Do you feel the LVN/Lpn Is being left out in the nursing profession?

clive · Sep 17, 2001

Hi guys, I am an LPN who is bridging to get my RN. I love being an LPN but it seems to get anywhere you have to have your RN. I want to work in ICU and most hospitals you must be an RN. I think that LPN's are definitely left out of the loop. I think we are just as skilled as the RN's.

nur20 · Sep 21, 2001

Originally posted by Mimiboop
After taking a break-- if you want to call it that-working agency for a bit-i did not do hardly any paper work, but now that i am back-i noticed that we can no longer just take a VTO!!or from a doctor-well we do, they bend the rules i assume--i have taken orders, but it is suppose to be co-signed by the RN on duty ? please tellme what this is? iam confused? how long has this been going on? i was only away from the paperwork about 1 year and half-the RN and unit clerk was doing this paper work-i do now it the way i ALWAYS have done it--taken the order and transcibe it on the MAR or TAR-or whatever we had to do.
I am a bit confused being new on this unit at this place--orientaion was really not much of anthing!LOL
I do feel that by things likethis we are getting lower on the ladder--i agree.If anyone knows wehn or why this happened to the LPN regarding not being alloewd to take VTO please tell me--
Peace and love, Marianne
*lost my reading glassess this evening on my long term unit-sorry if type-o's!

Here we go again. They have been trying o downsize or get rid of L.P.N.'s as long as i can remember. Ladies it can't be done especially in light of the severe nurses shortage.Most R.N.'s would like administration work.They can never convince me that i'm not a valuable part of the team, if not one place, definitely another.Some places that did eliminate L.P.N.'s are reversing the decision.

nur20 · Sep 25, 2001

Originally posted by grandmanurse1
I am an LPN in Florida. I am real confused about what and why LPN's can do certain things and not others....With a 30 hour course I can start/hang IVs (even to a central line). I can determine one of my patients is in distress, call the doctor, tell him my patient is in distress and take orders from him. I can determine that this person is in distress in a facility where there are 120 patients and 3-4 LPNs working per shift (an RN is only required 8 hours a day). I can even relay the information that I feel a resident is in poor enough condition to require transfer to an acute care facility.(or in an emergency, transfer and then notify the physician). I am allowed to be a charge nurse (new law) and to supervise other staff. I am expected to help develope the plan of care for our residents. But, I can not sign a fall risk ASSESSMENT. In Florida, LPNs cannot assess. Now what do you think I did before I called the doctor or sent a resident to the hospital...sometimes it makes you wonder what people are thinking....the same group of people that say I can't assess are the very ones who would be reviewing my license if I didn't properly assess my residents. Just venting.....

WAY TO GO GIRL, THEY ARE NOT FOOLING ANYONE BUT THEMSELVES. i KNOW HOW VALUABLE YOU ARE.WE HAVE THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS,WE HAVE ADMINISTRATION ABILITY PLUS WE CAN GET DOWN AND DIRTY WITH OUR SLEEVES ROLLED UP !!!! THIS IS EXACTLY WHY THE MOVEMENT TO DISMISS L.P.N.'S HAS NEVER WORKED.AND OH BOY, WHAT ARE THEY GOING TO DO NOW WITH THE MAJOR MONEY CRUNCH AND THE SEVERE NURSES SHORTAGE.kEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!!!

**SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN** · Feb 13, 2002

Originally posted by JMP
Refering to above post:

STudy after study has shown that primary nursing care is better for the pt. and nurse.
Being "trained" to do a skill..... well just does not cut it today. You need the assessment skills and critical thinking skills that go along with the tech. skills.

Nurses today are not "trained" they are educated. This is what has changed in the last 20 years or so.

I graduated as a practical nurse in the mid 80's and today's scene demands a solid, well-rounded degree nurse.

This is, of course, my own personal opinion. It is, also, the trend today. I could be wrong, but I don't believe , from what I have seen that a shortage would change the reality.

JMP,

I have read in some of our postings where you repeatedly claim that LPNs are "Trained" & that RNs are "Educated" plus taught to "Think critically". I find that you seem to have either a bone against LPNs, even though you say that you once was one. I have to wonder; is your current attitute this way because you were treated with the same distainment by RNs while you were a LPN? :confused: Now it's your turn to turn to look down now that you're a RN?

