Do You Want Universal Healthcare?

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I know this topic has been discussed before on this site..but, I was curious for an updated response. How many of you would be willing to pay more taxes for universal healthcare? I find it egregious that the US has put a cost on maintaining/saving ones life! I traveled to Europe and the thought of them having to bring their checkbook to the hospital aroused literal laughs. It's the same notion that we'd have to whip out our debit card to firefighters before they turned the hoses on our burning homes. It's sad. I think the overall costs of UH would be beneficial...in fact, the raised taxes would still probably be lower than our rising premiums every 2 weeks! Thoughts?

The price of fruits and veggies hasn't soared outrageously. Yes, the prices have gone up but not by much. Everytime I go to the farmer's market there is always a ton of fresh fruit and veggies on sale. I do agree that the obese comments were out of had and shouldn't haven't even been added to this discussion.

Just curious.....how did you get to the farmer's market where everything is inexpensive? Do they take food stamps?

It's expensive to be poor in this country. No car, well it's tougher to "shop around" for good prices on food....instead you need to go to the food store that you can get to. Without cash on-hand, it's tougher to buy in bulk to save money. Etc, it goes on.

There's a great book that speaks about this by Barbara Ehrenreich called, "Nickel and Dimed, On (not) Getting By in America."

Peace,

CuriousMe

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Specializes in Homecare Peds, ICU, Trauma, CVICU.
Me too . . . but my husband will never get insurance as he is a private contractor and has been our whole marriage.

If something does . . well, payment schedule, here we come.

steph

Until the hospital demands payments that are far out of your budget. Next thing you know, your bill goes to collections, your credit report is ruined, you eventually lose your home and any other assets you worked hard all your life for. Now you're reduced to next to nothing. You are so far in debt, that you can no longer afford your medication or routine physicals that would in turn help prevent the next catastophe. It becomes a vicious cycle.

I know. This is what happened to my husband and I.

And we are not lazy. We do not want to take advantage nor do we feel entitled. In fact, we could afford to make our health insurance payments along with the ridiculous copays and deductibles (even if it was tight at times). Our problem resulted because we, like you, did not have health insurance. It was not available through our employment. We tried to get private, independant insurance. We applied, and applied, and applied.....to like 15 different ins. companies. DENIED by all, due to some minor pre-existing conditions.

No we were not denied medical care. But ended up losing everything because we needed it and couldn't affort it. I'm not asking for a free ride.....I work and will pay gladly pay taxes to cover my healthcare, and healthcare for all. I'm tired of the greedy insurance companies getting rich off of my hardearned money. Let that money go to pay what it was meant to pay for....actual healthcare.

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In another post Spidey's Mom talked about teenagers thinking 'it can't happen to me.' I think that is going on here....

It can happen to you Steph. It happens to a lot of people. I hope it never does though. I imagine losing everything one has worked for is very traumatic.

When people haven't been truly poor they really don't know what they are talking about.

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In another post Spidey's Mom talked about teenagers thinking 'it can't happen to me.' I think that is going on here....

It can happen to you Steph. It happens to a lot of people. I hope it never does though. I imagine losing everything one has worked for is very traumatic.

When people haven't been truly poor they really don't know what they are talking about.

No, I never said something medical cannot happen to my family. It has. During times we did not have insurance. And we made payments.

Of course, we didn't have a baby like Tim and his wife did, who needed intensive care for months.

And of course, my husband having a heart attack, having to be flown to a hospital for surgery, recovery, etc., . .. . I realize that is pricey too.

We are both very concerned about not having insurance right now.

I just don't think that is the reason for universal healthcare. Most families healthcare bills are not catastrophic. There are other ways to deal with huge medical expenses - in my opinion.

I wouldn't go back to having a teen mind for a bazillion dollars . . . :rolleyes: I've raised two boys and one girl to adulthood and have a 7 year old. Teenagers are brain damaged. And I hated high school.

