I am a proud New York City EMS Paramedic preparing to enter the Excelsior nursing program.
As a professional in an urban EMS system, I've worked side by side with registered nurses under austere conditions for many years. I consider nurses to be my peers, and I have enjoyed a good rapport and a sense of mutual respect in the context of our professional relationship. The vast majority of nurses I have worked with recognize that health professionals -- paramedics and others -- can and do maintain valuable clinical experience and skills.
However, there is always a small minority of divisive individuals in healthcare and academia who are blind elitists. These are the ones who summarily conclude that if you were not a codified student of a particular discipline, you know nothing. Frankly, I think there needs to be a more nuanced and respectful analysis on the part of those few who think that the clinical experience of other health care providers outside of their own scope of practice amounts to nothing.
Excelsior College attempts to address this problem by recognizing that paramedics like myself, as well as LPNs, PAs, MDs and others, tend to acquire clinical skills that are reasonably compatible with nursing. Excelsior provides a bridge for those providers to fill in any gaps and cross over into nursing in the same way that nurses have demanded a bridge to cross into the paramedic's domain (as PHRN) without having to go through the extensive paramedic training programs and EMS internship.
The two states that summarily reject Excelsior grads do so because they believe the program provides insufficient clinical training compared to traditional programs. This ignores the fact that all students are required to be licensed healthcare providers with clinical experience from the outset. The typical paramedic working in the field has patient care experience that, frankly, meets or exceeds that of most nursing students, and it is probably fair to say the same is true of many other experienced clinicians.
I would argue that the minority powers-that-be who do not see this logic have probably failed miserably in their responsibility to be discerning in their judgment. The fact that there are Excelsior nurses practicing in all fifty states in supervisory positions is proof that the paradigm works. The bureaucrats from the two states who have placed restrictions on latter-day graduates and marked them with an unfair stigma will hopefully retire soon and make way for leaders who can think outside of the box.
Paramedics, LPNs, PAs, and MDs who wish to bridge into nursing require respect. Excelsior grads are experienced clinicians that have consistently excelled in national-level clinical and didactic nursing examinations, and they deserve to be universally and unequivocally recognized as registered nurses!
Well, actually, every traditional program can say that -- if they don't maintain a particular minimum percentage of graduates that pass the NCLEX on the first try (the specific figure mandated by the BON varies from state to state, but I believe 70% is a fairly common figure), they get put on probation by the BON and are at risk of losing their state approval if they don't improve their results pronto ...
To me, that is a strong indicator that the BON takes NCLEX results as a credible indicator of academic proficiency in nursing. As Excelsior grads consistently exceed the national average performance on the NCLEX, there should be no double standard with respect to the weight of that test.
While I am not suggesting that Excelsior is better than traditional programs, I am expressing my view that both the college and their students have consistently endeavored to prove themselves decisively, only to be intercepted by those who jump to conclusions and pass summary judgment.
To me, that is a strong indicator that the BON takes NCLEX results as a credible indicator of academic proficiency in nursing. As Excelsior grads consistently exceed the national average performance on the NCLEX, there should be no double standard with respect to the weight of that test.
While I am not suggesting that Excelsior is better than traditional programs, I am expressing my view that both the college and their students have consistently endeavored to prove themselves decisively, only to be intercepted by those who jump to conclusions and pass summary judgment.
I didn't make my statement to argue or support either side of the discussion, merely to correct the poster's apparent misapprehension about first-time NCLEX-RN pass rates in traditional programs.
You are entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else on this board. As for "double standards," I have a question for the pro-EC contingent here, which I am asking not to be argumentative, but simply from sincere curiosity. Given that the BONs of every single state require that, in order to be eligible to write the NCLEX and be licensed, one must be a graduate of an approved nursing program that includes X number (again, the specific figure varies somewhat from state to state) of hours of classroom/lecture instruction and X number of hours of supervised clinical experience, why do EC students believe that you (collectively; I'm not speaking to any particular individual) should be given special treatment and be exempt from that requirement/standard, which everyone else seeking licensure has to meet?
