Does passing any of the required English proficiency tests a measure of a Filipino nurse's fluency in the English language?
I have read many of the messages posted here and to be honest and frank with everyone, I think that the quality of the English classes taught in Philippine schools has definitely deteriorated and is reflected in the way the Filipino nurses express their thoughts in English when posting their messages here.
Granted that English is a second language to the vast majority of the Filipinos, and to the Filipino nurses in particular, in the Philippines English is taught in grade school, in high school and in college. Therefore, is it fair to expect a college educated Filipino nurse to be fluent in English, or is it not?
If a Filipino nurse is not fluent in English, should that nurse be required to take remedial English classes before that nurse can be hired overseas?
What are your thoughts? Come on, don't be afraid to post your message ...in English!
i used to work in a call center before. I worked for one of the most leading mobile companies in US. I noticed that many native speakers also commit mistakes in grammar. Well, the biggest learning here is that , we should not stereotype.
If you studied here, you know for a fact that we have almost the same number of units in filipino (language) and english, yet only few seems to speak in correct, standard filipino. But this does not mean we all have to take a remedial classes in our own language. Do you see my point?
So to answer again the question "Do Filipino Nurses Need Remedial English Classes Before Going Overseas?", again my answer is case to case basis. Because we cant generalize. If you find english language so strange to you, go ahead. learn and succeed.
NURSES ARE MORETHAN CAPABLE OF LEARNING NEW SKILL. KUDOS TO ALL OF US.
Specializes in Neuro-Surgery, Med-Surg, Home Health.
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I'm not a native English speaker. I was born in the Philippines but at least I have been trying to improve my grammar. My accent has softened in my 30 years here in the U.S. but I don't make a conscious effort to sound like an American. My U.S. born kids say that my accent is much better than most of their uncles and aunts who were born in the Philippines. To paraphrase the famous TV chef, I can confidently say that my English grammar is several "notches" higher than many of my Philippine-born relatives living here in the U.S.
Yes, many Americans who were born in the U.S. don't speak grammatically correct English, but many Americans did not go to collage. In my encounters with the U.S.-born nurses, I would say that the majority of them posses good grammar. They are college graduates after all.
I have to emphasize that if you are a foreign-grad RN it is to your advantage to speak and write grammatically correct English. Don't think that because that there are Americans who don't speak English well then it would be alright for you to be like them. In the world of business, speaking and writing grammatically incorrect English is not good for your professional advancement.
I don't understand why some people oppose or are too lazy to learn how to speak and write English well. You've gone to college, you have studied nursing but your English is terrible. Do you want to have an advantage over the other 100,000 or so unemployed Filipino nurses? Arm yourself with better English grammar along with improving your professional skills.
i used to work in a call center before. I worked for one of the most leading mobile companies in US. I noticed that many native speakers also commit mistakes in grammar. Well, the biggest learning here is that , we should not stereotype.
If you studied here, you know for a fact that we have almost the same number of units in filipino (language) and english, yet only few seems to speak in correct, standard filipino. But this does not mean we all have to take a remedial classes in our own language. Do you see my point?
So to answer again the question "Do Filipino Nurses Need Remedial English Classes Before Going Overseas?", again my answer is case to case basis. Because we cant generalize. If you find english language so strange to you, go ahead. learn and succeed.
NURSES ARE MORETHAN CAPABLE OF LEARNING NEW SKILL. KUDOS TO ALL OF US.
i must say you're right with what you've said! others here are just stereotyping, which we nurses should not do. nevertheless, that remedial class is, as you said, should be case to case basis.
in the philippines they use primarily Tagal0g and "occassionally" english so you have to expect that not ALL of the filipinos are that fluent in english. but most of them know hot to write and speak in english.
one more thing, i also know a lot of natives here in canada that are poor in grammar and often misspell words.
so the bottom line is, never ever generalize because you know for a fact that it is not acceptable!
by the way, i am just happy because here in Ontario, all cultures are accepted and the natives here are very RESPECTFUL and HELPFUL to the immigrants.
It depends on the person. One cannot generalize. If she knows for a fact that she is already competent and confident, there is no use in attending remedial classes. But if you know in your heart that you need more coaching or training, then do so.
If you have passed IELTS with your required band score of 7 then you do not need a "remedial" English course.
