Doctor interaction?

MS._Jen_RN, ASN, RN · May 25, 2006

Docs are people. there are all sorts of people. Mean, nasty:angryfire , sweet, kind:saint: and otherwise. At my facility nasty behavior is not tolerated by anyone, Doc or housekeeper. Do what you want to do. Perhaps your Dad is having a bit of a problem seeing his son as a nurse (not that it's right) and is trying to make excuses/talk you out of it.

~Jen

HARRN2b · May 25, 2006

I am going the same route you are. I have the degree and have been in the business world for 20 years. Been with some major corporations. However, I ran into rude and nasty people in those companies In nursing, just as corporate, you will deal with a wide variety of individuals and personalities. Just do the best you can. It is a fact that not everyone will like you and that is ok. You will not like every MD. In fact, you may even wonder how some of them got their MD LOL!!! Tell your father that you will have great job security and probably more opportunities than you have with your MBA!!!!!!!!Good luck!

Holly

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · May 25, 2006

Many physicians possess the 'God complex'. People are naturally expected to bow down while in the presence of the almighty doctor.

JMBM · May 26, 2006

I wouldn't worry too much about it. If you've been out in the business world, you have undoubtedly run into difficult people and you know how to put that aside to get the job done. I recall a finance class way, way back in college when we had a guest speaker, a venture capitalist. He said the two people he disliked working with were airline pilots and doctors. He said they have a ton of money, a relatively narrow technical education and commonly have an attitude that they know more about everything than anyone. In most hospital settings, doctors are considered the leader of a team, where members of the team have competencies in their specific areas that probably surpass the doctor's. However, med schools teach nothing about how to participate on, let alone lead, a team. They are fixated on the old "Marcus Welby" doctor-knows-more-than-anyone model. I still recall my sister coming home from her med school class, telling me about how her professors told her that the reason the students would eventually be addressed with an honorific title is that they are smarter and will know more than their patients and are responsible for making decisions for them for their own good. Okay, there are all sorts of pro and con arguments about instilling this type of attitude. Whatever. The point is that you will run into this type of attitude. You just don't let it affect you. Your focus will be on and your duty will be to the patient. Some docs will be great. A few will be jerks. Most will simply be somewhere in between. Their attitude doesn't define you, only them.

MsBruiser · May 26, 2006

Hah! I like your analogy about pilots and docs - though given the recent shakeup in the airline industry, they have been knocked down a few notches!

I've run into more than my share of inflated egos over the years - and have dealt with them in a myriad of ways....just wondering if doctors could get away with more? Corporations have really cleaned up their acts with regard to regulating appropriate work-place behavior. I wonder if medicine is lagging behind...

Ruby Vee, BSN · May 26, 2006

this is i'm due to start an accelerated rn program as part of a career change (mba background to rn). most everyone is very positive about my change except my father, who consistently tells me "i don't know how you are going to deal with those doctors who will talk down to you and treat you like you are stupid all day long." how big is that problem? is it something to be conerned about? or is he just sore his son is taking a paycut and actually doing what he wants to do with his life?????
thanks - all responses appreciated.

i answered you in the other thread, but i'll go again.

some nurses seem to have an enormous problem with doctors talking down to them and treating them as if they are stupid. i think it's because they act stupid. if you don't act stupid, very few will treat you that way. even if you don't know something -- and we've all been there! -- ask intelligent questions, listen to the answers carefully and learn! treat people with respect, and generally they'll treat you the same.

there are always going to be a few jerks who treat you poorly. they're the exception rather than the rule, and i'm sure you ran into a few of them in the business world. they're everywhere.

congratulations on changing careers into something you really want to do, and good luck with your nursing career.

ruby vee, rn, bsn, mba (i thought i wanted to be a stockbroker!)

Ruby Vee, BSN · May 26, 2006

i've run into more than my share of inflated egos over the years - and have dealt with them in a myriad of ways....just wondering if doctors could get away with more? corporations have really cleaned up their acts with regard to regulating appropriate work-place behavior. i wonder if medicine is lagging behind...

in some areas, medicine is lagging behind. smaller community hospitals seem to have a bigger problem in that respect. but over the past 28 years, i've seen lot of changes for the better.