I didn't make my statement to argue or support either side of the discussion, merely to correct the poster's apparent misapprehension about first-time NCLEX-RN pass rates in traditional programs.
You are entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else on this board. As for "double standards," I have a question for the pro-EC contingent here, which I am asking not to be argumentative, but simply from sincere curiosity. Given that the BONs of every single state require that, in order to be eligible to write the NCLEX and be licensed, one must be a graduate of an approved nursing program that includes X number (again, the specific figure varies somewhat from state to state) of hours of classroom/lecture instruction and X number of hours of supervised clinical experience, why do EC students believe that you (collectively; I'm not speaking to any particular individual) should be given special treatment and be exempt from that requirement/standard, which everyone else seeking licensure has to meet?
The reason students like me should be given fair (not special) treatment is for the same reason that nurses want fair treatment when they bridge to paramedic or increasingly enter EMS as PHRNs or flight paramedics. It is because they do have the classroom lecture and clinical instruction as well as on-the-job internship, patient care experience, and CMEs, etc. that in most cases exceed the minimum requirement for entry-level students.
EMS Bureaus of most states require that you complete the requisite curriculum of EMT-Basic, work full time on an EMS ambulance for a period of time, subsequently complete the paramedic program, then go through a supervised internship period. Nurses have no problem asking for permission to skip this two or three year process and opt for "supplemental EMS training" that enables them to challenge the paramedic exams. I support that, because I think it's reasonable, and I also support pre-licensure programs for aspiring RNs.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
The reason students like me should be given fair (not special) treatment is for the same reason that nurses want fair treatment when they bridge to paramedic or increasingly enter EMS as PHRNs or flight paramedics.
I wish you the best of luck in your journey to becoming an RN! :)
i'm orienting with two bsn grads from a local college, and it's blatantly obvious that i know more than they do but it's clear that my 14 years as an lpn is relevant and helpful to my current position as an rn. many people are not comfortable with what they perceive as different or unconventional. excelsior is both. but for those of us like myself who couldn't drop everything in their lives and go to school full time, it was also a huge blessing. excelsior helped me and others achieve our goal, and now it's up to us to prove through our job performances and knowledge that we are equally worthy of the rn title. i look forward to succeeding at that!!
:yeahthat: as a regents graduate (now excelsior) i could not agree more! when i was in orientation with traditional college nursing grads we were told that we would have 6-8 full weeks of orientation. i was done with orientation within 2 weeks as it was clear to them that i only needed to learn their computer system and nursing protocols.
i believe that those who critisize excelsior think that our diploma's are more or less handed to us. that we are not taking "real" classes and that they should not count as such and that hard work is not required to get our degree simply because we do not sit in a classroom.
i took an a&p textbook and studied it from cover to cover for 6 full months (at least 2 hrs a day, 5 days a week) before taking my test and i made an a, and the same for microbiology. it was not easy. ethics was worse than both a&p and micro combined.
as far as the clinicals that are required by excelsior, the student is required to be able to perform at the level as a new graduate nurse. many lpn's fail cpne because they perform at the level of a seasoned nurse. i failed my first cpne clinical because i cleaned up a mentally challenged adult who was lying in dried feces. my assignment was to perform as a graduate nurse. i was watched closely by a msn level nurse who was making note that i washed my hands, accessed lung sounds correctly, gave the meds correctly, used the 5 r's, documented everything correctly, knew how to write a care plan for the patient, left the 2 top side rails up when walking away from the patient, i was able to answer questions about the patients history as received in report. this msn felt that a newly graduated nurse would not have taken it upon herself to clean this patient up. my next patient i was failed because the care plan didn't say anything about an apical pulse and when i had trouble feeling the radial pulse i automatically did an apical pulse. this was a different msn and she failed me for doing an apical pulse feeling that a new grad would not have thought it through and would have gone for help with the pulse.
i went back 30 days later and did only exactly what i was told to do. i did not use any critical thinking. i had to totally forget everything i knew about nursing. i truly had to behave as a fresh new grad and i passed with flying colors.
i am proud to say i am an excelsior grad. my degree is very real. nobody cares where i went to school. when someone does ask their reaction is "gee i admire you, i wouldn't have the self-discipline to do that" the percentage of nurses who complete the excelsior program is very small compared to the percentage who begin the program. it's something like 7%-10%.
i give myself a :yeah:and all others who have also completed the program.
now why a pa or md would want to go through the program? that is beyond me too.