That being said, however, if your plan is to go to the USA then you should seek out an English training center based on US sources. American English in Makati is an excellent choice for US-bound nurses since they are the only center I know of that uses all native-speaking instructors from the USA (Americans and Phil-Am).
If your plan is to go to any other English speaking country then try to seek out English training centers which have native speaking instructors from that country.
The function you will have here is to learn the subtle differences between Filipino-English and the other country's English. Grammar, intonation, etc.
However I strongly discourage focusing on accent training at this stage. The accent will come to you over time while living in the country. It is far preferable to focus on neutralizing your tone and accent by ironing out issues with grammar and pronunciation.
I have witnessed classes here where Pinoys are trying to learn "American Slang" and it is atrocious. People are being taught how to break all these grammar rules when they don't know the grammar rules in the first place.
It comes across as fake and, honestly, insulting to native speakers.
In a professional position (like nursing) it is far better to have a neutral English accent so that you can be more effectively understood.
Language training (NOT Review center) is essential for this.
I'm sorry but I know many foreign nurses (not just Filipinos) who passed the English exams, but they can't speak or write properly in the English language.
All they did was pass a basic English exam. Personally, I LOVE reading nurses notes because I get a kick out of how badly nurses chart. The majority of them have horrible English grammar and their speaking skills are bad, if not worse.
Now on the other hand I also work with foreign nurses (Filipinos included) who have excellent speaking and grammar skills in the English language. If you're going to work as a nurse in the US or any English speaking country you better learn how to get rid of your accent as much as possible and write properly or else someone is going to interpret what you're saying or writing in a different way, and that can potentially affect a patient in a negative way.
I'm sorry but I know many foreign nurses (not just Filipinos) who passed the English exams, but they can't speak or write properly in the English language.
Which is precisely why I have such a strong dislike for these IELTS review centers... most of them only teach testing skills and tips which allow people to pass IELTS without knowing a damn thing about the English language or real communication in that language.
I promote the use of English Language schools which use evaluation and training methods geared toward actually improving one's ability to communicate in English, not just pass a test.
Which is precisely why I have such a strong dislike for these IELTS review centers... most of them only teach testing skills and tips which allow people to pass IELTS without knowing a damn thing about the English language or real communication in that language.
I promote the use of English Language schools which use evaluation and training methods geared toward actually improving one's ability to communicate in English, not just pass a test.
You have never asked another person's question what do you do in the Philippines ? Sounds to me you are marketing these programs to pinoy nurses without any academic qualifications.
I believe that the exams need to be restructured. I think there should be two exams. One in the English language that's geared towards basic communication, written, and interpretation. The other geared towards nursing (or whatever degree they're planning on using) and medical use. It doesn't matter if you were educated in English, your books might have been in English, but was your instruction 100% in English? I've taken many foreign language classes, and I have to say that it was never 100% in that foriegn language with the exception of one instructor. I bet most places that used books in English didn't primarily conduct nursing in English. Also, I'm unsure about this but when you're out in the clinical environment, are you using English 100% of the time? I have a hard time believing that because I work with a lot of Filipino nurses who seems to revert back to Tagalog or Ilocano at work with each other. If they weren't speaking to non Tagalog speakers, then they were using English. So if you have a group of Filipinos together I'm sure that they're mostly speaking Tagalog and not English. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm only stating what I've observed.
I believe that the exams need to be restructured. I think there should be two exams. One in the English language that's geared towards basic communication, written, and interpretation. The other geared towards nursing (or whatever degree they're planning on using) and medical use.
That's actually a great idea and I wouldn't be opposed to it at all. However, enforcement and creation of something like that needs to be done by NCSBN; so I'd encourage you to direct the requests to them.
Along that line of though, it would be nice to see a bridging course for the USA. Australia and New Zealand have a similar idea where a foreign educated nurse is educated for up to six months (depending on the individual nurse) until he or she is considered fit for duty in Australian or New Zealand hospitals.
I think that's a great system!
It doesn't matter if you were educated in English, your books might have been in English, but was your instruction 100% in English? I've taken many foreign language classes, and I have to say that it was never 100% in that foriegn language with the exception of one instructor. I bet most places that used books in English didn't primarily conduct nursing in English.
That depends on the school.. This is why I strongly encourage English training centers which are established by native speakers and staffed by more native speakers. This way the instruction is more grounded and is 100% solid English instruction. Luckily there are several in Manila and other major cities in the Philippines. I would urge Pinoy nurses to seek them out instead of just the review centers that promise to get you high scores in IELTS through test-taking tricks.