I have been a LPN for six years and have worked in a variety of positions from working in a traditional hospital, doctors' office, LTC facility, & in the US Army Reserve. I've made steps in becoming a RN. I've enrolled in a PA BSN program & honestly can say that the difference in the "Education" at this institution is that I have other elective courses, pathophysicology, & the college level A&P has a lab. From where I stand, I have not seen anything new or different from what I've seen during my LPN Med/Surg course/clinical rotations. In fact, my course/clinical experience during LPN school out rank the course/clinical experience that I currently have now. Then I had four days clinical to the now two days of clinicals. Some of my classmates scare me because they've never had any prior clinical exposure and my school has just rush them through the program. Their main focus throughout the program has been practicing taking the NCLEX test. If you ask me, it's all about the universities & SBONs making the big bucks!!! People want to play with words: i.e. RNs assess, LPNs gather data; RNs think critically, LPNs think about; RNs suppose to anticipate, where LPNs are suppose to expect or foresee. If you ask me, it's just a play on words!

The school that I currently attend unfortunately doesn't have a LPN-BSN program but it is looking into perhaps starting one in the future; but for now, I have to go through their program as a "Generic" nursing student. I don't know about you but it's quite frustrating to say the least when you have to sit in class, as a LPN, while the rest of the students have to catch-up to your level of course/clincial experience. You can imagine my frustration when my instructor has to check off my skills on taking vital signs. Some of my clinical instructors have even asked me to assist them in showing some of my classmates how to do things; yet my LPN experience doesn't even count for anything offically. I was once told by a RN instructor at my current school that "Any baboon can be trained to be a LPN"; but I'm sure she wouldn't appreciate a MD saying "Any baboon can be educated to be a RN". See my point? :imbar

By the way, Doctors are "Trained" in their field of specialty; just try to tell them that they're not "Educated" O.K. :rolleyes:

Do you hear such squabbling between MDs, DOs, & PAs? NO....because they all belong to the AMA and stand united against us nurses. Why do you think they can get things done for them politically. :cool:

I just would appreiciate it if you would be a little more sensitive with your choice of wording when it comes to criticizing or voicing your opion about us LPNs because it does sound like you're looking down.:).....Thank You:D

auntmimi57 · Feb 13, 2002

ooooooooooooooooooooooo

GreytNurse · Feb 13, 2002

Nursipooh....I agree with you 100000000% in regards to your comments to JMP......What's up with JMP??:roll

Educated.......Taught........Some of the 'educated' RN's I've worked with the past 23 years......most of them should have been 'taught' because they don't know what the hell their doing!

The same courses are being 'taught' in LPN classes as the one's RN's are 'educated' in.......been there, done that.......doing it now. No difference......Nadda......Zip......Bingo!! :cool:

Makes you wonder what 'cosmic' episode happens to a person the nanosecond they put 'RN' behind their name????? They want respect because their 'EDUCATED'????? For me, RN stands for 'Respect??? NO'......

Get rid/phase out LPN's........:roll I'm laughing here!!! Who would staff the Nursing homes???????? Who would staff the Home Health??????

We can't do assesments?????? Oh right! We don't have critical thinking skills????? HA HA HA.......

JMP.....get another beer from the fridge and gather a dose of reality..........

Furball · Feb 13, 2002

Originally posted by sharonpu
Hi!
I'm an LPN in the North Eastern section of NY. We are seven miles from the Vt. border.
I have been working in Long term care facilities for two years now. From what I can see, the LPN's are running these facilities in both states. Except...we need and RN to pronounce a death. Can you imagine??? Like we can't tell if they are dead ourselves. I work side by side with RN's where I currently work, in Vermnnt. They do the same work as we LPN's do, of course, for more pay. We have a good working relationship with them also. Every nurse in our facility is trained to start IV's. So, I have to say, we are pretty lucky LPN's in Vermont. My pay is currently $16.45/hr.

HEEEEY Whitehall! Hello from Washington county! :roll

Paprikat · Feb 14, 2002

I am usually a non-confrontational person, but some of the above comments angered me. I was NOT trained, I was EDUCATED! I am "just" an LPN, working in BC. I COULD have worked in a hospital, as BC does employ them, in both medical and surgical floors, but why would I? I would probably have to deal with RN's with bad attitudes, like I did in nursing school, who felt LPN's are 'trained', not educated and just plain garbage. Many acute care RN's did not want to "deal" with us. I fought long and hard to get where I am today, through an abusive relationship and lots of crap, as many of us here have and am proud to call myself an LPN. Sure, I would LOVE to get my RN, but I just can't afford it right now. I work in LTC and am a valuable part of the team. I am a charge nurse and I feel that I am a competent, caring nurse. I think that sure, an RN has alot more of a knowlegde base than I do but we are all NURSES! If I was an RN, I would remember what it was LIKE to be an LPN and show a little more courtesy to other LPN's!

Paprikat · Feb 14, 2002

I just also think that this is the LPN corner, it's great that RN's want to post and read, because most RN's have valueable and positive things to say to us LPN's as I do in say, in student nursing, even though I am not a student nurse anymore, but I don't think it is very nice for people to come in here and put LPN's and our profession down. Sorry to rant and rave, but I am REALLY irritated now. It's some people's attitudes here that are disgraceful and it is why LPN's will probably never be recognized for their skills and talents. I am proud to work in LTC, old folks are patients too and I bring alot of joy to many lonely seniors.

It would be akin to me saying a care aide is trash and crap, uneducated and useless, which is not how I feel, they are valueable to me as a nurse and I respect them for who they are and what they do, and I will NEVER look down on them. LPN's are people with feelings, too!!!!!

Sorry for the rant session! I feel much better now....until I read another post about us "useless, trained" LPN's!!!!!!

**SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN** · Feb 14, 2002

Originally posted by Paprikat
I am usually a non-confrontational person, but some of the above comments angered me. I was NOT trained, I was EDUCATED! I am "just" an LPN, working in BC. I COULD have worked in a hospital, as BC does employ them, in both medical and surgical floors, but why would I? I would probably have to deal with RN's with bad attitudes, like I did in nursing school, who felt LPN's are 'trained', not educated and just plain garbage. Many acute care RN's did not want to "deal" with us. I fought long and hard to get where I am today, through an abusive relationship and lots of crap, as many of us here have and am proud to call myself an LPN. Sure, I would LOVE to get my RN, but I just can't afford it right now. I work in LTC and am a valuable part of the team. I am a charge nurse and I feel that I am a competent, caring nurse. I think that sure, an RN has alot more of a knowlegde base than I do but we are all NURSES! If I was an RN, I would remember what it was LIKE to be an LPN and show a little more courtesy to other LPN's!

Dear Paprikat,

My point exactly;) Just because I'm going for my RN-BSN doesn't give me the right to look down on RNs-ADN, RNs-Diploma, LPNs, or CNAs. As far as I'm concerned, I will always be a LPN at heart:D I just hate it when I see other people do this. It's bad enough to see someone who was never a LPN and have started-out being a RN to put us down (this is probably due to not being in our shoes inaddition to being taught this concept in school); but I have no patience for those who were LPNs and then move-on with this type of attitude:(

Love-A-Nurse · Feb 15, 2002

I have encounter the nurses who think that the LPN or RN etc., behind their name makes the nurse.

There is no debate necessary between RNs and LPNs of who knows more, or to understand the physiology of and not just the administerig of meds, or the education that is/should be given to our patients, and etc., because we know that both learned from a very different perspective. Each of us obtained knowledge and learned our skills differently in order to set for different Boards.

The things that bothers me is, what are we each doing in the smallest of ways to render quality and continunity of care to our residents and patients?

Are we so caught up in ourselves that we aren't aware that our "fighting" of different attitudes and thinking (opinions too) are taken to and from the job and our patients get the bad end of our (she/he is the LPN and she/he is the Rn and so forth).

We are counter-parts of each other.

Although with the uderstanding, in some areas, the RN does all of the care, meds, education, care planning, etc.

There are many areas that have to and or do use the CNA (there are reason for this) LPN (we have our roles) and RN (you (and soon me) have your roles too.

It makes me sad when the question is asked who are RNs and LPNs and those have the need to say,

Joe/Sue Blow, BSN, RN, and all the other titles that you may have. This is good but why do you have to announce this,

The question is simply are you an RN or LPN

This to me says, I am better, I am here only for the extra identity. You know depending on the needs of the patient, who cares unless specifically asked. If it made a significant difference (titles), it would be mandated to have them included on your name badge etc. If this is so, please excuse me.

My fellow nurses,

We are all real people with feelings, then we are:

If you are an RN, you too have to know and or do CNA work and LPN work in order to deal with supervision and their limitations.

LPN, we must understand the CNA and their work in order to supervise them and know their limitations and though many of us may know how to do, somethings an RN does, we can't because our scope of pactice says NO.

CNAs, you are the "back bone, but are not licecsed and wih this, you have to remember where to draw the line in your schooling abilities. You should report to us with the first seeing of abnormalities and the other daily care you provide for this brings the LPN/RN into doing their sworn duties.

We are a team and this equals UNITY!

No ome should shine except the PATIENT!

I am and have been proud to be an LPN for over 10 years, a CNA prior and will be an RN, however, I will always be a human being.

I leave you with this, I can just imagine how some of us are at work just how we respond with words here. Everyone has the right to his/her opinions and their facts but no one should delight in blithering others.

I do thank you for listening.

Paprikat · Feb 15, 2002

Amen, sister!!!! Perfectly put!

Thanks,

Paprikat:D