I just wanted to wish you good luck with Excelsior College. I have been an Ohio Paramedic for 8 years and recently graduated from Excelsior. I passed my NCLEX-RN in February!!!! Excelsior was a wonderfull option for me. I started in a traditional nursing program and was looking at endless hours of practicing the same skills that I have been utilizing for years, I started to "shop" for other options and stumbled upon Excelsior. Excelsior has been amazing the staff is always willing to help any time you call.
My biggest piece of advice is similar to what the Excelsior Grad who started as an LPN posted above. You really have to learn to think like a New Grad RN...as a medic or an experienced LPN you'll naturally think past the level of a New Grad...and for the purposes of the CPNE keep your eye on the assignment and remind yourself what your role is in the CPNE (first day new grad) or else you'll get yourself into trouble...As a RN you will definelty have to think critically but in the CPNE you are a first day New Grad RN, thats it! This line of thinking was definetly difficult for me to do, but I passed all PCS's first time through! I attended the CPNE in Mansfield, Ohio, the staff (CE's and CA's) were amazing! I highly recommend Mansfield.
Oh, and definetly attend a CPNE Workshop held by Excelsior before your CPNE. I attended 2 one a month before the CPNE and another the Tues, Wed, and Thurs befor my CPNE (Fri, Sat, Sun). This helped me focus, relax, and keep my mind in the game!
there was no such thing as a cpne workshop when i went through. i think the workshop is great advice.
i went to atlanta both times for my cpne but to different sites. i would not recomment gwinette. the big medical center downtown was awesome.
i cried when i failed cpne, the msn felt really bad for me but told me i was not performing as a fresh grad but rather as an experienced nurse. they "have to" see that we can function as a fresh grad when getting a job as an rn. in other words...you have to function in the same way as a traditional new graduate nursing student from a tradition nursing program. that's their standards and they do stick to it very strictly. the msn told me she admired me for cleaning up the patient, that she would have done the same but that she had to stick to their standards of how a new grad would perform.
I appreciate your views. The problem goes even further than you realize. I enrolled in Excelsior College as an RN going for my BSN.
In one hospital I worked in in NV nurses were warned not to enroll in Excelsior when going for their BSN because "we do not recognize them."
I talked directly with the NV BON and they indeed recognized and licensed nurses from both the AS degree program and the RN to BSN program.
The BON recognized it but individual hospitals refused to acknowledge any who obtained their degree this way.
I moved to CA before completing my degree. Again I talked directly to the CA BORN (its Board of Registered Nurses in CA) They stated that since I was already an RN that they would indeed recognize my BSN they also recognized Graduates of the ADN program under certain circumstances.
However, my individual hospital refuses to give recognition. The other day I started to investigate the Local State University RN-BSN program. I am shocked at first blush, it is blatently clear that the requirements and the depth of nursing education is considerably less than what I have already received at Excelsior.
I am considering enrolling to see just what would it take to get my degree from the CA STATE U. (I dropped out of Excellsior with all my theory exams completed but still had a couple performance exams to complete. note: The CPE is not required for completion of the RN to BSN)
Over the years these has been a lot of misunderstanding about Excelsior Degrees. It is hardly a diploma mill. I believe if you have the disapline to complete this program you are truly exceptional. The average person does not have the sustained self disapline to go it completely alone for an entire degree program with no deadlines and assigned structure.
Even taking correspondence and internet courses you have certain time you must complete things. Internet courses you must attend to weekly and have someone to answer to.
