwarn enough about pediatrics, mother-baby, etc. to finish the RN track. By the way, I passed and did get my license because I felt a little insecure. But I did learn enough to get through RN.

    It will be worth it. Hang in there but start looking for another approach. Maybe you could become and EMT, Surg Tech, phlebotomist (I'm not a great speller), etc. Just don't stop. And Thanks for all the other nurses givig himthe encouragement. That helps all of us greatly.
  13. by   dadrn
    Added postscript.
    Having never been in a hospital or even willing to visit people in a hospital before a family emergency required it, I figured I'd start first with seeing if I could handle the environment before committing to 3 or 4 years of school. I got CNA through the red cross and got a job on a surgical ward in an acute care hospital, then I volunteered to do unit clerk work. I enjoyed it so I made my decision.

    This might help to learn the charts, red the handwritting, become familiar with the lingo, etc.

    By the say, sorry about all the misspelling and poor typing.