Seriously. :grn:

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Ohh now this is going to be a long post and I apologise, I don't usually write essays here but this thread has got me all passionate about our healthcare :D

Sharrie,

I really appreciate your "essay". Thanks for replying. When I say an unnecessary dependance on government, I mean that we are giving the government more money and power to make our decisions. I just believe the less government control the more liberties a society has. It is just a philosophy I believe in. (I did not mean to stay sick and let the government take care of the individual. I think both health systems strive for improved patient outcomes and keeping cost down. It is done in two different ways). What I like about hospitals as an individual business is that it creates an atmosphere of comptiveness. The hospitals will offer the best customer service, private suites, the best surgeons, and will go to great measures to attract great physicians, and to be the first to offer new and better treatments. This kind of atmophere imporves health care overall. In addition to hospitals competeing, some health insurance companies set up policies to emphasize health prevention and wellness to decrease medical cost (although to blame the physician for other peoples choices is not the best solution when trying to change behaviors). Also some businesses offer free antibiotics and 4 dollar prescriptions (no insurance needed). The business offers this low cost prescription service and in return the customer more than likely will buy groceries and other items the customer chooses to buy from the company. My point being that the private sector does a better job than the government to decrease cost. Many people will argue what about people that can't afford health care. I know the hospital I work for takes care of a lot of people that make money below the poverty line or no money at all and therefore will qualify for government aid. In addition to the government aid to the individual, the hospital receives many government grants. The big problem in the U.S. is for people who make more than poverty, and purchasing health insurance is a huge expense. Or for instance, I have many family members whom own their own business and complain all the time about the cost of purchasing health insurance. Instead of saying we should have UHC, I think it would be better to take steps to lower the cost of health insurance. One idea I have heard is to be able to purchase insurance out of the state you live in. This perhaps would increase competition between insurance companies and thus decrease cost.

As for your accident... if it were to happen in the U.S., I know where I work my employer offers short term disability. It is basically up to 6 months off with 60% of my pay and can be supplemented with my accumalted sick time and vacation time. Long term disability would have to be purchased. I guess it is a decision to pay for the disability in our taxes or choose to purchase the long term disability.

I think you are right, it is two different cultures and what works well in one country might not be the best in another.

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Specializes in ER/Ortho.

First let me say that I totally agree with the post that stated teenagers are brain damaged.....they are driving me insane. They think they know EVERYTHING. Instead of letting young girls take care of a robotic baby in home economics they need to give them a teenager for a week, and a list of things they must get the teen to do. That would cut down on teen pregnancy.

Anyway, back to the actual subject matter. My teen son recently got a job a Walmart. He is a teen so his money pays for his bills (car, cell phone, car insurance, fun money etc), but there are many adults who work there who actually have adult bills to pay. They must pay rent, electric, water, gas, food, etc for their family. My son makes $8 an hour which is only $1.45 above minimum wage. We opted out of the insurance package they offer.

It clearly states on the cover of the brochure that if you have other insurance do not cancel it because this is not a major medical policy. The employee pays something like $20 twice a month out of each check. Which doesn't sound like much, but when your only making $8 an hour it is. You then select a Dr from a list, and after a $50 deductable you only pay $15 to for each Dr. visit. There is also a $50 deductable for prescriptions, and then the employee must pay half of the cost of prescriptions. There is NO vision or dental. Here is the kicker. The max the policy will pay is $1000. When you see the Dr. if he charges $120 a visit, and you pay $15 then $105 goes toward the $1000. If you get prescriptions that total $100 then $50 goes to toward that $1000. If the Dr orders blood work, or an MRI any cost after your $15 goes toward that $1000. Once that $1000 is reached nothing else is paid, and you know longer have insurance for the rest of the year.

I am sure that if someone was in an auto accident, had a baby, required surgery, or even needed tests to diagnose something this insurance would not even start to cover the cost. Or think about the person who is a diabetic or has some other chronic illness.

I researched it, and this is the same insurance offered to Target, home depot, and starbucks employees as well as many more well known companies.

There people are not lazy they work every week.

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Specializes in ICU/Critical Care.

I read a story about a woman who had a car accident and walmart or target, one of those two, paid her medical bills which was over 400k. It was a major car accident I assume. Anyhow, the lady sued the driver and won a considerable amount of money and then was sued by her insurance company who sought reimbursement for the medical bills.

heres the link:http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/25/walmart.insurance.battle/index.html

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First let me say that I totally agree with the post that stated teenagers are brain damaged.....they are driving me insane. They think they know EVERYTHING. Instead of letting young girls take care of a robotic baby in home economics they need to give them a teenager for a week, and a list of things they must get the teen to do. That would cut down on teen pregnancy.