28 years ago, a neurosurgeon chased my preceptor down the hall trying to throw a full bedpan at her. i'll never forget it. she wouldn't even report him because "no one would do anything about it anyway." (sadly, she was right -- i did report him, and was laughed at.) a few years ago, a cardiologist took a swing at a (male) nurse. the cardiologist wound up in anger management classes. the administration took it quite seriously.

emotions can run quite high when lives are at stake, and many physicians are stressed to the max. as are many nurses. things have gotten better -- but you're still going to have the occaisional problem. doctors are going to get away with exactly as much as you let them get away with. value yourself, and you won't let them get away with it.

JMBM · May 26, 2006

Well, I do agree with what you say, RV. Part of the problem is that nurses allow docs to get away with rudeness that the nurse would never tolerate from someone in "civilian" life. The first step is to respect yourself. All nurses should take a look at Suzanne Gordon's Nursing Against the Odds for a much more articulate description of the issue. On the other hand, its not a problem we nurses can solve on our own. I still find it amazing that the army would never send someone out to lead a team without teaching them how while Harvard, Yale and Stanford med schools do it all the time. I've worked with docs who not only don't look at the nurse's chart, they don't even know that nurses do chart. Some docs simply have no idea what all these people around them do. So, if we can't change med school curriculum, we'll just have to teach the docs one at a time - by doing just what RV's advocates - respect yourself, act professional, and don't take rudeness.

anne74 · May 26, 2006

I also worked in corporate America for 7 years before I did an accelerated program and became a nurse. I was treated with more disrespect in the corporate world, and I also came across more incompetent people with inflated salaries too. In medicine, if you're incompetent you won't make it. You can't get away with BS-ing in nursing like you can in the business world. I find that very refreshing!

I totally agree that at teaching hospitals the doctors treat you with more respect. I think partly it's because they're learning and need our help to look good to their superiors. I also think it's a generational thing. When I worked at a non-teaching hospital, some of the old school doctors wouldn't give us eye contact and quickly dismissed our observations and suggestions. The younger doctors were much better - even if they weren't learning. I also agree that male doctors often relate better (or bond maybe) with male nurses.

My Mom was a nurse in the '60s and '70s, and they were taught to stand up when a doctor entered the room. Whatever. Nursing has come a long way!

Trauma Columnist · May 26, 2006

I think you can run into rude folks anywhere. Went to Starbucks on my way to work recently and barista (hopefully spelled correctly) was chatting on her cell phone in obviously personal phone call while trying to take my order - got it wrong, then became upset when I wanted it redone!

However, docs haven't had a problem! Maybe because I'm old and big and bad! lol

Mentuhotep I · Jun 5, 2006

This is I'm due to start an accelerated RN program as part of a career change (MBA background to RN). Most everyone is very positive about my change except my father, who consistently tells me "I don't know how you are going to deal with those doctors who will talk down to you and treat you like you are stupid all day long." How big is that problem? Is it something to be conerned about? Or is he just sore his son is taking a paycut and actually doing what he wants to do with his life?????
Thanks - all responses appreciated.

Stopnik,

As far as interpersonal relationships go, I think dealing with doctors will be the least of your worries. Based on what I have experienced, read and seen, I think that dealing with female nurses (unfortunately she could be your boss) who think that men should not be nurses may be more likely a problem you encounter compared to dealing with other males who happen to be doctors. Check out the URL below and read the article if you wish.

http://www.minoritynurse.com/features/nurse_emp/08-30-00c.html

madwife2002, BSN, RN · Jun 5, 2006

Does anybody find it strange that in all examples in this thread of doctors bad behaviour comes from the Male doctor, not one example of a female doctor. So Stopnik as 50% of the medical professional is now said to be female then bad behaviour from Doctors should be a thing of the past. :lol2: