Does abortion play a role?

Specialties CNM

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Hi, I am Jen and I'm 30... I am a student nurse looking to go into the maternal/L&D/Midwifery world as a specilty after graduation. Whether that is being a L&D nurse or actually becoming a CNM, i am not 100% yet.

My question to you is... I am against abortion, i do not feel i could perform abortions or even refer women to get them die to my moral standpoint on them. I am 100% for family planning, IVF, and every other aspect of the women health world. Is is possible to be a CNM and have these ideals? or is it a conflict of interest? How would a CNM approach a situation where s/he didn't want to refer an abortion? Would you simply say to the pt that there are other CNM on staff who could refer you??

Red Kryptonite said:
Yeah, it couldn't possibly be because of their love and respect for the miracle of life.

I've noticed over the years (decades) that an awful lot of the "pro-life" people don't seem to care much what happens to these "miracles of life" after they're born. They are often the same people who are opposed to any kind of social programs or spending, and are also often v. "pro" death penalty (aren't adults "miracles of life," too??)

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Specializes in hospice.

I guess you missed the crisis pregnancy centers that help women with getting diapers and baby clothes, the hospitality houses that get homeless pregnant women off the streets and allow them a safe place to live with their babies for a year or more, helping them with parenting skills, job training, and getting apartments, the shelters run for foster children who can't be placed, the food banks and charities run all over the country by pro-lifers. When you make your agenda into blinders, of course you don't see these things.

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Red Kryptonite said:
I guess you missed the crisis pregnancy centers that help women with getting diapers and baby clothes, the hospitality houses that get homeless pregnant women off the streets and allow them a safe place to live with their babies for a year or more, helping them with parenting skills, job training, and getting apartments, the shelters run for foster children who can't be placed, the food banks and charities run all over the country by pro-lifers. When you make your agenda into blinders, of course you don't see these things.

You're right -- I have missed that. I've never lived anywhere where anything like that was going on. I have lived places where the pro-life "crisis pregnancy centers" give women all kinds of false information to try to scare or guilt them into keeping their pregnancies ...

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Specializes in Reproductive & Public Health.
Red Kryptonite said:
And I frankly wonder why anyone pro-killing would enter health care at all, so I guess we're even.

Let's not pretend that death isn't an important part of health care, okay? Coming to terms with death has been a huge part of my growth as a health care provider.

And let me just say that I get so annoyed when a fetuses humanity is trotted out as an argument for or against abortion. I actually believe that life begins at conception, and I believe that fetuses are human. I think fetuses have innate worth irregardless of gestation and viability. I believe all of that and still think abortion should be available, on demand, without judgment. I worked in an abortion clinic and assisted in procedures up to 24 weeks. I know of which I speak. Abortion access is directly tied to maternal and infant mortality rates, and restricting abortion (through law and through judgmental attitudes from providers) only serves to increase mortality through self-administered and "back alley" abortions. Women don't choose abortion because they think fetuses are no more important than bacteria. They choose abortion because they have decided, using their brain, that this is the best decision, for whatever reason.

Universal access to contraception and comprehensive sex ed. Improved social support systems for single mothers and families. Increased access to health care. These are interventions that reduce the rate of abortion by increasing women's ability to take control of their reproductive health.

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Specializes in Hospice.

It seems to me that the OP has already made her own moral values clear from the very first. While a discussion of the morality of abortion is quite entertaining, it doesn't address the OP's original question.

How is she to draw the line between her professional obligations as a CNM and her personal moral obligations?

Does she have the right to demand that her employer modify her job description?

If she's not doing the whole job as defined by the employer, does she have the right to the same salary as those meeting all the job requirements while she meets only some of them?

Does her right to practice her own moral code trump the right of her client(s) to full, accurate and objective information?

It's a thorny ethical question ... but the OP's own moral choices aren't up for debate, so I think we should leave the "is abortion wrong" debate for later.

I do not think that is ethical to withhold information to the point that she does not refer to those who have no problem discussing contraception and abortion. By trying to make information unavailable, I feel she crosses the line.

I agree with those posters who have advised looking for work in a setting that doesn't demand that she give information or provide care with which she's uncomfortable. If it's possible.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
elkpark said:
I've noticed over the years (decades) that an awful lot of the "pro-life" people don't seem to care much what happens to these "miracles of life" after they're born. They are often the same people who are opposed to any kind of social programs or spending, and are also often v. "pro" death penalty (aren't adults "miracles of life," too??)

And this assumption provides what to the conversation?

I'm very much against abortion and very much for social programs and the death penalty (in certain situations).

Oh...and I worked OB without any issues.

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Specializes in Hospice.
IrishIzRN said:
And this assumption provides what to the conversation?

I'm very much against abortion and very much for social programs and the death penalty (in certain situations).

Oh...and I worked OB without any issues.

So how does this, or the post you quoted, help the OP?

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
heron said:
So how does this, or the post you quoted, help the OP?

Well at least I point out that yes you can work OB while not okay with abortions.

Catty much?

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Specializes in hospice.
elkpark said:
You're right -- I have missed that. I've never lived anywhere where anything like that was going on. I have lived places where the pro-life "crisis pregnancy centers" give women all kinds of false information to try to scare or guilt them into keeping their pregnancies ...

Well I'm sorry your experience is so narrow. I guess I'll have to work up a list but you can start with googling Maggie's Place, St. Vincent de Paul, and Sunshine Acres Children's Home.

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Specializes in Hospice.
IrishIzRN said:
Well at least I point out that yes you can work OB while not okay with abortions.

Catty much?

Red Kryptonite said:
Well I'm sorry your experience is so narrow. I guess I'll have to work up a list but you can start with googling Maggie's Place, St. Vincent de Paul, and Sunshine Acres Children's Home.

Snotty much?

I'm glad you worked OB with no conflict with your personal morals ... care to share how you did that?

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Specializes in hospice.

The very idea that people who are pro-life shouldn't work in OB is snotty. It's also immature, narrow-minded, and bigoted. Get what you give.

I admit to chuckling a bit, because I actually edited my last post to make it less snotty. :sly:

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Specializes in Hospice.
Red Kryptonite said:
The very idea that people who are pro-life shouldn't work in OB is snotty. It's also immature, narrow-minded, and bigoted.

When did I say that?

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