Euthanasia/Spirituality

Nurses General Nursing

Published

I am a member of this board, but rarely post. I have a few questions that I would like to ask.

How many of you believe in Physician Assisted Suicide? I believe that a patient should have that right if there prognosis is terminal and there is no hope of recovery.

Secondly, how many of you believe in the Other Side? You know, if a patient says that they see a bright light with there loved ones waiting for them. And if you do believe, do you talk about it with your terminal patients if they ask you about it.

I firmly believe in the Other Side, I believe that when we pass away it is just our body that is gone, our spirit moves on to the Other Side, where we are happy and care free. Belle

Maizy, I too have had a few experiences with the Other Side. My father passed away when I was four years old. About five years later I was going to bed one night. I remember that I was getting snuggly and I was laying on my right side when out of no where I felt a warm hand on my left shoulder. It lasted only a couple of seconds, but at that time it felt like eterninty. Iwas frightened. It was only years later did I know that it was my daddy.

Another time, just this last summer I heard bath water running. It was around 1:30-2:00 in the morning. I got out of bed to see what it was. I walked into the bathroom where the sound was comming from. Everyone in the house was out like a light. I walked into the bathroom and cautiously pulled the shower curtain back to find the bath water running. I am a light sleeper, so I know that it had just started. I went to bed with a smile on my face because I knew that it was my daddy. It very well could have been my husband's mother, but I believe that it was someone for me because I was the only one who heard it.

I firmly believe in The Other Side. I believe in Spirit Guides, ghosts, spirits, astral travel, reincarnation,(if we choose to) and other supernatural/spirittual things.:p

Jenny, no that is not what I meant.

What I'm trying to say is (if a patient is terminally ill with no hope of recovery) that many people do not have insurance and they have to pay for their doctor visits and prescriptions out of there own pocket. For those people whose situation is hopeless and they are no longer able to take care of themselves, they may choose euthanasia, because they are not financially able to pay for those things that may alleviate their pain or keep them on this earth a little longer.

As we all know many patients do nat take their prescribed meds beacuse they can not afford it.

I did not mean that these are good reasons for these patients to die. I'm sorry if it came across that way.

Specializes in CV-ICU.

Thanks for the reply, BBelle.

I think that the cost of health care these days is ridiculous and it bothers me when I hear such things. I mean, an older friend of mine was talking the other day and she can't afford the co-pays on her and her hubby's meds! She has insurance too! But that's another topic for another thread.

The idea of what the elderly have to pay for health care (on their fixed incomes) should not be the deciding factor for euthanasia-- or to go on living.

I dissaprove of the way patients are made in-hospital Hospice patients, and then it's left to us the floor nurses to care for them and the family and help them greive. Hospice only comes after the patient dies. It seems like Hospice in name only. I feel like I'm not able to truely be as comforting or helpful to them as I would like to be because of other patients, the workload , etc. I wish that they would just not even have in-hospital Hospice. DNR yes, but let them go to Hospice House and have a decent death.

P.S. My mother died with Home Hospice helping us and she was able to die with her family and pets around her. The nurses were very professional and caring.

I often feel guilty when people are dying and I'm so damn busy that I feel like I'm not helping these people grieve or helping the patient as much as I would love to.

Oh well...it's turning into a vent, so I'd better stop.

I also beleive in an after life, and am not afraid to die--just afraid to die in pain and fear.

Also, in the last few years it seems everyone I have to code is elderly and pitiful. We truly do extend suffering too too far.

On a personal note: I dont want to experience Alzheimers Disease,even in some instances you no longer feel anything,late stages. I dont want to not realize who I am. I read this story about a man who no longer knows who he is, everday he leaves the clinic and cheerfully goes into town ,he has a number on his back,his telephone number,then he goes to a coffe shop and comes back merry, I dont want to see myself wandering thru town one day to the amusement of my survivors.God help us

sbic56- good analogy with the epidural. This topic like so many others in medicine is and probably will always be one with varied opinions by medical personnel. I am glad that I believe that there is more than what we have here otherwise dying would be very very scary. I've seen folks die very peacefully and then others that fight it to the last second, just makes one wonder and go hmmm.

Specializes in correctional, psych, ICU, CCU, ER.

Renee....Agree totally with you.. Mom had a minor surgery 30 years ago-she stopped breathing in the middle of surgery. The docs were able to "Bring her back" , but wanted to tell her themselves. When I saw her in recovery, she said,"I died in there." I was a young student nurse and didn't know WHAT to say, She told me "I know I did, I heard the angels singing"> I almost crapped!!! She's now about to turn 82 and fine.

As for assisted suicide, We take better care of our animals than our humans. When it's time for me to go, I want to go. If I need some help, so be it. I think if someone is determined to die, they will find a way. (Like me son's best friend did). It's really hard, especially on the ones left, though, and people will argue that it's a selfish thing to do. I think that if I'm in pain, and no hope, I want to go. BBBUUUTTT, the same can be said for young suicides, they are in mental pain and think ther's no hope.

I don' t have all of the answers.:confused:

;No one knows how they will die.Some will go peacefully,some in agony.For those whose life has become intolerable physician assisted suicide should be a right.

One thing I don't recall having seen mentioned here is the all to frequent failure of physicians to accurately present the patient's prognosis to them and their family. Without honesty about what is going on and realistic potential for improvement, families and patients make decisions that seem unrealistic to those of us on the outside.

It is all well and good to talk about quality of life but without defining according to whose criteria, we're talking past one another. What I consider an acceptable quality of life may not be what someone else considers acceptable. There have to be laws to protect those who are doing the assisting from accusation of being just an angel of death killing those who "need to die" Once you start making laws what looks, to most nurses, as a pretty obvious thing gets really, really muddy. (Remember health care reform according to the lawyers?)

Commenting on something a little different. One of the great strengths of Catholic teaching on the matter of end of life is that they do not require life extension at all costs. Indeed, the provision of prolonged, futile care is not condoned, much less required. Accroding to Catholic doctrine and practice it is not necessary to "prolong life by artifical means."

Originally posted by ohbet

;No one knows how they will die.Some will go peacefully,some in agony.For those whose life has become intolerable physician assisted suicide should be a right.

Dr. Kate you make such valid points also.....

Physicians often do not give the factual prognosis to the family.........or the plan of care with continued or discontinued treatment.........

is it legalistic......is it "that slippery slope", muddied......

ohbet.....your points are very valid.........

micro and out(for now)

Specializes in ER, ICU, L&D, OR.

Howdy yall

from deep in the heat of texas

Yall are right, some MDs have trouble discussing that issue with pts and families. This is not new by any means. And will continue to be so.

Comes down to the basics, let the patient and the family choose their path according to their beliefs.

Meanwhile go play a round of golf

doo wah ditty

I just had to comment on something that Barb wrote about what sounded like angels singing at the time of a patient's death.

It's about my grandfather who passed away in 1999. I titled it "DID POPPAW SEE HEAVEN?" on my website, where I also tell this story.

Poppaw had been admitted to the hospital after having suffered a heart attack. Once he was moved from ICU into a private room, he was never alone, there was always family there with him. During his stay at the hospital he had another heart attack. Some days were good, some bad. He wanted to go home and we couldn't seem to make him understand he needed to stay at the hospital a while longer.

I had been staying with him for several days, me and my grandmother. Mommaw would not leave the room. The night before I had to leave was not a very good night. Poppaw was very agitated and confused. Bless his heart, but he totally exhausted me and Mommaw that night.

The next morning, a calm came over him. He was so peaceful and in a good mood. Two of my aunts were there in the room with us. We were all talking to Poppaw about this and that, nothing important, when all of a sudden he got very quiet and stared up at the ceiling.

Tears began flowing ever so gently from his eyes and running down his cheeks. I asked him what was wrong, but he shook his head slightly and said nothing was wrong. So I asked him was he hurting, but he said no. Then I asked why was he crying, what was making him so sad. This really bothered me to see him cry because during my whole life I had never seen this man cry.

By this time, we were all either standing by his bed or sitting on the side of the bed looking at him and holding his hands as he lay there looking at the ceiling softly crying. He then said he'd been here at this place a long time, but he wouldn't be seeing it anymore. When asked what he meant by that, he offered no explanation. He kept staring at the ceiling and then in a few minutes he asked us could we see the beautiful harp, then after that he asked us could we hear the pretty music. Of course, by this time we were all crying as we looked at him and listened to his precious words. Still looking up at the ceiling from his hospital bed, he mentioned seeing a waterfall and a temple.

There is no doubt in my mind that Poppaw was seeing Heaven. I had to leave to go home later on that day. Three days later, he died peacefully with the family sitting nearby. They never even realized he was gone until the nurses came running into the room. They tell me the last thing they remember him doing was closing his eyes to rest. So everyone in the room was quiet and let him sleep. They told me that just before the nurses came into the room, Poppaw, appearing to be asleep, his eyes closed, stretched both arms out and upward to the ceiling, then slowly lowered them and placed them on his chest. I believe at that moment he left this world and held out his arms as he went away with the angels.

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