:yeah::yeah::yeah:

They do think they know EVERYTHING. I am so tired of getting that attitude.

When I told my daughter not to wear a revealing top and told her WHY, she said "oh mom, maybe back in the OLDEN DAYS boys did that, but none of my male friends would ever do that". :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I had her older brothers talk to her . .. :D

Still, every thing I say gets the rolling of the eyes . . .. .:icon_roll

steph

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We do have moral obligation to help those less fortunate. We all should all have the means to "pursue life, liberty, and happiness."

Given that "morale obligation" why delegate that responsibility to the government? Shouldn't each individual and community serve that function? Government programs are an impersonal solution to what should be a personal intervention.

[sarcasm] Lets just throw some money at that problem, we can make everybody pay for it. That makes it fair.[/sarcasm]

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Specializes in Acute Care Psych, DNP Student.
No, those who think the government owes them health care money might be.

I cannot afford health insurance right now. I do not think the government (the taxpayers) owe me anything.

I chose to quit my job last year - the one with benefits. My husband is self-employed.

We made the choices - we will live with the high medical bills in case something happens. In the meantime, we pay out-of-pocket for his diabetic meds and my seizure meds. I paid for my son's antibiotic for his ear infection last night - it was $45. We spend more than that on dinner out. My meds and my husband's total about $200 a month. We can do that.

If he has a heart attack . . .well, we will be paying for a long time. But he will still be treated. And we will work out a payment plan.

Not having health insurance doesn't keeps us from getting health care.

steph

Steph,

I admire your adamant intent to pay for your own medical expenses. I know what you mean, about negotiating, and cash discounts, too. I do the same with my $5000 deductible health insurance plan.

Thing is, if someone in your family gets into a really catastrophic situation - the hospital and other providers are NOT going to accept your promise to pay payments. Needed treatment would then come to an abrupt stop. (I mean for situations other than a quick in and out hospital stay.)

Once it exceeded your resources, you'd hit a brick wall and need care for you or your loved one. Remember the "Cash before Chemo" thread? Eventually, you would end up applying for medicaid so you, your husband, or your child could get the care so desperately needed. You'd be trapped, too, because private individual health insurance is not going to cover pre-existing conditions, even if you could get coverage (which you probably cannot qualify for anyway due to the pre-existing health conditions you listed above).

While the above scenario is remote, it is a very real possibility of going without health insurance. You cannot say that you will pay for all your medical expenses yourself, when you don't have insurance.

I guarantee your love for your husband and children exceeds your desire to never end up on medicaid.

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Through 46 pages of excellent conversation, the "against" side for universal health care is stemming from an unwillingness to have more taxes taken from citizens.

No, your assessment is wrong. It is more than money. It is a belief based on personal responsibility. A belief in the individual having the basic right to make their own decisions on how best to utilize the resources available to them rather then having mandates foisted upon them in the name of the greater good.

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Specializes in ER/Ortho.
I read a story about a woman who had a car accident and walmart or target, one of those two, paid her medical bills which was over 400k. It was a major car accident I assume. Anyhow, the lady sued the driver and won a considerable amount of money and then was sued by her insurance company who sought reimbursement for the medical bills.

heres the link:http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/25/walmart.insurance.battle/index.html

I had heard about that, but not read it. Thanks for the link.

It says that her accident happened 8 years ago, and I believe this "Micro" insurance that all the corporations are using is somewhat new. I am not sure how new, but within the last few years at least. If you google and do some research there is a lot of info on it. The stories I read claim that they invented "the micro insurance concept" to allow people who do not make very much the ability to at LEAST have some form of coverage. It is also very cheap or free for the employer which allows them to continue to offer coverage during these economically tough times.

The problem it will really only cover a healthy person who only gets a cold or flu once a year. Anything more than that and your up the creek.

Spideysmom,

I feel for you!!!!! I have sons, and I have heard that teen girls are even harder to deal with. I wish we could just lock them up until they reach 30 lol. Surely the brain damage will have gone away by then.

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