I did not have that with Excelsior. This meant I Had to set my own deadlines, goals, etc and I was the only person I had to answer to. Very easy to let things go to not study to not get to the library to not buy the references or crack the books. Your family and friends have a hard time taking you seriously as a student. Consequently they could and do easily sabotoge your efforts unless you are extreemly strong and focused and refused to be derailed.
The performance exams, require raw courage just to take, that no traditional student is ever asked to display.
If you are an Excelsior grad my hat is off to you.
vanderbilt university accepts excelsior asn grads into their bsn and np nursing programs.
nursing program receives nln honor
excelsior college designated center of excellence in nursing education
albany, ny – the excelsior college school of nursing was designated a 2005-2008 national league for nursing (nln) center of excellence in nursing education in the category of creating environments that enhance student learning and professional development during the nln education summit 2005, held in baltimore, md from sept. 29 – oct. 1. this prestigious recognition was first awarded by the nln in 2004 with only three schools receiving the award. this year, four more schools, including excelsior college, received the designation. in order to apply for the designation, a school must be nlnac accredited. there are approximately 1,700 nlnac accredited nursing programs in the u.s.
dr. bridget nettleton, dean of excelsior’s school of nursing, accepted the award on behalf of the college at the summit. the designation as a center of excellence is awarded based on excellence in all of excelsior college’s nursing programs: associate, baccalaureate and master’s degrees.
as stated on the national league for nursing web site, “recognition by the national league for nursing as a center of excellence is designed to distinguish those schools that demonstrate sustained, evidence-based and substantive innovation in the selected area, that conduct ongoing research to document the effectiveness of such innovation, that set high standards for themselves, and that are committed to continuous quality improvement. such recognition indicates a commitment by the school as a whole to pursue and sustain excellence in student learning and professional development, ongoing faculty development, or nursing education research.”
“this is an incredible affirmation of the outstanding quality of every aspect of excelsior college and our school of nursing,” said dr. nettleton. “it acknowledges our premier external degree nursing programs and our extraordinary students, alumni, faculty, staff, advisors and administrators. we are extremely pleased to have received this honor of distinction.”
Without others taking out of context what I posted:
Each state has the right to deem what they will accept and what they will not in terms of licensure. And we have seen many other programs not be accepted all over, and they were even complete four year "regular" programs. There are some courses that a state also requires that a program in another state did not teach, therefore the person cannot get licensed in the new state with that training.
Even in CA, they also have their own programs that are accepted only there, such as the 30 unit RN as well as that a medic in the military for several years can challenge and write the NCLEX-PN exam, but taking of the exam alone does not give licenses in the other states as their training does not meet the educational requirements for any other state. And they do it knowing full in advance beforehand, but not hoping that things will change later on.
That is the only point that I am making. I have worked with many nurses that were from other fields that became RNs thru this program and enjoyed working with them, the training is not an issue to me. But a state again can make the determination as to what they will accept and what they will not. And none of us have any control over that.
And since we are on the topic of Excelsior, it works by using the skills that the student has gained working here in the US as a member of the healthcare team in one form or another and they already have a skill set for how we do things in the US.
Someone that has trained in another country, even as a physician, was trained in practices that we do not usually even see in the US, and I do not like this type of program for them. They do not have previous US training or a skill level, and that is also part of the equation. This program stresses that one has experience and/or licensure in another health care field to qualify for it, and that one has the LPN training if starting from nursing for it to be accepted.
excelsior college designated center of excellence in nursing education
ToddEMTP
7 Posts
To me, that is a strong indicator that the BON takes NCLEX results as a credible indicator of academic proficiency in nursing. As Excelsior grads consistently exceed the national average performance on the NCLEX, there should be no double standard with respect to the weight of that test.
While I am not suggesting that Excelsior is better than traditional programs, I am expressing my view that both the college and their students have consistently endeavored to prove themselves decisively, only to be intercepted by those who jump to conclusions and pass summary judgment.