Also, I'm unsure about this but when you're out in the clinical environment, are you using English 100% of the time?
That depends on the hospital. Some hospitals have very strict English-Only policies. Actually there are MANY offices in the Philippines which deal with transcription, call centers, or just Foreign-founded businesses which penalize employees for speaking anything but English when they are on premises.
In my wife's office, for example, they are not even permitted to speak non-English in the break-room.
I have a hard time believing that because I work with a lot of Filipino nurses who seems to revert back to Tagalog or Ilocano at work with each other. If they weren't speaking to non Tagalog speakers, then they were using English. So if you have a group of Filipinos together I'm sure that they're mostly speaking Tagalog and not English. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm only stating what I've observed.
I can't fault someone for reverting to the "home" language when they are around others that speak it.
I do the same thing here when I'm around other English speakers... there is a high level of relief that comes with speaking to someone in a way that they understand without effort and a way that you can speak without effort instead of having to alter your words and think through every sentence before you say it.
I believe that the exams need to be restructured. I think there should be two exams. One in the English language that's geared towards basic communication, written, and interpretation. The other geared towards nursing (or whatever degree they're planning on using) and medical use. It doesn't matter if you were educated in English, your books might have been in English, but was your instruction 100% in English? I've taken many foreign language classes, and I have to say that it was never 100% in that foriegn language with the exception of one instructor. I bet most places that used books in English didn't primarily conduct nursing in English. Also, I'm unsure about this but when you're out in the clinical environment, are you using English 100% of the time? I have a hard time believing that because I work with a lot of Filipino nurses who seems to revert back to Tagalog or Ilocano at work with each other. If they weren't speaking to non Tagalog speakers, then they were using English. So if you have a group of Filipinos together I'm sure that they're mostly speaking Tagalog and not English. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm only stating what I've observed.
Doctors have addressed this issue the second exam they have USMLE 2 is a clinical and the medical student has to communicate in English in person and often on the phone. I believe Canada addresses this with there Comprehensive Assessment, I thin the US needs to adopt these standards.
As a Filipino who has worked overseas, remedial english classes is a MUST. I think we need to deal with the basics first, which are grammar and pronunciation. There is no point having an American or British accent if you don't make sense. Next would be singulars and plurals, tenses and pronouns (he/she/it/they). The reason why I mentioned pronouns is because I have met and spoken to many fellow Filipinos who refer to any person, whether man or woman, as "she". This, of course, becomes very confusing, on top of the other grammatical mistakes that the person could be committing.
I would deal with the accent (if I really need to) when everything else has reached an acceptable level because, when you think about it, the accent will come naturally dependent on the country you're living in.
How, would you ask, can one deal with these issues? Unfortunately, no review centre can miraculously improve one's english on its own. There is no special pill or magic spell to make one good at speaking or writing english. It takes classes, together with practice and lots of READING. Ok, maybe you're not an avid book reader. How about newspapers written in english? Fashion magazines written in english? Reading is a part of every persons life, whether or not he or she likes to do it for fun so one should take advantage of this. Watching shows whose participants speak in english, will be helpful as well so that one can hear how words are pronounced. Speaking in english all the time, even with close friends and family, will be beneficial as well.
It truly is a shame that the Philippines, a country once known to have excellent english speakers, and its educational system has gone to the dogs. But that doesn't mean that the Filipinos should give up. It just means that we should try harder. I still believe in the Filipino and what we can do. But this can only be done if we stop rationalizing the situation, take the bull by the horns, and just do the best we can in all aspects of the task at hand.
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i used to work in a call center before. I worked for one of the most leading mobile companies in US. I noticed that many native speakers also commit mistakes in grammar. Well, the biggest learning here is that , we should not stereotype.
If you studied here, you know for a fact that we have almost the same number of units in filipino (language) and english, yet only few seems to speak in correct, standard filipino. But this does not mean we all have to take a remedial classes in our own language. Do you see my point?
So to answer again the question "Do Filipino Nurses Need Remedial English Classes Before Going Overseas?", again my answer is case to case basis. Because we cant generalize. If you find english language so strange to you, go ahead. learn and succeed.
NURSES ARE MORETHAN CAPABLE OF LEARNING NEW SKILL. KUDOS TO ALL OF US.